Christianity you have now overstepped the mark and I now declare war upon you, page 2

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reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 05:48 PM by moocowman

reply to post by octotom

But, the fact is that Christianity has withstood all the attacks on it.

Sorry to disagree dude,but here in the UK xtianity is on the decline big time, churches and chapels etc are being turned into flats and warehouses daily, although its' propaganda machine would falsely claim otherwise, and is insidiously moving in on children.

If I'd changed the word Xtianity to Islam in my opening post I'm sure christians would be screaming bloody hell in my defense.

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 05:57 PM by tothetenthpower

reply to post by ragman

But you see Ragman, you can't make a statement like Jesus is real and was the son of God. It's a matter of personnal opinion. You can't state that as fact and just presume that you are correct.

You're beliefs are subject to my scrutiny, and my beliefs are subject to your scrutiny and it is like this all over with every other living person.

To say that anybody knows anything for concrete fact is just plain wrong, and they are lying to themselves.

To say however, I believe this is the way it is, and I respect your opinion of the matter is perfectly ok, because at that point you realize that your belief could be wrong or that their belief could be right and vice versa.

Having a closed minded attitude about any sort of belief is what makes that belief wrong, because you can never know the truth. You're making assumptions based on things that have been said and taught to you over years.

These things are not debatable, they are not provable or debunkable, nothing can be done to win either argument.

All we can do is hold to our beliefs and literally "pray" that one day we all be enlightened by whatever is the truth in this world.

Forcing our beliefs down on other people only alienates them from what your attempting to accomplish.

~Keeper

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:03 PM by moocowman

reply to post by ragman

You have to remember, for a Christian, knowing a non-believer is like watching your buddy run blind-folded off a cliff. You will do ANYTHING in your power to stop them.

This speaks volumes my buddy

So if I decided to try homosexuality, I'm running blind folded off a cliff ?

If I use contraception , I'm running blind folded off a cliff ?

If I shout oh god when I have an orgasm,I'm running blind folded off a cliff ?

If I become a Hindu I'm running blind folded off a cliff ?

If I think evolution explains a great deal of the world that I live in, I'm running blind folded off a cliff ?

If I divorce my wife, I'm running blind folded off a cliff ?

If I think for myself, I'm running blind folded off a cliff ?

Hmm, god forbid you have any power then.

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:08 PM by moocowman

reply to post by tothetenthpower

But you see Ragman, you can't make a statement like Jesus is real and was the son of God. It's a matter of personnal opinion. You can't state that as fact and just presume that you are correct.

This is the crux of the problem, educators are doing this to my child regardless to my child's attempts to enter into reasonable debate, because she's a child she has to accept what the adult educator claims is true.

Totally repulsive and absolutely no different to Islam.

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:11 PM by Xtrozero

Originally posted by moocowman
My beliefs are not outside the norm as I have no beliefs and neither do my children. I'm not restrictive in any way my kids are exposed to religions at school (at lest it should be plural) I encourage my kids to get access to as much info as possible.

My child s RE teacher for example had never even heard of Dyonisis and I find this quite disturbing for obvious reasons.

What is RE and what is a Dyonisis? I have traveled all over the world and I enjoy many cultures. I have respect for them all even though I do not follow them or believe as they do. I do find their beliefs, whether they are religious or some form of physiology based, interesting for I find people interesting.

I can sit next to a monk or priest and enjoy their company greatly, and enjoy the conversation no matter what direction it may go. And in all cases I do not carry the spitefulness that you do. Just using the “xiains” tells me a lot about you. The funny part is how you all see religion as some evil mind altering zombification when most religions just teach a level of morality, but that doesn’t mean the people who say they follow it actually follow it. I also see that people, much like yourself, are very hyper sensitive to religion when the majority of religious people are just norm people not wanting to push anything on others.

You, we, all need to accept that people will be people. With 90% plus of the world being religious I would say religion plays a big role in why humans are the way they are. For those who have zero faith or belief in anything that they cannot touch I see as a very small minority.

So you have no beliefs, great, have a nice life, but who is the one not showing any tolerance here.

[edit on 7-3-2009 by Xtrozero]

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:15 PM by tothetenthpower

reply to post by moocowman

I think if you are going to continue having your children present in these types of institutions, you should arm them with the correct knowledge so they can let these educators know that they are not sheep to be dictated and controlled to.

This is the problem I have with the education system in general, they no longer treat our children like students, they treat them like prisoners. Subject to their rules and regulations and their beliefs, without the opportunity for our children to get different views or opinions.

When children try to seek other avenues or different perspectives from what they have been taught, they are chastized. Schools should be supporting the idea of knowledge in general, not just "accepted" knowlege.

~keeper

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:16 PM by Stormdancer777

reply to post by moocowman

informed by the teacher that Jesus Christ is a very real person and god but also had to take part in the worship of this god twice a week.

I have only recently learned that on the first day she started this “Secular” school that along with her books, diaries that she was given there was also a “BIBLE”!!!!!!!!

Oh dear god !

Say it isn't so.

I have a question,

What if when you child grows up she wants to become a Christian?

Would you accept it?

Or persecute her?

I have a son that was a Satanist, he recently turned to Christianty, who would of thought?

[edit on 063131p://bSaturday2009 by Stormdancer777]

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:17 PM by Benevolent Heretic

I didn't see how old your child is, but can you talk to her and explain that her religion classes are just stories and make-believe and NOT real, no matter what her teacher says?

Also, follow up with the school authorities and tell them to stop teaching your child this crap.

The best thing would be to take her our of public school until she's older and can understand about the stories of different religions.

I'm so sorry. This is one reason I would never let my kid in a public school.

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:20 PM by Stormdancer777

Most public schools don't teach religion but some are teaching Islam.

Originally posted by Yummy Freelunch
This is one of the reasons I took my son out of public schools and home schooled him. Not only that, but every week there was a bomb threat or some other crazy thing going on. I dont want my child learning the lies they teach in these schools, its pathetic.

Another school has been "teaching" Islam by having students study and learn Muslim prayers and dress as Muslims, and a lawyer who argued a previous dispute over this issue to the U.S. Supreme Court said such methodologies wouldn't "last 10 seconds" if it were Christianity being taught

www.worldnetdaily.com...

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:23 PM by Stormdancer777

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

I'm so sorry. This is one reason I would never let my kid in a public school.

Oh do you think it will permanently damage the child?

[edit on 063131p://bSaturday2009 by Stormdancer777]

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:23 PM by TH3ON3

reply to post by moocowman

Good for them. I hope she learned to love instead of hate others because of their beliefs or skin color.

I think you are setting a bad precedent for your child to try and debunk something you can't possibly be sure is false.

I pray your child finds thew true path that I have found to be the only truth on this Earth that has helped all who have called upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:27 PM by asmall89

Why don't you let your kid decide what they want hm? If she wants to continue learning Christianity fine, if not then pursue some action. Be truthful in telling her what it is about (which I assume you know) and the pro's & cons, or your no better than your enemy. Don't brainwash your kid to hate Christianity. Yeah Christians are no better than any other religious group trying to force themselves on others, but at least Jesus had a good message of love. People distort his message and go along with we're better than you and we're right. I have no doubt Jesus was a real man (there is plenty of evidence) did he really have these powers though? I happen to believe yes, but that is my belief, you however are entitled to your own, and I respect that. I don't respect what you want to do to Christians though. Waging a personal war on them just because you disagree with them, that just makes you as bad as any of the religious radicals.

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:28 PM by TH3ON3

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

I am shocked at you too BH. I thought you had better sense then to say that all religious stories are false. Do you not think there was a King named David, or Solomon?

Don't let your own prejudice blind you to actual history that proves these Kings of Israel existed.

I'm sorry, but I'm going to have to remove you from my friend list as I can see you clearly are not.

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:31 PM by fooffstarr

I'm with the OP.

I believe everyone, even a child, should be able to choose what religion they want to be a part of (or none at all).

When a child is exposed to things at a young, impressionable age, it clouds that choice when they get to the age that their religious beliefs really become an issue.

I personally think that kids should be shielded from all religion, including athiesm, until they reach around 15 or 16. At least then they can look at all them with some form of maturity and make a choice about what they want to believe.

When a kid has been force-fed a religion since birth, they are far less likely to think for themselves about that choice.

Good for you OP for standing up for what you believe or (or in this case don't believe in

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:33 PM by Ownification

reply to post by moocowman

'half an hour a week for SEVEN MONTHS'
uhm, do you tell your children bed time stories? If you do than you shouldn't complain about this half an hour a week thing, it shows your hatred. Nothing bad can come out of it, infact only good can come out of it because they will learn some morals. All these massacres that have been poping up in different states of America is very frightening don't you think?

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:33 PM by Ahabstar

reply to post by moocowman

Allow a little latitude to play Devil's Advocate (or God's or whatever) for a moment.

You say you believe in nothing. I find that incredibly hard to believe. If we nothing more than the result of a bio-chemical reaction between our parents that came to full term and have not died as of yet due to chance or random luck, then what is our purpose. Any foundation in true science has to explain everything.

To simplify, we have seasons due to our orbit around the sun and the angle of our tilted axis. We keep our orbit due to gravity. We have gravity due to mass and to keep us cohesively together.

As human beings we like to believe that we solely posses emotions and ingenuity. Yet dogs cower when yelled at out of fear, even our own pets that know full well that we love them. And raccoons invaliding trash cans for food can figure out an incredible amount of steps to regain entry...much to our embarrassment of our superior minds.

Humans can imagine and philosophize quite a bit. We can create stories that are more realistic than reality. When we watch a movie, we do not see individual pictures of light and sounds. We can identify with the characters and experience love, fear, repulsion, sympathy and whole variety of other emotions from just two senses being stimulated by objects that are no where near our presence. For all practical purposes those things do not exist to us physically.

So why is the idea of a higher being that created us for its own purpose seem so unrealistic to people? Is it the mystic part? Is it the philosophical nature of faith? What would compel an atheist to live their life as best they could within the 10 Commandments? If life has no meaning outside of our few years that we live it, then why not screw people over, steal their things and live a life of extravagance and luxury?

Is it to remain a good person in the eyes of others? What will their opinion mean when either you or they are dead? Or is it something else?

And finally, believing in nothing is actually believing in something. You believe that nothing exists. On the whole, I would guess that your proofs rely on pretty much the same amount (yet a different kind of) faith as those that believe in something.

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:36 PM by Xtrozero

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I didn't see how old your child is, but can you talk to her and explain that her religion classes are just stories and make-believe and NOT real, no matter what her teacher says?

Hmmm, why not just tell the child the truth? The truth is that humans carry beliefs and faiths in many things. Then explain that humans can see something as true or real without the need for proof too.

Then as the child's parent she can teach her child what SHE believes the universe is all about.

It is really that simple....

[edit on 7-3-2009 by Xtrozero]

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:37 PM by Ownification

reply to post by Stormdancer777

That is not a public school I think, you are talking about a private school. A private school for Muslims.

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:44 PM by tothetenthpower

reply to post by TH3ON3

Do you truly believe everything you read in history books my friend? There are two sides to every story. And much of what we perceive as being "history" is falsified or at the very least tailored to suit one specific sect of society.

That goes for any society at any given time, even our own. Actually I think our own time will probably be looked at in future generations as the epidomy of false infromation and historical cover up of actual fact.

I need only give the example of the Sphynx in Egypt.

It seems you only have friends who share your beliefs, that is very counter productive my friend. How are you suppose to gain any sort of further knowledge if you never surround yourself with people who don't always agree?

Argument breeds development and ideas.

~Keeper

reply posted on 7-3-2009 @ 06:45 PM by Stormdancer777

Originally posted by Ownification
reply to post by Stormdancer777

That is not a public school I think, you are talking about a private school. A private school for Muslims.