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At least, I have never seen in the Constitution that 20% of my income should pay for the old, the decrepit, and the poor who refuse to buy health insurance.....
Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
reply to post by Heike
Just my opinion, and an expression of my frustration with how this type of thread always turns into arguing about who the "bad guys" are instead of considering possible solutions.
You did a great job of describing examples of many of the things that ail our health care system.
I completely agree with your frustration.
You've laid out symptoms of the problem, and identified the major causes- insurance, government regulations and lawsuits. The only thing I would disagree with is your statement about "who the bad guys are".
In order to fix the problems, you must identify the problems, AND the causes of the problems(in fact, the prime movers of the problems).
Insurance: Problem #1-
Parties: Everyone- Insurance companies, Doctors, Providers, Patients
Rationale: Insurance companies are "for profit" organizations. They wish to
maximize profits, and cut costs. Therefore, they constantly raise
premiums, co-pays, exclusions, and minimize reimbursements.
Doctors, providers, want to get as much as possible in
reimbursements. So if they would charge $500 for a given
procedure, but know that an insurance company reimburses
$700, they will charge $800, knowing that you'll be happy to
"only" pay $100. The insurance company doesn't care, because
they will just increase premiums for the additional costs.
Patients will go along, because they look at it and say "What the
heck, if I didn't have insurance, I would have paid $500.
Government Regulations: Problem # 2
The FDA is in the pockets of the pharmaceutical
companies. Enough said there.
Lawsuits: Problem # 3
Cause: greed on everyone's part, which results in costs of
lawsuits being passed on in the form of increased costs across the board.
Originally posted by pikypikyWhether the government has the right of ‘cap’ on fast and effective treatment is something to consider in light of how socializing healthcare system didn’t work for the Canadians.
Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck
I'm sure You cannot argue that private insurance works on the principal of profit. One can deliver medicine much cheaper by eliminating the profit motive from its delivery. No, it's not creeping communism...if anything it's creeping Christianity.
Originally posted by 44soulslayer
I agree with this man.
Rights only exist so long as the method of enforcing that right does not conflict with the natural rights of any other person.
For example, everyone has a right to free will and do whatever they want. However, if they "want" to kill someone else, then they cannot as it interferes with the other person's right to life.
So how does socialized healthcare come into this? Well to provide a "right to healthcare", the government would have to tax other people. Taxes take away money from others, therefore infringing their natural property rights.
To make money requires effort and time, and time is a measure of how long a person has spent of their life. Therefore if you take away someone's property that they have worked for, you are taking away a part of their life. This is why theft and taxes are tantamount to fractional murder.
The "right" to healthcare cannot be enforced without committing fractional murder on some other person (ie the rich man), therefore it should be unenforceable, and therefore doesn't exist.
Originally posted by whaaa But a difficult concept for the Right wingnuts to comprehend. I find it ironic that many conservatives embrace the Christian religion but reject the basic tenents in favor of greed and selfinterest.
Originally posted by Badgered1
Why not have socialized medicine? You could always have your own private thing going too. Ever think of that? If you're so intent on paying way too much for healthcare, and like feeding the insurance companies, why not?
Too much money would come from the taxpayer? Because the taxpayer is paying the right amount of money right now, for all the right reasons, for spending exactly where we want it? Right? Wrong.
Sure, it might be a small burden, but wouldn't it be nice not to watch people die from poverty?
Oh, I see. So many people have bought the whole "Socialism IS Communism" thing that's been forced down their throats. Well, logically that means "Conservativism IS Fascism". QED.
Exact match, based on the logic of the first statement.
All conservatives are fascists. Hoisted by your own petard.
Or am I wrong? Can't have it both ways....
What's so wrong about having healthy people in the populace? What's so wrong about caring for others? Why is there such an "every man for himself" scream going up from the right?
Why the hell not?
Will it help people? Yes.
Will the standard of service go down? Probably not. And it wouldn't preclude private health plans.
Will people be generally more healthy? Yes.
Will this increase productivity? Yes.
Does it 'work' in all the countries around the world that have it? Yes.
Are they so far behind the US in productivity, work ethic, wealth? Not really.
I just believe that being vehemently against 'socialised' medicine is basically just driving another wedge between the haves and the have-nots.
Insurance companies want your premiums. They don't want to pay for your damned health care. Doctors/Hospitals do want to take care of you, but they are too busy filling out paperwork to help the insurance companies deny your claim.
Life,liberty, freedom! (So long as the "life" bit doesn't include any pre-existing conditions, eh?)
It was not that long ago that we had health care without the benefit of insurance. In fact insurance was unheard of just like a hospital operating for profit was unheard of and the system worked fine. It was not until BC/BS came along with their innovative concept of health insurance that the whole system came tumbling down. Get rid of health insurance companies all together they are a plague to health and wellness and their motive is pure greed.