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Who's Calling the Shots Now: The Death of American Empire

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posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 06:14 AM
I hate to tell some of the folks on the thread who are hopeful of the decline of the US and those who predict it as well. Ain't going to happen. The US is in no way in worse shape than we were during the Carter years, where our spirit was eroded by the left and the useless peanut farmer. Prediction - we will dump Obama in 4 years and will move to an conservative, proud and positive leader.

Where is any serious challenge to the US going to come from? The EU is close on a defunct entity. Half of the states are broke, debt to GDP ratios over 80%. The US debt is way too high, but based on our potential output could be retired within 10 years with reasonable economic policy. There is better chance of the EU disolving within 10 years. It is an artificial construct and an common currency is doomed to fail in a scenario where some countries have relatively no adverse impact to disasterous economic policy. Greece has zero incentive to act responsibily since the rest of the states prop up the Euro and their currency does not suffer their foolish policy decisions. Other members of the EU are right behind them as the EU is essentially an macro-economic welfare state.

China is a disaster. Their economic might being artificially maintained by currency manipulation and the use of essentially slave labor. Sure, they are growing, but it is artificial. They are an absolute environmental disaster, which means in practical terms, 400x the incidents of various cancers than anywhere else in the world. Their population is largely uneducated and ruled by an iron fist. The Chinese society is not sustainable under thecurrent structure. What you read about China is what the MSM wants you to read. Have you read the little bit about the new raids into neighboring country's kidnapping women to sell into slavery which is a direct resullt of their forced aborting of millions of girls?

The US is strong. Our birth rate is high, our culture has some significant issues that need to be worked on, but, sorry folks, we ain't going away.

As far as the military bit goes (and the rest of his post as wel), I agree with Huckfinn, 100%.

posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 10:47 PM
Originally posted by huckfinn

a poster who referred to Americans as a “nation of children”. I agreed

Thanks for direct reply, and explanation. I appreciate that. Never saw the poster myself. But there's something to it, that's accurate.

directed at all those people that are convinced that America needs to apologize for or change its behavior. I am not going to apologiz

I agree about not apologizing too much, but who knows-maybe a little change in foreign policy could be a good thing, huh?

using America as cover to rob the world...I get upset and need to get things off my chest.

I hear ya! ATS is a pretty good place to get things out.
Someone sure has! But what group? Zionists? Illuminati? NWO types?

posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 11:19 PM
reply to post by FRIGHTENER

If they undertake a new age Pearl Harbor attack, then Obama & His Henchmen may follow Roosevelt's apparent welcome of the attacks as a reason for punishing China by holding them back from ever becoming a stronger superpower than the US.

Roosevelt apparently knew that the Japanese were on their way to Pearl Harbor but saw it as a perfect solution to bringing the US into WWII, as the CFR was primarily interested in using WWII as a reason for world government with the US as the sole superpower (hence all the smart European brains that entered the US following WWII including nazi war criminals that escaped the Nuremberg Trials).

Nowadays China is threatening America's position as superpower, which the Obama administration will most expectedly do their utmost best in preventing (starting with Sudan - China's oil supplier and ally).

As Obama mentioned during his campaign, he would bring America back as the sole superpower. However, what does it entail for America to return to the position of sole superpower? WWIII? The US has reached Pakistan, which is China's neighbor. What's the next move?

posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 11:43 PM
reply to post by MightyAl

Welcome to the thread, MightyAl, Star for your thoughts!
And welcome to ATS!
Glad you made your second post here yet, on ATS!

So many ways of looking at this massive debt thing with China, aren't there?
I see you're a strategist of sort...interpreting Obama's current moves and future moves. Very good. I hadn't seen that angle.

Personally, I see the word superpower they use as somewhat;;; I don't know- some what . . .arrogant? (if that's the word I'm looking for), but I guess I'd rather have that, than 'developing nation'!

All I know, is our military is mighty, and most always factors into any other nation's decision-making process!

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 12:19 AM
Well as Robert Anton Wilson stated in Prometheus rising... Wealth keeps moving westward...

So who's next, after China?

The thing is though, China cannot survive without our consumerism.

It's not like they have us over a barrel or anything...

They stop funding us, we stop buying...

You think that 20 million in China layoffs since last Sept were bad... just wait until no one is buying their stuff...

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 12:51 AM
reply to post by huckfinn

I can't believe you're actually calling millions of deaths theater.
Perhaps it's just not real enough because someone isn't being blown up right beside you, but WE have a responsibility as citizens of this country to act if our government spirals out of control, much like it has been doing for the past decade or so! We've already killed a million Iraqis for what amounts to nothing, and that doesn't bother you? Our own government is tearing our Constitution to shreds and wiping their a**es with it. They are taking our rights away!!! Billions of the dollars just given to the banks and AIG have ended up going OVERSEAS in case you haven't heard....OUR taxpayer money. We openly fund a terrorist nation in Israel. The collapse being orchestrated is coming from within our own government, and the banks and corporations that apparently play a major role in our government. Globalists are taking the whole global market down, including the US.....but we let this happen. So yes, I personally apologize to all of those abroad who have been affected by the actions of my country. Apparently most of us are too lazy or too selfish to care what is going on, EVEN AT THIS POINT!

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 12:58 AM
reply to post by dolphinfan

I can't believe you really feel that way.
The average American is being sold out. Perhaps our country will be around much longer than some people think, but at what cost?? What will our nation look like after this is all over?
And with the G20 meeting, and the possibility of a global currency, global economic control etc.....Where does that leave our nation as far as sovereignty goes?
I'm sorry, but I am sick of giving up our rights.
They are limiting them everyday, just as the Constitution was supposed to limit the powers of federal government. States are posturing up and declaring state sovereignty, New Hampshire for example even threatening seccession.

Everything is not exactly OKEY DOKEY here at the moment.

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 02:02 AM
reply to post by mpriebe81

I agree with you 100% that there are troubling trends in this country, with the over-reaching of the state among the top of the list. My point here is several-fold.

Despite the self-induced difficulties we are currently in, which are due to an increasing number of American's being lazy and wanting a hand-out from the government, the basic social structures in the US are strong. Most are patriotic, most have at least a back of an envelope understanding of civics, our birth rate continues to be strong, our productivity is the highest in the world (despite great freedom in working choices), we are the most innovative country in the world, by every measure, our military is the strongest in the world, and despite what some of the conspiracy folks might suggest, we are probably the most transparent nation in the world. I could go on.

The point being that while we have problems, there is no nation close to having the assets we have and I simply can't see China or any other country battling the US for global leadership, at least not at the moment.

Do we have corruption? You bet. Other places have far more. Do we have education problems, you bet. Over 50% of Chinese are illiterate. Do we have infrastructure problems, you bet. China does not have potable water for its citizens. I could go on and that is China, an up and coming power and the nation most folks are the most concerned about.

Our most recent election was case in point. Obama was not some selected front man for the NWO. He was the right candidate at the right time for the majority of Americans. I did not think he was the best candidate, and I think that his numerous mistakes being made now do validate folks who also thought he was not ready for prime time. The fact of the matter is that he and the Democrats built a better mousetrap this time around.

I will be the first to say that our government does not serve the people to the degree they should. I will also say that the culture of corruption in Washington and Washington's tilt to corporations and special interests is very troubling. All I am saying in these posts is that despite our problems, we have not only fewer problems than anyone else, but that our foundations are stronger than most other countrys.

The folks who suggest that the US become "more humble" strike me as immature and petty. Despite what other countries might say about us, should they get into a serious jam, their first call is not to the UN, its not to some global NGO, its to 1600 Penn. Avenue and the fact is that when that call comes in, not only are we ready to assist, we have already planned ways to provide that assistance.

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 02:09 AM
reply to post by dolphinfan

Let me respond to you with a semi-quote that 1 of the members has as his


I say semi because , havent seen it in awhile but the gest of it was

"The last ting a failing Empire does, Is Rob the Treasury"

think that through

my bad to the member as i know its not a complete direct quote

[edit on 20-3-2009 by Seany]

[edit on 20-3-2009 by Seany]

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 02:46 AM
reply to post by Seany

The financial situation of the US is indeed a disaster, but I first, don't buy the whole empire bit. I see the US as simply the strongest country in the world. We've never been a a country bent towards expansion. The other thing to consider is that the historical construct of empire is dated. Nation states are one thing, muti-national corporations are something that did not exist in the times of past "empires". What we have in many cases are private enterprises who exert global influence. The US certainly aids and assists those enterprises, but to the extent that they fail they will be replaced by others. Is IBM or Microsoft a US company? Not really. They are global actors and get a ton of juice from other countries along with the US. IBM Europe is a European entity and juices the politicians over here to serve their own interests. The countries in the EU in kind juice IBM Europe. In the realm of a global economy with multi-national/global corporate interests, the historical construct of the nation state is no longer valid. In many cases, "US" companys are far more important to other countries than the US. For example, either the GAP or Levis could bring down the entire nation of Cambodia if they decided to source their textiles from another country. Those companys have more practical influence in that case than does the US military. If they decide to source elsewhere, that is it and there is nothing really that anyone can do about it. Engagement on the part of a government entity will surely bring a UN response. Its a different deal today.

Will the US suffer a decline as a consequence of the current situation? Yes. What I'm suggesting that while we will decline, the rest of the world is also declining and in many cases more rapidly. We also have stronger fundamentals than other countries. I'm not anxious to join a race to the bottom, but to the extent that their is a global race to the bottom, the US will still be at the top of the heap.

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 09:15 AM
Excert from Economist Article

Already a big idea has spread far beyond China: that geopolitics is now a bipolar affair, with America and China the only two that matter. Thus in London next month the real business will not be the G20 meeting but the “G2” summit between Presidents Barack Obama and Hu Jintao. This not only worries the Europeans, who, having got rid of George Bush’s unipolar politics, have no wish to see it replaced by a Pacific duopoly, and the Japanese, who have long been paranoid about their rivals in Asia. It also seems to be having an effect in Washington, where Congress’s fascination with America’s nearest rival risks acquiring a protectionist edge.

I stole the above paragraph from the article I was reading at and it sums up the new and quickly emerging future that cannot be stopped.

It only becomes freightening once you realize and accept the profound subtle reality that this union represents. Then you'll understand why the Religions have plunged the world into war.

For me personally this new world is acceptable.

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 09:38 AM
reply to post by mpriebe81

You should save your disgust for someone else. I call it Theater because that is what I see and I trust my own eyes and no other. In another thread, I proposed to show that the so-called Iraq War was nothing more than an ancient ritual based on the Sumerian classic...Epic of Gilgamesh.

In my twisted way of viewing reality I see Saddam Hussein as the real producer and director of that war and not George Bush; who was but the character Shamhat, the temple prostitute.

In a world where global conquest is a viewed as a possible outcome, sacrificing millions of ones own people is apparently a small price to pay; especially if responsibility for their deaths can be attributed to someone else.

Enkidu's nature would be anger by what happened in Iraq, unfortunately his desire to save lives is the bait used to capture him. Therefore, Enkidu must accept the deaths or ultimately he will be responsible for even more deaths.

War is Theater, those people have agreed to participate in it. Fortunately for you the American extricated himself from their Satanic opera in time to save this country, for what you saw happen in Iraq was supposed to happen here. About this, have no doubt.

As far as America's problems...I don't view them as problems, but evolution of the system. The changes you state were occuring all across the country should be greeted with tea and sweet pastries.

[edit on 20-3-2009 by huckfinn]

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 09:45 AM
reply to post by FRIGHTENER

I don't know what to name them...I just know they involve one Prositute, one Pimp and at least one Dog.

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 03:12 PM
Originally posted by HunkaHunka

China cannot survive without our consumerism.

And with my dollar going further at Wal-Mart than most any other store, I
feel guilty.

Great simplification there, Hunka!

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 03:16 PM
reply to post by Seany

A big welcome to ATS, Seany! Star!

"Robbing the tresury". . .that was good!
Feels like that's exactly what's been going on lately in our country.

posted on Mar, 20 2009 @ 03:22 PM
reply to post by huckfinn

Excellent article you provided, Huck, STAR!
I read it once, a little speedy. . .I'm going to click it again later tonight, and go through it thouroughly. Great stuff, thank-you.

As for the names, howabout 'Jezebel' for the prostitute; 'Spider' for the pimp; and 'Lucifer' for the pit-bull?

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