It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

If God Loves Us, Why are We Suffering?

page: 1
2

log in

join
share:

posted on Mar, 11 2009 @ 08:28 PM
link   
Exodus 32:11 “But Moses interceded with the LORD his God: "LORD, why does Your anger burn against Your people You brought out of the land of Egypt with great power and a strong hand?”

In past posts on BTS & ATS, I have focused a lot about End Times and the Tribulation, Rapture and Armageddon. Our ministry has really been a lot about sounding a warning to the masses. First, with the Kingdom Message of Salvation so that Christ’s extended flock may prepare their hearts and then with the message that the Tribulation had begun so that they might prepare their minds for what we would all soon face and experience firsthand.

For nearly four years the world has experienced an increase in both the number of natural disasters that have occurred as well as their severity increasing. Now that so many are beginning to experience hardships due to the economic collapses occurring in our country and around the world, which have caused the loss of jobs and homes and many to go hungry and without medical attention and has caused pain and suffering in many different ways for many different reasons, some are beginning to wonder why.

Recently I was asked, “I just don’t understand why, if God and His son love me SO much, why, why, why make me suffer? It doesn’t bring me closer to Him, but makes me question my faith! And believe me; I don’t want to do that! It doesn’t make sense to me. I don’t see it as love, but as punishment.”

This is not an easy question to answer, because in reality there are many reasons, explanations and possibilities depending on the person asking the question. And it’s also not easy as a minister, who, while having compassion and empathy for those who are suffering, must also say to them in all truthfulness that, “Yes, God is angry.”

Aside from being truthful, it is also our responsibility to help Christ’s extended flock to gain knowledge, understanding and wisdom. And in order to gain knowledge as to what we are all experiencing in these End Times, the first thing to do is to look into what the word Tribulation means because while many of us are aware of the word as spoken of in the scriptures, it helps to actually read the definition so that we might apply its meaning to what we’re currently experiencing and come to a better and more complete understanding.

So what does the word tribulation really mean? It’s defined as being a great affliction, trial, or distress; suffering. But what you may not know is that it’s also defined as an experience that tests one’s endurance, patience or faith.

In learning the definition of the word tribulation, we discover that Father forewarned us all of what we would experience; a period of great affliction, distress and suffering. And that these things would also test our endurance, patience and faith.

Many people feel they are good people of good character and that perhaps they don’t deserve the pain or suffering, but it is important to realize that it’s not by our own standards that we are judged but by Father's.

So what is character? Character is defined as the features and traits that form the individual nature of a person, their moral or ethical quality, reputation, etc.

The building character can mean many things for many people. One sure thing that experiencing any sort of tribulation does, is that it builds character and based on how the person approaches that tribulation or does in response to the tribulation will determine the type of character that is built up within them. It can be either good or bad depending on the choices that are made by the individual.

For instance, a person who is faced with a situation in which they do not have the money with which to pay their rent might choose to turn to Father in prayer or, they might choose to turn their back on Father out of anger and commit an illegal act in which to gain the money they need.

Because our sinfulness is innate, there is always room in all of us for the building of good character. We are, none of us, worthy of the undeserved kindness that has been bestowed upon us. Building character can mean endurance, patience, understanding, obedience, compassion or strength. And it can even mean learning to be surrender and be humble. There are many, many qualities that we are all lacking in and that different tests, trials or tribulations may teach us.

Romans 5:4 “endurance produces proven character, and proven character produces hope.“

So the answer is, yes, Father is angry but Father and Christ DO love us as well, and if you’ve ever loved anyone and been angry with them at the same time, then you know that it is absolutely possible to feel both emotions at the same time.

However, we must not allow the pain or suffering to cause us to question our faith, but instead to build our faith. We must endure because we are all tested in different ways, but we must remain strong and steadfast and obedient to Father's will. This too has also been illustrated in the scriptures as examples for us of Father’s chosen one’s who while they served Father faithfully, also experienced pain and suffering. They too were tested and while some failed, others endured.

Luke 21:19 “By your endurance gain your lives.”

Currently we are witnessing Father making Herself known to mankind through the effects of the Tribulation that is upon us, and over time more and more will question their faith and others will even curse Father for the judgment that is upon us. This is all a part of the culling process and must occur and as it must occur, we must endure so that we may gain our lives.

If at any point it feels that it’s too much, stop and consider this: Christ was of perfect character and without sin, and yet he suffered… for us.

Father does not wish that any of Her children should suffer or die - but these things must come to pass. So please, hold on tightly to your faith and do not let go no matter what. Continue to endure and guard your heart too. I cannot stress enough how important this is in this day and age.

Proverbs 4:23 “Guard your heart above all else, for it is the source of life.”

Our prayers continue to be with you all, in the name of our loving savior Christ Jesus, Amen.

[edit on 11-3-2009 by ReginaAdonnaAaron]




posted on Mar, 11 2009 @ 10:27 PM
link   
There is no god.

Or if you prefer: God doesnt care about you. Stop thinking Humanity is so important.



posted on Mar, 12 2009 @ 12:52 AM
link   
Where is the scripture that shows God is angry. I don't believe God is angry with us. We are not under the law. We are under grace. Jesus died for our sins as an act of true love he laid down his life to give man the choice. We serve God because he IS not so that we won't suffer. Suffering is the human condition but by faith God changes the way we view our situations.



posted on Mar, 12 2009 @ 01:54 AM
link   
There is no god.

Or if you prefer: God doesnt care about you. Stop thinking Humanity is so important.

(tenticles)

***SNIP***




Now this OP has been explained over and over by many wise people in this forum.


Suffering is the result of free will number one, and secondly the reason God allows it is to bring greater good.


For instance like 9/11, God brings a renewed or atleast hopes for a renewed spirit in the people to wake them from their apathy.


again When I had everything and didn't suffering, from personal experience I took things for granted.

but one point in my life I went a week without eating, God removed a special grace and I couldn't eat for a week. You would not believe how happy I was after about 7 days when I could finally push food down my throat. I didn't care if it was bad or good tasting I was just happy to eat.


these things called suffering humbles the soul out far beyond our human understanding.


peace.

Admin Edit: removed unnecessary attack

[edit on 14-3-2009 by Crakeur]



posted on Mar, 12 2009 @ 03:24 PM
link   
To answer the question regarding your thread topic and suffering, I wrote this thread last March and this would be my answer to your question.

www.belowtopsecret.com...

[edit on 3/12/2009 by jdposey]



posted on Mar, 12 2009 @ 05:29 PM
link   

Originally posted by jdposey
To answer the question regarding your thread topic and suffering, I wrote this thread last March and this would be my answer to your question.

www.belowtopsecret.com...

[edit on 3/12/2009 by jdposey]


I enjoyed reading your thoughts - thank you for posting this again for others to see and take into account so they too may search their hearts and minds.

Paul is such an example for all of us. I particularly love this scripture you quoted, and pray that one day I'll say the same and that Father will agree: "I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith." 2 Timothy 4:7



posted on Mar, 13 2009 @ 06:48 AM
link   
To put it simply, "no pain, no gain". We all know spoiled children, never develop correctly and have issues later in life. It's kinda the same thing here. We are here to learn and develop by making our own choices and mistakes. It's a great gift ,If you ask me.What may seem horrible and unbearable to us in our short lives may just be one of the very basic lessons in god's eons. We are simply in a nursery and cant see through the wooden door. When we die we are let outside. I wonder if there is a fence to the yard.....

Appreciate the here & now, your gonna reap the benefits later.


~Hyp



posted on Mar, 17 2009 @ 12:03 PM
link   
I will answer your question with another question OP:

If we love one another, than why are we suffering?



posted on Mar, 17 2009 @ 01:55 PM
link   
Basically our work is not done yet and is to come like many have mentioned already and to over come the trials is what is needed by many obsticle that come our way in life.



To the Church in Smyrna
8"To the angel of the church in Smyrna write:
These are the words of him who is the First and the Last, who died and came to life again. 9I know your afflictions and your poverty—yet you are rich! I know the slander of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan. 10Do not be afraid of what you are about to suffer. I tell you, the devil will put some of you in prison to test you, and you will suffer persecution for ten days. Be faithful, even to the point of death, and I will give you the crown of life. 11He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt at all by the second death.
Text




I know that you have little strength, yet you have kept my word and have not denied my name. 9I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you. 10Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth. 11I am coming soon. Hold on to what you have, so that no one will take your crown. 12Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name. 13He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.
Text


Just in case people are wondering, Morning Star means a title not the devil him self who claims he is of that title.



27'He will rule them with an iron scepter;
he will dash them to pieces like pottery'[a]— just as I have received authority from my Father. 28I will also give him the morning star. 29He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Text



[edit on 17-3-2009 by The time lord]



posted on Mar, 17 2009 @ 02:55 PM
link   
reply to post by The time lord
 


Morning star may be a title, I don't know. What Ido know is that it is something else. Which I do not feel at liberty to tell you.

Oh.. .and to the OP.

Is it "god" that is "making" you suffer?

[edit on 3/17/2009 by eye open doors]



posted on Mar, 17 2009 @ 04:05 PM
link   
Responding to the OP tho I do not think God is mad us or the whole of the world past present. But in the bible god was mad at his chosen people of the time. God was mad at a people that he revealed himself to and they chose different. Again common knowledge at the time. Why do bad things happen. Bad things happen because evil is in the world. Not to mention people do bad things outside of God laws. I believe that God gets really mad at a people that he proofs his deity and power to, and they chosen different or they dont believe in his power.

One way or another for those none believers here. There is a God, you cant change the truth and whats real. You cant disprove God. Life after death is a big gamable and where you spend it even more.



posted on Mar, 28 2009 @ 06:51 AM
link   
God has His Plan. And we are not privy to it.

Polarity. Light and Dark, Good and Bad, Love and Pain. We all experience this, and I think therein resides a clue.

Sometimes, I hate God because now that I've experienced His 'thereness' and can no longer deny Him, I have to continue to live in the now that brings so much pain to mar the Joy. And He doesn't! Or, as I see it. I think that God is the most ruthless entity alive and I tell Him that it had better be good, whatever His reason for permitting the continued suffering of humanity, of me.

It seems to me that the polarity is something that was necessary for Life to be. By Life, I mean the All, this physical world and anything that exists beyond it. I believe that even the Earth is alive and sentient and communes with other LifeForce entities in the All. And I believe that the role of Jesus was is and shall be, pivotal to the success of God's plan.

To me, Jesus is Lord of All. For the Resurrection to be complete Truth, Jesus had power over death and hell. As far as I am aware, Jesus is the only recorded character to have experienced existance above the earth, upon the earth, under the earth. He carried out his tasks as per God's plan 2000 years ago and the story has not yet ended.

We are not here just to suffer. But accepting that suffering is part of our path, whatever choices we each make? I'm feeling a little lost here!

I've read that some Angels envied mankind for our Gift of free will. God, in His utterly ruthless protection and Husbandry of the Purity of Heaven, cast these envious angels out. I wonder if these angels ever considered that humans may have had free will but that this was our unique and painful experience that they were free from.

When any non believer cries out, 'where is your god now and why does he allow such suffering', hear the truth; the unbeliever cries out to god in his or her suffering and implores you to help. You cannot comfort the non believer, nor satisfactorarily answer the query. All you can do is pray, and ask God to touch the life of the enquirer with Joy.



posted on Mar, 28 2009 @ 11:16 AM
link   
2 cor 4:[1] Therefore seeing we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we faint not;
[2] But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.
[3] But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
[4] In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

¨god of this world¨ is not talking about jesus, but rather satan. how did satan become the ruler of this world.

gen 3:[1] Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
[2] And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
[3] But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
[4] And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

satan is not only calling god a liar by saying she will not die, but he´s also making the assertion that she can do a better job of directing her own live. that she doesnt need god to tell her right from wrong.

god disagrees with this assertion

jeremiah 10:[23] O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps.

so who´s right? god or satan?

god could have simply destroyed satan in the garden, but it still would have left the question unanswered. logically if someone makes an assertion that is false in front of witnesses, then it would be prudent to allow him to try to prove it. this way the witnesses would know with out a doubt that the assertion was wrong.

this is why god calls those on his side his witnesses.

isaiah 43:[9] Let all the nations be gathered together, and let the people be assembled: who among them can declare this, and shew us former things? let them bring forth their witnesses, that they may be justified: or let them hear, and say, It is truth.
[10] Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
[11] I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
[12] I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, that I am God.

god´s witnesses testify that god was not lying in eden and that following god is the best way of life.

but it is because of this ¨trial¨ that satan rules this world for a short (relative) period of time. during his rule we have sickness, hunger, rape, war, sorrow and death.

when this trial has been played out to the full and the point is made with sufficient proof, god will do away with satan´s wicked world.

matt 13:[49] So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,

1 john 2:[15] Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
[16] For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
[17] And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

so is god angry with us and inflicting pain on us? no....

james 1:[12] Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.
[13] Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
[14] But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.



posted on Mar, 28 2009 @ 01:01 PM
link   
I think this sums it up pretty good ....we are all guilty of doing exactly the same things the old world peoples did ...we said in heart who needs God ...we can do it all things ..etc etc ........same thing satan and the angels that fell did .......

Job 22:15 Hast thou marked the old way which wicked men have trodden?

Job 22:16 Which were cut down out of time, whose foundation was overflown with a flood:

Job 22:17 Which said unto God, Depart from us: and what can the Almighty do for them?
(((((((((((((See they just took God completely out of their world ...saying just go and leave us alone ...)))))))))))

Job 22:18 Yet he filled their houses with good [things]: but the counsel of the wicked is far from me.
(((((((((God still blessed them with things )))))))))))))))))

Job 22:19 The righteous see [it], and are glad: and the innocent laugh them to scorn.

Job 22:20 Whereas our substance is not cut down, but the remnant of them the fire consumeth.

Job 22:21 Acquaint now thyself with him, and be at peace: thereby good shall come unto thee.
((((((((((((((((((((the ANSWER on what can you do to change things ))))))))))))
Job 22:22 Receive, I pray thee, the law from his mouth, and lay up his words in thine heart.
Job 22:23 If thou return to the Almighty, thou shalt be built up, thou shalt put away iniquity far from thy tabernacles.

Job 22:24 Then shalt thou lay up gold as dust, and the [gold] of Ophir as the stones of the brooks.

Job 22:25 Yea, the Almighty shall be thy defence, and thou shalt have plenty of silver.

Job 22:26 For then shalt thou have thy delight in the Almighty, and shalt lift up thy face unto God.

Job 22:27 Thou shalt make thy prayer unto him, and he shall hear thee, and thou shalt pay thy vows.

Job 22:28 Thou shalt also decree a thing, and it shall be established unto thee: and the light shall shine upon thy ways.

Job 22:29 When [men] are cast down, then thou shalt say, [There is] lifting up; and he shall save the humble person.

Job 22:30 He shall deliver the island of the innocent: and it is delivered by the pureness of thine hands.



posted on Apr, 27 2009 @ 11:17 PM
link   
We suffer because of are sin and of the worlds sin. Remove the sin and the suffering follows.



new topics

top topics



 
2

log in

join