Sarkozy: France will return to NATO

reply to post by Rigel
Rubbish! The German was finished the second he attacked USSR. They suffered the same fate as Napoleon. Defeat at the hands of the Russian environment. You do know Russian casualties in WW2 were roughly one hundred times that of the British and USA in the European theatre? Who did the real life and death graft to finish the Nazi evil? The Russians my friend.

reply to post by ufoorbhunter


Agreed...to a degree. We wouldn't want to eat 'Russian Fries" with our burgers now would we.

However, Rigel's knowledge of his leader's history, and that of his Country, is minimal at best.

When Sarkozy was only 16, he fled with his family from Hungary to run from the Red Army and went to Germany. He could have stayed and fought for his homeland. The rest of the Hungarian youth did (most anyway). Back then, everyone fought.

France was never the Superpower of the World. At best, She only managed to get into the top 3, only after the British Empire (1), then the Russian Empire (2). France has invaded more Countries that any other Country. (Maybe the British, but I'd have to look that up) Even the Americans had to finally throw them out of the US after the British were defeated.

What's most damaging to the French almighty war machine, is that it can be successfully argued the French single-handedly started 'both' world wars. Other Nations had to step in to stop them both.

Anyhow, just thought I would agree with you.

reply to post by ufoorbhunter


Just what I say if I'm not wrong. Anyway we'll agree that the legend of the WW2* American heroism is just, all in all, a legend...

* Let's add WW1 to the picture.

Originally posted by SlinkyDFW
reply to post by ufoorbhunter

 

(...)
However, Rigel's knowledge of his leader's history, and that of his Country, is minimal at best.

When Sarkozy was only 16, he fled with his family from Hungary to run from the Red Army and went to Germany. He could have stayed and fought for his homeland. The rest of the Hungarian youth did (most anyway). Back then, everyone fought.

Check your facts, dude : Nicolas Sarkozy is a full-scale french-born citizen, and born (from a full-scale french mother) in Paris - no less s'il vous plaît.

HIS FATHER FLEW THE RUSSIANS.

France was never the Superpower of the World. At best, She only managed to get into the top 3, only after the British Empire (1), then the Russian Empire (2). France has invaded more Countries that any other Country. (Maybe the British, but I'd have to look that up) Even the Americans had to finally throw them out of the US after the British were defeated.

What's most damaging to the French almighty war machine, is that it can be successfully argued the French single-handedly started 'both' world wars. Other Nations had to step in to stop them both.

Anyhow, just thought I would agree with you.

Once again : check your facts.





[edit on 11-3-2009 by Rigel]

Originally posted by Rigel
Let me just remind you that French Empire* once (and that was one or two century ago) was the biggest empire in the world...

Second after the British Empire

France had a successful military history (still one of the most successful), until we decided to teach them a jolly old lesson during the Napoleonic Wars

Our American members should recall the 13,000 French soldiers and Naval blockade that resulted in a British surrender at Yorktown. The exquisite choice of nonchalance and reluctances to acknowledge historical events by American members is so elegant, almost poetic.

Originally posted by Rigel
reply to post by ufoorbhunter

 

Just what I say if I'm not wrong. Anyway we'll agree that the legend of the WW2* American heroism is just, all in all, a legend...

* Let's add WW1 to the picture.

What is this, my Country has a bigger "#@$&" than yours? My original point was that the French have been VERY quick to start agression, but QUICKLY back down when it's not convenient for them any more. Your history has already proven that.

reply to post by infinite


Cheers.

Don't forget that at the time of the Napoleon Wars, the almost entire Europe had became.... Napoleonian (if not Napoleonized).


Edit : British millenial craft of navigation and of "sea-battles" made the difference... for the worst !





[edit on 11-3-2009 by Rigel]

reply to post by Rigel

American heroism a legend? Lol the French really need to admit the Yanks have done them a favour (or two) in the last century. The USA did not need to come to anybodys aid, they were a continent away and in those days that offered independence from the outside. We should take our hats off to the USA (probably the most incredible nation in history) for saving us (the Brits) and you (the French) from a very real evil called National Socialism. The Russians may well have come to our aid eventually but I don't think we'd be talking right here and now in this relaxed atmosphere............. Thankyou the United States of America. They didn't have to do it but they did for the benefit of us all and sacrificed many of their own along the way and that is amazing.

Originally posted by ufoorbhunter
reply to post by Rigel

 

(snipped)....

.. They didn't have to do it but they did for the benefit of us all and sacrificed many of their own along the way and that is amazing.

The idea of forming a military alliance, like NATO, is only meant to allow those involved, to know that they have a brother, just in case they need him.

If Muhammed Juhad Bin Whatever, or Kim Yow Whoever he is, knocks on your door in the middle of the night, and decides it time for you to die, who do you want on your side?

Point made, I think.

reply to post by SlinkyDFW


One more time, please check your history books.

France didn't want a second WW just 20 yrs after the first, not to mention XIXth century several wars directly lived upon the national territory (not your foreign US operations : think of the civil populations, man).

Still, Petain was a traitor, no point about this in the "national french debate".

But the core of the problem is, you know, a country that shares some hundred-mile long frontier with France... You know... Germany... Which was rather "NAZi" in those time...

And you know what ? Some PEOPLE OF TRAITOR decided that giving money to these people was a good way to establish their world-war domination, specially over a bunch of nations they never managed to overcome at those times...

And you know what ? Adolf Hitler also made much of his first meetings under a big brand bright Coca-Cola banner...




[edit on 11-3-2009 by Rigel]

reply to post by Rigel


If you're let into NATO as a full member this time, and someone calls Sarkozy in the middle of the night and tells him we (NATO) need him to launch his 300 nukes....is he going to push the button?

Or will he turn his head.....like....de Gaulle?

[edit on 11-3-2009 by SlinkyDFW]

Hi everyone,

I am french and I won't let anyone say that we run away (not even as a joke) because not only it is historically untrue but also because our boys are working hand in hand with US soldiers in Afghanistan since quiet a few years know to kick some motherf...... as-s.

America and Ireland are France's oldest allies, we (not only me) consider them as not only our allies but our friends and let me tell you that we love America and it's people. We did not like Bush but who did anyway ? My American friends were almost ashamed to be American citizens when he was president and I always told them not to be ashamed and to go vote against him.

America, I say it again, WE LOVE YA and WE DID NOT FORGET (sorry 4 breaking TC rules)

Now, why did Sarkozy wants France to join NATO again ?

That's the real question...I have no clue exactly why yet but as a french citizen, I say that's normal, NATO needs to grow stronger to kick some more as-s and to prevent further conflicts.

One thing I know for sure, fanatics are growing bigger, let's unit and show them what we think of their believes.

Peace out.
Vive la France et vive l'Amérique.
Europa



[edit on 11-3-2009 by Europa733]

reply to post by ufoorbhunter


Hey America ! A Brit' supports you as a People of Heroes !

- Just imagine if Hitler had conquered Europe.... and why not Russia after all because guys like you like to believe Russian were almost absent of the conflict...

Well. Little Adolf would have not scratched his lil head a long time to send over you a shiny soundy bomby carpet.

Your mythology of American Altruism & Non-Interessement is a fairy tale for "petite filles", I'm afraid...



[edit on 11-3-2009 by Rigel]

reply to post by Rigel
Err...........Yeah..................Whatever...............Not quite sure where you're going there, but the USA helped out Europe in the last century no end, I mean let's be honest Europe was a political mine field and was literally ripping itself apart. Thank the Lord for the USA, without their intervention there would be no more French and no more English spoken and that is reality, even the Russians know who initially kept their war machine going through Archangel.

Originally posted by ufoorbhunter
reply to post by Rigel

 

Err...........Yeah..................Whatever...............Not quite sure where you're going there,

1. USA had simply NO CHOICE to enter the war or not. Y'all just have TO in order to save your very own rear. Politics, specially Wars, are not a day-to-day affair, sir : that's a five or ten, if not a hundred - years ahead in mind strategy.

2. Without the COMBO of ALL ALLIED FORCES, nothing like the average heroic american joe (or just "son of..." ? ) like to believe in as some "US victory" - id est a Franco-Russo-US-British victory.

Check out the deeds and gestures of a certain Philippe Leclerc de Hauteclocque, aka Général Leclerc ; as an only PRACTICAL EXEMPLE (of french heroism, or of the neccessity of french forces on the european soil at ths time of the conflict).

en.wikipedia.org...
fr.wikipedia.org...

As usual, the cultural wars rages on Wikipedia : shall i recommend the french article, using for your very own comfort a google-translator en guise of interpret... ?

but the USA helped out Europe in the last century no end, I mean let's be honest Europe was a political mine field and was literally ripping itself apart. Thank the Lord for the USA, without their intervention there would be no more French and no more English spoken and that is reality, even the Russians know who initially kept their war machine going through Archangel.

3. It's now common historical knowledge that your dear USA actively funded the young Nazi Regime. Please shake well this information within your mind.

Edit : Story of the Golem, anyone ?


[edit on 11-3-2009 by Rigel] - spelling and all


[edit on 11-3-2009 by Rigel]

I love how a conversation about France re-joining NATO became a heated argument about world war 2.

... a practical slug fest of "My country did this in the war".




Who am I to stay out of a fun argument.

You would have all been up the creek without Canada.

But we usually don't boast much... look it up for yourselves.

Guess what i dont dislike the french at all. Its just fun taking the mickey out of them. Maybe they mighty like to entertain us by having a good dig at the anglo saxons. Lighten up! lol

reply to post by johnsky


I'm happy to welcome you, Canada Fellow, in the wide camp of Winners.

However, NATO is just the direct consequence of WW2.

Originally posted by johnsky
I love how a conversation about France re-joining NATO became a heated argument about world war 2.

... a practical slug fest of "My country did this in the war".




Who am I to stay out of a fun argument.

You would have all been up the creek without Canada.

But we usually don't boast much... look it up for yourselves.

A creek? I suppose with no paddle either? Bravo to Canada for their efforts in NATO....

www.thecanadianencyclopedia.com...

and:

en.wikipedia.org...

"...Given the small size of Canada's military, the importance of Canada's contribution to NATO has primarily been political rather than military."

You're correct, no bragging needed.

reply to post by spannera


Well, if you're a pretty gi... Aarghh, - T&C.


Let's just dig around by now.