I havn't heard your link yet, but I agree that indeed some folks are just born that way.

I knew at about 10 that I was more attracted to the older girls with curves rather than the skinny ones my age , but I didn't have any idea why at the time - so yes I do think it's mostly genetic.

We are all born with genetic defects and I think that's just one of the possible ones you can have. I also believe it's possible that some just make that decision based on their experiences during their early life.

You are right jungle jake, I was raised by my mother and feel a similar way to yourself. thanks for the information .

I listened to most of this yesterday. It makes sense that a boy would 'walk off the beaten path' because of an absent male figure. I know one other male that may have been affected in this same way. Homosexuality is not something that I feel should be 'corrected', but I suppose in some cases it could have been prevented.

Doesn't hold up... otherwise, homosexuals would be almost exclusively Black (since the 1940's there has been a problem in the community. Most young men are raised by their mothers with father figures being absent or ineffective.)

While you might be able to modify someone's tastes somewhat if they're bisexual, changing the sexual orientation of someone is almost impossible. I can't think of any amount of programming that would change me from being heterosexual to being homosexual.

Likewise, there's no amount of programming that will change a homosexual to heterosexual.

I know it's not to the tastes of most, but reading the Reverend Mel White's biography was an eye-opener. He was a speechwriter and ghostwriter for many famous evangelists and for 20+ years tried everything to change his sexual orientation, including electroshock therapy.

It was sad to read how hard he struggled to become "normal" and it didn't work -- any more than the same procedues would have worked on a heterosexual.

I don't think it's something that really has to be corrected. The people who are born that way, were you to correct them, would live miserable lives, never really feeling they're walking their own path. To quote Phillip J. Fry's supposed grandfather, Enis, "Did you ever get the feeling you were attracted to girls cause you're supposta?"

However, the opposite could also be true. The media has been a strange beast as of late. In some ways, it condemns the lifestyle, and in others, glorifies it. Some people may decide to try this lifestyle they learned about on the tv because they were jilted by a bad relationship in the past. Even though they were born heterosexual, they were corrected by circumstance and the media.

This is still something I'm milling about in my mind, what role I should/could play, if any, in these situations. I wanted to open a discussion here so I could get differing viewpoints. If anyone who is gay would put in their two cents, I would really appreciate it!

EDIT: Part 2 of the interview should be on that link, now. I haven't listened to it, didn't wake up on time, but will be later today.

[Edited on 4-20-2004 by junglejake]

I'm writing this as a gay teenager:

Both sides are true.

Some are definetely born that way (as i am), and alot of the gay people i know wish that they were straight so they would have a simpler life....so if it was a concious decision why would they wish that?

Then there are others who are basically bisexual, the ones that are just so horny that they will take anything, and thats what makes heterosexuals believe that being gay is just a 'hobby' or something...

I guess people really wont understand unless they were themselves gay.

I too feel that many that a re gay are just born that way. When my kids were growing up, and their friends would come over to play..I knew which ones were going to be gay...and they are. The things is though, whether they are born that way or not...doesn't matter. It's their life, their business.

i myself would be what many would consider bisexual. is it because i saw gay people on tv and thought it was cool, hell no. since i was a kid i've had alot of girlish characteristics and have also had attractions to other men and this was all long before i even knew homosexuality existed. so i know from my own personal experience that homosexuality is not some sort of choice. not to mention i have many queer friends that have gone through similar experiences. not to mention there is alot of homophobia out in the world (thankfully america is more accepting of homosexuality nowadays but it still exists) and most people wouldn't choose to be gay out of not wanting to be some sort of outcast in society. the reason why homophobia exists is because people refuse to see the world through the eyes of anybody but themselves and draw thier own conclusions without opening thier minds to other ideas. that and the fact that some people believe the bible should be taken litterally. yet the funny thing is the very same people will reject other parts of the bible (i have yet to meet one person that takes every word of the bible litterally. and if there are, they are probally toatal shut ins from society or are probally in jail). so alot of people are just using the whole bible excuse as a means to justify thier own personal homophobic intentions.

Originally posted by Byrd
Doesn't hold up... otherwise, homosexuals would be almost exclusively

I agree with you.

I believe that with all the research I have developed myself that it really needs to be looked at case by case. For instance, there are some homosexuals that swear they would never be with a woman, but yet at some point their partner becomes a woman - hmmm. Some that I believe are born with the same sexual charactaristics as a woman, etc.

I think it takes only a small event in the early childhood of an individual to "push" them into the direction of homosexuality. It could be a big devestating event but just as likely be something subtle that nobody would really think about. Sexuality is a very tricky thing like that.

I think that genetics & possibly the amount of a certain sex hormone sent to the developing fetus can play a part, too. But there really isn't a lot of dialogue about outside factors playing a role as the child is brought up--I guess that's because it feeds into hate-mongers who want to see gay people "reprogrammed" into straight people. It's like in the old days where they would force left-handed children to write with their right hand, because left-handedness was considered "sinister" -- I mean, it's just stupid, let people live their lives!

I have a friend who I thought for sure was 100% born gay. I talked to her one day and she told me how she had a boyfriend early on in junior high & he really hurt her bad & broke her heart & soon after she realized she was a lesbian. Obviously, there was another factor going on in her decision, but it's taboo to even mention something like that, so I didn't. But she's happy now and time marches on so who cares?

In my opinion you may be born gay by having a chemical imbalance in the brain. Or your mind may be perverted so thats what your mind views as pleaseureable.

Originally posted by Fitzpatrick
In my opinion you may be born gay by having a chemical imbalance in the brain. Or your mind may be perverted so thats what your mind views as pleaseureable.

I think it is very possible to be born with a chemical imbalance; your brain is a very powerful tool, certain changes can effect your senses, what you see/perceive, etc.

Some observations about bad childhood experiences, children growing up without male influence, etc. are just not founded to be accurate sustainable causes for homosexuality, but neither are imbalance theories. I still think it has to be taken on a case by case basis.

I think, homosexuality is being learnt, and if someone is too lazy to cooperate with ladies in the term of sex, he will find it easy to cathc a man from behind.

I really don't wanna know, what do gays like in each other...

Originally posted by Istvan
I think, homosexuality is being learnt, and if someone is too lazy to cooperate with ladies in the term of sex, he will find it easy to cathc a man from behind.

I really don't wanna know, what do gays like in each other...

LOL SO your saying someone is too "lazy" to go after what they attracted to? What a ridiculous, non thought out assumption.....You can not be taught homosexuality, you are attracted to what attracts you...I've heard it all

Lady V it is not a ridiculous assumption i have seen it happen, on TV lol.

This guy said he had sexual relations with men but classed himself as straight . He said he did this because he dident have to try with men and dident know hoiw to get women to like him and wasnt confident enough to try.

Welll, Fitzpatrick, there's probably a few out there like that... but not many. It's actually harder finding a same-sex relationship. And "I saw it on tv" probably isn't good enough proof for anyone. Heck, you can see a lot of stupid things on tv.

Another argument against the "evil mother" concept is that it would suggest that the son of EVERY woman who's an engineer/computer scientist/scholar/doctor/lawyer/politicial/CEO/etc, etc, will turn out gay.

We're a whole boatload short of that mark, thank you.

Scientific data supports both positions - that homosexuality is and is not a choice - but only up to a point. Briefly here are the two positions:

(1) "Homosexuality is not a choice." Consider that SOME people are born hermaphrodites, physically half-man, half-woman. No one has a choice to be a half-gender. Similarly, physiological and neurological/brain anomolies vary in degrees. In other words, although a human organism might not be so severe as to be a hermaphrodite, certain brain and neuro functions of a body appearing to be male may also carry sufficient anomolies as to make the male find attraction to other males;

(2) "Homosexuality is a choice." This statement is equally true, at least for most. The simplest argument is unarguable. Anyone can tell you where males (who choose homosexuality) live: prisons.

Similarly, most high school students who notice certain girls who experiment with lesbianism in high school are known as "LUG's" (meaning "Lesbian Until Graduation." Most of these girls are involved in short term lesbian-like relationships, then drop it as they move out of public school environment into the real world.

These are two examples of people who "choose" homosexuality. (Remember the female movie star formerly in a relationship with the famous lesbian comediene? She is now married in a heterosexual relationship.)

Hope that helps the discussion.

RWO, MS-M www.onealclan.com

Originally posted by Fitzpatrick
Lady V it is not a ridiculous assumption i have seen it happen, on TV lol.

This guy said he had sexual relations with men but classed himself as straight . He said he did this because he dident have to try with men and dident know hoiw to get women to like him and wasnt confident enough to try.

Please tell me your not talking about Jerry Springer

The Greeks believed that before time we were all born with 4 arms and legs and we moved by spinning in a cartwheel.

The Gods got cheesed at us for our behavior so they split us in to 2.

We have spent the rest of our history trying to find that person we were split from, man or woman.

I guess we will always be researching.