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Stop blaming Jesus for so-called 'Christian' acts

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posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 05:38 AM
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Jesus Christ - you would think that his name meant 'Christian' - but the number of horrible acts that have been committed under that name defy belief.

Stop blaming Jesus Christ for the so-called 'Christian' atrocities.

The churches are at fault for taking his name and calling themselves 'Christian' and then for running the Crusades and murdering millions.

All wars are due to religion and greed.

Jesus was not about that that - he was, and is, about Love and Forgiveness.

Jesus Christ was crucified to save us - the whole of mankind.

Do not crucify him again by aligning him with the so-called Christian church which is totally corrupt, as are all man-made religions.




posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 06:49 AM
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I am glad you said that, you get my applause. Bill cooper said it best once, when he siad that most christians do not even know the man that they portray as jesus, they have no clue.

Shame though that people could not live with christian values, but heck, everyones turned there back on it.

But you get my appause there, who ever you are.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 07:14 AM
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reply to post by spellbound
 


Amen.

Don't believe you need to build giant churches and collect money from the flock to be like Jesus.

Just the opposite actually. Jesus questioned authority. This is why they didn't like him. Jesus exposed banking (Templar collections). This is why they killed him.

He died so that us in this time could see the truth in his actions.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 07:30 AM
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Originally posted by spellbound
Jesus Christ - you would think that his name meant 'Christian' - but the number of horrible acts that have been committed under that name defy belief.

Stop blaming Jesus Christ for the so-called 'Christian' atrocities.

The churches are at fault for taking his name and calling themselves 'Christian' and then for running the Crusades and murdering millions.

All wars are due to religion and greed.

Jesus was not about that that - he was, and is, about Love and Forgiveness.

Jesus Christ was crucified to save us - the whole of mankind.

Do not crucify him again by aligning him with the so-called Christian church which is totally corrupt, as are all man-made religions.


You are assuming that Christ even existed. THe evidence suggests he may have been a fabricated figure. "The Christ Conspiracy." There is none one shred of historical record to substantiate a Jesus of Nazareth. The christians paint a portrait of a figure who was so important, yet not ONE historical artifact can be found.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 07:44 AM
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Lets be clear . He died on the cross because that was his destiny. He died to wash our sin away, that we might enter heaven. Lets not beat around the bush, it wasnt just a lesson He taught us in death. He wasnt a martyr. He died , and by the mechanism of His death cleansed the sin from the soul of all who have faith in God in heaven, hallowed be His name.
If not for this action, then heaven would be closed unto us all and THATS the bottom line.
I agree in whole with the sentiments expressed here though. It sickens me that Christianity is now a capitalist regime hellbent on keeping its centres open for "business".
Im sure the only righteous and truely Christian way to run a church is to do it in your own homes, or out in the streets . More and more as time goes by, people of God will have to go back to the old ways, from when they were under the roman occupation. Remember to prepare for the end, because when we are no longer allowed to worship at all , this will be the method.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 08:12 AM
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Churches are corporations, plain and simple, and are about making money for the corporation, and God does not live in, of even visit a mansion type church sitting on a big hill on Sunday morning. There is much evidence that a man named Jesus never existed, and even if he did, he was a man, not a God. Christianity had made for themselves a false God, and they depict him at his worst moment, hanging on the cross, and they do lip service to this false God at every service. You don't need a preacher or even a church to find, and have a relationship with the Creator. Religion is mind control. and I speak from experience. Glad I am free of it.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 08:20 AM
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reply to post by spellbound
 





Do not crucify him again by aligning him with the so-called Christian church which is totally corrupt, as are all man-made religions.



Well you sound like a pretty moderate type of dude, is there any possibility do you think, of all the xtians getting together and sorting out this problem once and for all ?


Would it be possible say for the likes of you and I to come to an agreement whereby we both agree to keep our beliefs to ourselves and only discuss our beliefs when asked out of genuine interest.


Could we not then, take this agreement one step further and your friends get together with all the other xtians out there and make moves to come to the same agreement.

You could then perhaps resolve all your differences of opinion amongst yourselves as to what your belief is actually all about, without having to inflict me and my friends with constant interference in our lives.

I will do the same with my friends in that we could get together and come to some agreement on the fact that we have no belief. Providing we all agree that having no belief in your belief, we could then agree that you will from now on will not be able to misunderstand what we don't believe.


We could then make an undertaking not to go around peoples houses or influencing school classes etc telling people that we have no belief and the good news is they don't have to belief anything either .

If you and the others you speak of, also make an agreement to not go to peoples houses or schools etc telling people what you believe and the good news is they have to believe it, then we should all be working from the same corner.


At this moment in time we are in total agreement that we have no belief and find it very difficult to find a way for any of us to misinterpret this.

So if you guys could come to some similar arrangement that'd be fine.
From then on you can all believe in x and keep it to yourself and we can have no beliefs and keep that to ourselves.

If you guys do that, should you have any problems between yourselves as to what you believe in we won't actually know about it.

We of course cannot disagree on what we do not believe, so that would place us in a position of helping you out when you cannot agree on what you're supposed to believe. Of course it goes without saying that we would not try to help you sort out your belief problems without you first asking which would benefit everyone.

Maybe the future could look bright after all, if we all worked together to resolve our problems this way.



[edit on 9-3-2009 by moocowman]



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 08:42 AM
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It is a shame that you have no belief in anything.

I am not trying to impose anything on you. I started this thread and you chose to join it - I did not invite or impel you to do so.

I really hope that you have some spiritual belief for the sake of your child/children.

And, btw, I think that people should be free to choose their own belief system and that certainly includes children - unfortunately, children do not have a choice.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 09:10 AM
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Agreed.
If we were to follow one thing and one thing only Christ said, it would be to love one another, treat one another the way we want to be treated.
Regardless if you believe in Christ, or, God Help You, you don’t, these are still both fantastic rules to live.
Problem being in a dog-eat-dog world no one can see the reason behind it.

As for main stream churches I’ve always had a problem with them.

For one, why spend 3 hours every Wednesday night practicing at choir?

So you can sing pretty for the congregation?

Quit bloody singing for the congregation and get out there for those three hours and so do something GOOD for your community!

I don’t care if it’s feeding the poor, making afghans to give to the homeless, cleaning up the filthy streets of trash, it does not matter!
Why?
Because the world, and God, I dare say, would be much happier hearing your voice raised in song, while working with your hands to help human kind, than seeing you kicked back on a pew munching cookies and gossiping with your church friends.

Get out there in the community and SHOW what a Christian is and quit hiding behind the church doors keeping yourselves amongst like kind!

If humanity on the outside of the church sees what *loving one another* can really mean, maybe they’ll start believing it after seeing it put to work, cause they sure are not believing it by the church community doing nothing but thumping bibles and pointing fingers in their face.

peace



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 09:26 AM
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reply to post by spellbound
 





It is a shame that you have no belief in anything.


Why's that my friend? my life is equally as meaningful as yours .





I am not trying to impose anything on you. I started this thread and you chose to join it - I did not invite or impel you to do so.


This is correct and equally I have to this point tried to extend you courtesy and have not asked you to not believe whatever you do believe, so it seems we are getting on fine so far





I really hope that you have some spiritual belief for the sake of your child/children.


Who knows perhaps I could be considered spiritual, but I have no beliefs .
Spirituality would appear to be something not of the human body, perhaps supernatural describes it best, if this is the case then there's no need to worry about my kids about matters of the spirit, let them play, if there was any spirituality with them when they were born it hasn't gone very far.





And, btw, I think that people should be free to choose their own belief system and that certainly includes children - unfortunately, children do not have a choice.


I fully agree that's why I insist my children are allowed to make their own choices when the grow up, for now they can play and explore, learn and experience what could be better for a child ?


There we go my friend a secularist and a christian in total agreement how cool is that ?

If other Christians could be as equally as reasonable as you have been in this short discussion, then the world would surely be a better place no ?


So not to go to far off the topic of your post, how do you think it could be possible to get all the other Christians that you earlier spoke of, to come to this very sensible place of reason, that we have here right now ?



[edit on 9-3-2009 by moocowman]



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 09:28 AM
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The man existed - whether or not he was God's son is an open question.

But that is not my point.

He showed people how to live by loving and forgiving - and that is all we need to do.

And if he was around now, he would destroy all churches and all banks.

Oh, btw, how was it he could overcome all those old powerful moneylenders if he was human - why didn't they just kill him there and then?



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 09:41 AM
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reply to post by moocowman
 


Hi Moo,

YEAH - we are getting along quite well - something I never expected lol.

But why not let your kids judge for themselves (or maybe you do).



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 09:53 AM
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reply to post by spellbound
 


T


he man existed - whether or not he was God's son is an open question.


Not wanting to contradict you whether he existed is still not proven, nevertheless, I agree that's not your point here so we'll move on






He showed people how to live by loving and forgiving - and that is all we need to do.


Well it would be silly to argue this inline with the above, but if he did exist and what you say is true, then hey he seems like a swell guy.

It's interesting that you say "showed people how to live " and not "told people how to live"

Do you think this could be a big part of the christian identity crisis ? Perhaps the other christians who are not so reasonable as you appear to be, this far. Misunderstood the difference between show and tell when they chose to try and act like him, perhaps that is where the other type of christians are getting it wrong do you think ?






And if he was around now, he would destroy all churches and all banks.


Well the jesus you speak of seems like my kinda guy if this is true.





Oh, btw, how was it he could overcome all those old powerful moneylenders if he was human - why didn't they just kill him there and then?


Well he obviously didn't he got nailed for it, but that's all guessing and hearsay, let's go back to being in agreement on things we were getting along great, which surely is a good example here on ATS.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 09:58 AM
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Ah, but you see... the Christians who do those things ARE doing it in the name of Jesus Christ. Which links the two.

Even though you may not think that they are related, through hundreds of years of association, the damage is already done.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 10:02 AM
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Originally posted by spellbound
reply to post by moocowman
 


Hi Moo,

YEAH - we are getting along quite well - something I never expected lol.

But why not let your kids judge for themselves (or maybe you do).


I try to set an example of being no judgmental with my kids, when they move into adulthood they will hopefully have learned to enquirer and gather evidence think critically and such.

My job is top help them think about the consequences of playing in the road and help them make informed decisions, so they will be able to make their own decisions in their lives ahead.

My job is to help my kids learn how to think not what to think, by doing this I'm open to learning something myself, can't be bad no?



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 10:06 AM
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Actually, Moo, he DID oversome those stupid old men - it was GOD that did him in.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 10:13 AM
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reply to post by ravenshadow13
 


Hi Raven,

That is what I am trying to do - disassociate Jesus Christ's name from any and every church - he definitely was not about churches - well, he was, until churches became so corrupt.



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 10:19 AM
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reply to post by moocowman
 


Well moocow,

You are a fabulous dad and I wish you and your family well.

In the love of Jesus xxx



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 11:05 AM
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Originally posted by spellbound
reply to post by moocowman
 


Well moocow,

You are a fabulous dad and I wish you and your family well.

In the love of Jesus xxx


Thank you very much, now how is it possible do you think we could prevent these "other christians" trying to force their belief upon my kids, so's they can grow up to make up their own minds about life ?



posted on Mar, 9 2009 @ 12:09 PM
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Moocow ... This may seem like a criticism. Its not , its just how it is. In this world there are alot of people, and some would like to believe that most EVERYONE has a pragmatic and accepting approach to life. Fact is that the large majority of people, regardless of faith , creed, race, colour, musical taste, are complete B-tards with little or no respect for thier fellow man, despite protestations to the contrary.
You happen to have bumped into a localised batch of Btardedness , and thats some pretty bad luck , but please remember , they are EVERYWHERE! They preach from every holy book, they debate from every political standpoint. They wear every football shirt, theres a bunch in every country , and there is no where on this planet you can hide from them. Thats reality ... now , Im sure you have had to do this before.. Im going to ask you to just knuckle down and DEAL WITH IT. I have to , and I hate the entire thing with a passion, but if I dont deal with it , accept it for what it is , and carry on regardless of the continuous , and outrageous manner of human existance, then my life comes to a grinding halt, and I go to a mental hospital. Thats your choice.. deal with it , or go doolally ... Im sorry dude, but thats all there is , and anything else is just an illusion.



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