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Obama is too Socialist for Europe’s taste!

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posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 01:18 PM
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Europe's Economic-Stimulus Message: Enough Already!





President Barack Obama this week urged the world's top economies to adopt aggressive, America-sized spending programs. "It's very important to make sure that other countries are moving in the same direction, because the global economy is all tied together," he said.

But on the other side of the Atlantic, European Union governments have spurned entreaties to let funds flow into their staggering economies. "Europe has done what it needed to do," says Luxembourg Prime Minister Jean-Claude Juncker, who is also chairman of the 16-member euro zone, adding that the U.S.'s appeals "were not to our liking."


Time Mag

Wow, isn't it funny how even France is saying Obama's redistribution the wealth and economic packages is way over the top for them?

America is now the top socialist country in the world…congratulations!!!




posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 01:25 PM
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Are we mixing nationalization with socialism again ?

I lived in so-called socialistic country. USA - not EVEN close...

If you have ANY questions about socialism, please feel free to ask



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 01:45 PM
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reply to post by 5thElement
 


Well as far as the USA being a socialist country at the moment, I think that is very untrue.

However, I also think that people's idea of socialism is also very flawed.

Obama is potentially turning the country into a very big government controlled state, where Human Rights and the Constitution no longer apply with the simple words of "enemy-combatant".

The policies and rhetoric that have been adopted since his inauguration have vastly changed from the type of rhetorice and policies promised during his campaign.

Now granted, he's only been in office a few months, and it is somewhat too soon to start making judgements against his capility of running the country. But after having watched Alex Jones' new film over this past week, it does raise some serious questions about what kind of plan he has for the country, or if he even knows he's being used by some of the higher powers in order to move their agenda.

Remember, socialism is not the wanted outcome here, what the PTP want is much more grave and far more dangerous than mear socialism. People need to start waking up to the fact that even if there are alot of people with their hands in the cookie jar, we need to look at the people giving them the cookies.

~Keeper



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 02:28 PM
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yeah liberals and the politically correct terms cant say "terrorists" they dont wanna piss off the extremists cant say "enemy combatant" dont wanna piss off the extreme far left.

the path this country is headed on right now and its been given a gigantic push socialism you cannot say we arent when newsweek has headlines line "we are all socialists now"

we can see right now what that path leads too- look at chavez, hes owns everything now that theres no more money left he is stealing foreign business interests...

you cant take away from the rich to make someone else rich-theres not enough money in the world for that.

you cant make someone stupid smart

class warfare,ridiculous spending that we dont have the money for when you have an enormous amount of social programs to cannot tax the rich enough to pay for all those and what you end up with is a bunch of half ass programs that dont serve the benefit of anyone. it essentially becomes the governments version of rob peter to pay paul.

when he is gonna tax the rich and take away money from people who have busted their butts and lower their quality of life that they earned.

and give that money to some "deadbeat:" who wont get off their butts and do something themselves about their situations-thats not fair to anyone

if you have payed attention to an news lately the rich have lost half of their wealth which means they arent making as much which means they arent being taxed as much which means that tax burden will fall on you and me.

the problem with social programs ie socialism is sooner or later you run out of other poeoples money.

socialism is not what this country was founded on and this crap going on today needs to be stopped now.

its time we actually got back to the roots of the founding fathers ideals.



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 02:51 PM
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reply to post by Xtrozero
 


I honestly think it's a case of Europe (mainland) not wanting to buy into the US and UK's strategy for ending the recession/depression.

Various EU leaders have already condemned Gordon Brown for some of his actions.

There is also the FACT that those 2 countries are in a mess of their own making.

And quite rightly, Europe (mainland) wants no part of their supposed solutions, which would be maintaining a staus quo which got us in this mess in the first place.



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 02:56 PM
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Originally posted by Xtrozero
Wow, isn't it funny how even France is saying Obama's redistribution the wealth and economic packages is way over the top for them?

America is now the top socialist country in the world…congratulations!!!


This is nonsense. You don't seem to understand what socialist actually is. What your politicians call socialist is EXTREMELY LIGHT SOCIALISM.. barely existent.. its a way of promoting capitalism without leaving the disadvantaged behind.

What the US media calls socialist.. ie France.. is not actually socialist. Social policies do not make a country socialist. Its just another stupid US MSM thing that promotes corrupted uber capitalism and the chasing of money through means that are degrading to less fortunate.

The EU countries do not need to throw trillions of Euro's of freshly printed money into economies that don't need it. The main EU country that needs this is the UK.. and the UK can do this no problem.. and has done.

The US needed this.. Actual toxic assets that leads back to US corporations from around the world completely dwarfs that of Eurozone countries. While possible toxic assets in EU banks are massive.. property prices have not collapsed in the same way so they are not toxic. Also.. the Eurozone hasn't needed to create any new fiat money for this crises so the EURO hasn't been diluted.. If we were to do so what Obama is asking, it would do us no good.

Remember.. as long as the dollar is the worlds reserve on paper.. money creation is no object... for now.

The EURO is an extremely strong currency but as it not a reserve.. it can be easily devalued if the ECB hits the printing press.



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 03:18 PM
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taking money away from someone who works for their money and gives it to someone too lazy to work is socialism.


either way most people in this country want to keep distance from socialism.

i dont get why people get so defensive at the word socialism.


[edit on 14-3-2009 by neo67]



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 03:55 PM
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Originally posted by neo67
taking money away from someone who works for their money and gives it to someone too lazy to work is socialism.




So what is taking money away from someone who works for their money and giving it to a corporation that has bankrupted itself out of bad management or corruption?



The only reason why people in your country want to keep away from what you deem to be "European socialism" is because its been portrayed as communist.

Our "Socialist" countries invest in their populations and give even those at the bottom end a chance at a high standard of living in return for a slightly higher tax rate for everyone.. this rate is your 'social insurance'. The reason for this is because NOT EVERYONE CAN GET A JOB ALL THE TIME.. thats a fact of life. If they think you are not looking for work or trying to scrounge the system.. they will make you pay it all back.

Its not a bad idea.. its a capital investment. You are given every opportunity to make as much as you can and you pay it back.

When you break it down.. its almost the exact same as an evolved "American Dream" that has run out of opportunities for everyone. European countries went through the uber capitalist systems hundreds of years ago.. this is what works for us now.

I know its hard for Americans to understand but the idea behind life not all about making more and more money.

[edit on 14/3/09 by Dermo]



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 04:40 PM
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dude whatever

there is a big difference between giving a handout and helping someone to help themselves.

i am talking about people who milk the system and they do milk the system.

not everyone can get a job? bs how bout stop outsourcing how about the us government give tax breaks to corporations to enable them to stay in this country

there are only 3 kinds of people who need government assistance:
the children, elderly and those whose health makes it impossible to work.
not the likes of octamom and getting pregnant so they dont have to work.
unemployment benefits? theres a joke people have the mindset i dont have to work until that runs out but what do they do they extend it
those kinds of government programs are designed to keep people down.

and if you break it down ITS A VERY BAD IDEA.

"higher tax rate for everyone" the government is taking the quality of life from everyone cause the more social programs we have the worse funding everything has it puts people in a worse situation.

and they way they are spending our money now the taxes will never stop. til everyone will be equally in dire situations.


people need to lay off corporate corruption they are not all greedy bastards
your talking about a small percentage.

hell every profession has its share of corruption, its not like we dont have greedy poliiticians,police,judges,lawyers, you are doing a diservice to them cause 99% of those people are honest and hard working and deserving of our resepct.

you have no idea how hard those people everyone acts like everyone justs throws money at them, and they are all automatically "rich" when yes some are most arent.

if your living in a foreign country commenting on us politics-stop

[edit on 14-3-2009 by neo67]



[edit on 14-3-2009 by neo67]



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 04:54 PM
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reply to post by Dermo
 



DERMO, I have been posting on these boards for awhile so im gonna capitilize to show what I think



YOU HAVE THE MOST ACCURATE READ ON THIS SUBJECT I HAVE EVER SEEN,

YOU SIR ARE 100% CORRECT



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 05:10 PM
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So what is taking money away from someone who works for their money and giving it to a corporation that has bankrupted itself out of bad management or corruption?


I call it feudalism, Nobility (the elite) and us serfs.




David Rockefeller Said."...But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries."


Sure sounds like good old David is setting himself up as Tzar of the world.

You can thank him for engineering the financial collapse too




In Sept. 14, 1994 David Rockefeller, speaking at the UN Business Council,. "This present window of opportunity, during which a truly peaceful and interdependent world order might be built, will not be open for too long - We are on the verge of a global transformation. All we need is the right major crisis and the nations will accept the New World Order."


Notice he and his buddies did not suffer. In 2008 we had headlines like “JP Morgan Chase to become Megabank” and “Analysts say JP Morgan Chase (the Rockefellers and the Rothschilds) will emerge from the bank collapse as the big winner” We also find Monsanto reported record earnings in 2008. Monsanto is owned by financial institutions (mutual funds and pension funds)



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 05:36 PM
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Originally posted by neo67


I know what you are saying.. iv heard it all before.. thats the American mindset.. and its not incorrect.. it has worked extremely well for the past century. Extremely well..

Just as well as the British, French and Spanish systems that were based on almost the exact same principals during their empires which pushed the evolution of mankind as we know it.

Each one of these systems collapsed and evolved.

So will your system, so will our system.. its civilized evolution..




if your living in a foreign country commenting on us politics-stop


1. Please show me where I have commented on US politics in this thread.. anywhere.

2. So just to get this straight.. its OK for a plethora of misinformed bigots from the US on this site to give their ridiculous opinions about EU member state/ world country systems/government policies from countries that they have never visited but its not ok for me to post in a thread about the US when iv been there several times?



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 05:41 PM
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So just to get this straight.. its OK for a plethora of misinformed bigots from the US on this site to give their ridiculous opinions about EU member state/ world country systems/government policies from countries that they have never visited but its not ok for me to post in a thread about the US when iv been there several times?


Its perfectly alright with me. Those who are not as close to the problem can often see more clearly. Also a different view point can often add a lot to a discussion.



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 06:10 PM
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whose misinformed? whose the bigots?



i know what socialism is i dont need you telling me what i know and what i dont know.

and its not the utopian dream you make it out to be.

if you dont like what people write dont read it.

socialism is stagnation- when was the last time the eu invented anything of merit that transformed the world?

capitalism- the tv you watch the computer you use the cell phone you use drives people to the future all the advances in society have all been driven by someone trying to make a buck.

[edit on 14-3-2009 by neo67]



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 06:17 PM
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Originally posted by crimvelvet

Its perfectly alright with me. Those who are not as close to the problem can often see more clearly. Also a different view point can often add a lot to a discussion.



More points of view, more perpestive,

better picture from all angles



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 07:01 PM
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capitalism- the tv you watch the computer you use the cell phone you use drives people to the future all the advances in society have all been driven by someone trying to make a buck.


Unfortunately many people confuse the present system in the USA with Capitalism. But it is not. It is an Oligarchy with laws that prohibit new entrants into business thereby concentrating more and more power and wealth in the hands of a few. For example the USA has five big meat packers. (three if JBS Swift completes its buyout) The packers got laws passed that put over 100 small meat packers out of business in one state alone. Now cattlemen are seeing contracts were all liability for illness is assumed by the rancher. THAT is not captailism! that is a Oligarchy!

What we have in the USA is an Oligarchy mascarading as Socialism. The laws that are supposed to be "for the social good" often have hidden teeth that pushes the competition out of business. The elite do not care because they accumulate power and wealth, under the guise of social reform.



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 07:58 PM
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So Europe won't match our spending, then they better not complain one bit when we "buy american" with our spending plan. If they want part of the money to help their countries, then they need to rack up some debt also, just like Obama said.



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 08:52 PM
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whose misinformed? whose the bigots?


A pretty sizable chunk of the people on this site.. not directed at you.


Originally posted by neo67
and its not the utopian dream you make it out to be.


What are you talking about? Of course its not.. Read my last post. Its all cyclical.




capitalism- the tv you watch the computer you use the cell phone you use drives people to the future all the advances in society have all been driven by someone trying to make a buck.


What? European capitalism and democracy existed thousands of years before the US even existed.. give me a break.

Inventions?

The first programmable computer was invented by a german during Germany's most socialist era..
Click
Rockets
Click
Jet engine
Click
Tcp/Ip
Click
Viagra
Click
Satellite launch
Click
Splitting the atom
Click
Liposuction.. we know how much you Americans are fond of this

Click
Creation of energy through the use of magnetic fields.. this'll be a big 'un.
Click

And so on so forth.. Im sure you get the picture.

Are you one of those Americans that think there was no civilization/technology before the US and that the US is the only developed country on the planet. Sorry man.. thats not the case.

The US is a great country and has dragged the world from the ashes of WW2 to the point it is at today but don't sell it to yourself that you lot did it on your own. Half of US advancements post WW2 came from European scientists..



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 08:56 PM
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Originally posted by ghaleon12
So Europe won't match our spending, then they better not complain one bit when we "buy american" with our spending plan. If they want part of the money to help their countries, then they need to rack up some debt also, just like Obama said.


Yes but you have to remember that the vast majority of the 'Disappeared' money belongs to US banks and corporations.

Why would various countries that are not even in recession contribute billions towards the problem?

Also.. if the 'Buy American' thing comes in.. there will be a 'Buy EU' thing.. do you not think that will hurt your economy even more?

If the shoe was on the other foot.. think about what you would be saying about this situation.



posted on Mar, 14 2009 @ 09:06 PM
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Originally posted by Dermo


whose misinformed? whose the bigots?


A pretty sizable chunk of the people on this site.. not directed at you.


Originally posted by neo67
and its not the utopian dream you make it out to be.


What are you talking about? Of course its not.. Read my last post. Its all cyclical.




capitalism- the tv you watch the computer you use the cell phone you use drives people to the future all the advances in society have all been driven by someone trying to make a buck.


What? European capitalism and democracy existed thousands of years before the US even existed.. give me a break.

Inventions?

The first programmable computer was invented by a german during Germany's most socialist era..
Click
Rockets
Click
Jet engine
Click
Tcp/Ip
Click
Viagra
Click
Satellite launch
Click
Splitting the atom
Click
Liposuction.. we know how much you Americans are fond of this

Click
Creation of energy through the use of magnetic fields.. this'll be a big 'un.
Click

And so on so forth.. Im sure you get the picture.

Are you one of those Americans that think there was no civilization/technology before the US and that the US is the only developed country on the planet. Sorry man.. thats not the case.

The US is a great country and has dragged the world from the ashes of WW2 to the point it is at today but don't sell it to yourself that you lot did it on your own. Half of US advancements post WW2 came from European scientists..


where did i say all that was invented by the us? where?

i said inventions that transformed the world were invented by indviduals trying to make a buck.


all those were before the transition to more socialism system so what have they done lately.?
dont try to twist it

[edit on 14-3-2009 by neo67]




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