Ghost Rides Rocking Horse (Video)

Originally posted by Pimpish

My apologies on the "believer" part, I got that post mixed with another...so many pages.

Accepted .. no worries at all.

Originally posted by Pimpish
Yes, I listened with my headphones. I listened with my speakers. I listened on my internal laptop speakers, I listened on my external laptop speakers. I listened with my mother's speakers, I listened on my mother's headphones and she has some bose noise cancelling crap because of her job. Every single time it has sounded like a whisper from behind the mic.

Fair nuff ... And I won't try to convince you of anything.

As a tip, however, try to focus on the faint echo the comes off the word "Wire"

Personally I can hear clear as a bell, but I have been listening to this kind of thing for years. It's called reverb in the industry.

A whisper in the same room from behind the mic would have no appreciable reverb.

Originally posted by Pimpish
Really that is a minor point anyway, as the word wire had little to none to do with why I think the video is a fake.

I believe in ghosts. I do not believe this video.

Again, fair nuff ... some other posters, however, have used the argument of the whisper as a basis for debunking the vid and I thought I would help to try to clear up that point.

I agree ... it this video is going to be debunked, it aint gonna be just from the audio.

reply to post by Horza


I feel like the reverb could just as easily come from the wall/desk/whatever else is next to him, but you're the expert so I'll bow to you on that one. I was thinking about playing around with my headset and having people listen to it and see if they think i'm whispering or yelling...but I'm too lazy

Either way, I don't feel like it's a real video, whisper or yell. The reason I first posted was not to try and "debunk" this video, because really without better quality that isn't possible anyway. It was more to address the amount of posts that were like "wow theres no way that could be faked". It certainly could. I don't know that this was. I think it was, but I could not possibly prove that, just as anyone else couldn't possibly prove that it's a ghost rocking the horse.

I'm not a debunker, I just call em as I see em. I've thought many things were quite real only to see other people debunk them rather convincingly, so it's definitely not as if I am always right, in either direction

I always enjoy a healthy debate though, and even though I may disagree with someone's opinion, I always appreciate it.

Originally posted by Pimpish
Luckily I trust my ears more than I trust an audio expect.

Amazing!

You not only ignore the statements of three creditable witnesses,
but also the analysis of the audio by not 1 - but 2 - audio engineers.

Not to mention the general consensus of both posters, as well people who were surveyed - that were totally unaware of the contents - who ALL came to the conclusion that the word was "Liar".

So, dare I exercise futility and ask you to outline your qualifications that makes your opinion more credible than:
a) credible explanations
b) expert analysis
c) general consensus of posters and independent outside witnesses?

Originally posted by Pimpish
You seem to lean towards the supernatural, I happen to lean towards the natural.

No. What I cans see is that you lean towards ignoring solid facts and overweening opinion.

reply to post by Pimpish


About the "whisper".

First let me say that I understand you consider this a minor point, and I completely agree. I find it humorous that I am even debating such an insignificant issue to such length, and in such detail (internet forums are the devil!). I am not trying to drag the discussion out unnecessarily, but:

Horza and I are speaking from experience here. As I stated in my first post, the sound's envelope properties, like the decay, sustain and timbre, make it clear to trained ears that this is not a whisper.

Originally posted by Pimpish

I feel like the reverb could just as easily come from the wall/desk/whatever else is next to him, but you're the expert so I'll bow to you on that one.

As Horza stated, a whisper would have no appreciable reverb.

Just to explain a bit about reverb and room acoustics: A whisper has a small sound output as well as a very short sustain and an extremely fast decay - it's not going to have the time or the energy to travel far enough to bounce off of anything and make it back to your ears (or in this case, the microphone) at any perceptible level.

Originally posted by Horza

Personally I can hear clear as a bell, but I have been listening to this kind of thing for years.

Precisely my sentiments, and the reason I stubbornly persist on this issue. Sure, people have different opinions on this, but the opinion I and Horza offer is backed by years of experience and formal education regarding the science of sound.

Originally posted by Pimpish

Why could it not be the more mundane explanation?

In this case, was it someone surreptitiously whispering "wire" to their accomplice, in order to indicate that the popularly proposed method of deception be initiated...

OR

...like the father stated, he yelled "liar" at the television from outside of the room?

Originally posted by Teebs
***snip***
I was hoping my explanation (and others) would help put this particular issue to rest, but since it still seems to be a point of contention I will add that I have a degree in Audio Engineering, have worked as an audio editor for a radio station and have experience in commercial recording studios, among other things. And, in the opinion of my trained ears, there is an infinitesimally small amount of doubt that this noise is anything other than someone yelling from another room.
***snip***

Isn't it amazing how we interpret things differently?

A friend at the Danish Technological University (sound engineer Ib Johansen) listened to the sound (did not see the video) and stated that the word is "wire" and that it came from close proximity of the camera.
He also said that the accustical properties of the sound makes it HIGHLY unlikely that it originated from outside the room.
Sounds from outside the room are fairly muffled which is not the case of the word "wire".

Originally posted by mckyle

Originally posted by Pimpish
Luckily I trust my ears more than I trust an audio expect.

Amazing!

You not only ignore the statements of three creditable witnesses,
but also the analysis of the audio by not 1 - but 2 - audio engineers.

Make that three: Teebs, Horza and myself.

We have all said exactly the same thing, perhaps the next accusation will be we are all one and the same.

Originally posted by Goathief

Originally posted by mckyle

Originally posted by Pimpish
Luckily I trust my ears more than I trust an audio expect.

Amazing!

You not only ignore the statements of three creditable witnesses,
but also the analysis of the audio by not 1 - but 2 - audio engineers.

Make that three: Teebs, Horza and myself.

We have all said exactly the same thing, perhaps the next accusation will be we are all one and the same.

Perhaps there is a logical explanation for the word "wire" to have the reverb and timbre already mentioned extensively.

Maybe it is said in a clear voice and the hoaxer forgot to cut out that bit of video before posting it.



OH! I nearly forgot.
Three experts(?) for and at least one against. PLUS myself who is humbly working with digital film and audio on a daily basis.

And the main reason I keep posting on this topic is beacuse I believe in ghosts. I have felt them, I have smelt one. I have heard one.
I have also seen a lot of fake video of many things.
I hate fakes. And hoaxers.

[edit on 8.3.2009 by HolgerTheDane]

I just watched the video again with headphones on something I'd not got around to doing yet.

I couldn't distinguish if the word was 'wire' or 'liar' but to my untrained ear this was definitely a shout and not a whisper. I'm actually surprised that anyone could interpret this as a whisper.

There's a simple experiment that anyone here can do. Just record yourself whispering liar/wire and then calling it from another room. You will hear that the whisper has a much more sibilant quality and that the shout reverberates more (as already stated by the audio engineers who have posted).

One final point, if this had been hoaxed why would anyone whisper 'wire' anyway? It implies two people in a small room who presumably would be able to see each other so why would they not use a simple hand signal? It defies belief that they would state their method of hoaxing on the actual video. It would be like a UFO hoaxer whispering 'CGI' on their video

Furthermore if it was a hoax would they not have watched it before posting it? Assuming that they would, they would have easily heard this mistake and simply refilmed the video. If they're going to go to all the effort of installing fishing wire, pullies, drilling holes in the floor and whatever else has been suggested to make their hoax convincing you'd think they'd have done more than one take.

Unless they were hoaxing to a deadline of course

reply to MarrsAttax


I completely agree lol, its sounded to me like a yell the whole time and was astounded when other people thought it was a whisper. And you make an excellent point about the "wire" noise.

Did anyone download the video when it was originally posted?

I'd love to compare the soundtrack from then and now.

Originally posted by HolgerTheDane
Did anyone download the video when it was originally posted?

I'd love to compare the soundtrack from then and now.

When it was originally posted? Its still the same one. When my dad gets his 8mm player tho I or he will post the longer one and hopefully better quality version

Originally posted by MethosWare
reply to Electro38

Do you know if your parents were fighting/arguing, or if the environment in your house at that time was very stressful?

(Couples usually split up around the time when their kid goes to school, around age 5 or 6. I don't know why really, but I think it has something to do with the couple needing each other more when there is a baby to take care of.)

Do you have siblings?

Thanks.

I dont think my parents were arguing, when my dad walks out you can hear him say hey teresa, before she leaves on an errand. I have siblings now but at the time no he wasnt born yet.

Thanks. What I meant was, were your parents fighting/arguing during this period of time? Not during the filming. Was there tension in the house around the time these things were happening?

(I know you wouldn't remember first hand, but maybe your mom or dad "clued you in" at some point in your life about what life was like in your house at that time.)

Do you ever have events like that happen these days?

Why did your parents split up? (i.e. was one of them having an affair?)
Did they split up when you started school, or did they wait until your younger sibling started school?

(Sorry to get so personal, I know you know you don't have to answer if you don't want to. I find this very fascinating.)

Thanks again, I appreciate it.

(edited to fix quotes)

[edit on 8-3-2009 by Electro38]

reply to post by mckyle

but also the analysis of the audio by not 1 - but 2 - audio engineers

I must have missed the analysis, please, point it out to me. All I see are what they think they are hearing, no actual analysis was done, just their "years of experience" told them it's a yell. Which is fine, and like I said anyways, a minor point.

To all those who are so sure he's yelling, so what? Even if he is yelling the word from another room, he could still just as easily be giving a signal. And as I said, I find that a very minor point anyways as that really had very little to do with why I thought this video was fake. Apparently there is at least one audio expert that agrees with me, so I can't be totally off my rocker like some seem to be implying.

If you choose to believe this is real, yay for you, have fun...enjoy it. It doesn't bother me one bit, I am NOT trying to debunk this video. I feel as if it's not real, that is just my opinion. If you disagree with me, fine. That isn't my point, my point is that this could just as easily be faked as be real, and I don't see how anyone could disagree with that.

reply to post by MarrsAttax

If they're going to go to all the effort of installing fishing wire, pullies, drilling holes in the floor and whatever else has been suggested to make their hoax convincing

I personally think it would be much more easy to just tie about a 15 pound test line to the head area of the horse, run the string down using the metal frame on the bottom as a sort of pulley, and then run the string underneath to the closet. Then just pull the string from inside the closet, and tada, ghost horse!!

I'm not saying this is what they did, how could I possibly know. What i'm saying is, I do not think this would be as hard to fake as you're making out, no need for a pulley system or holes in the floor, too elaborate.

reply to post by MethosWare


I think I also hear your dad say the word 'liar' at 1:05 and this might be strecthing it but I think I can hear you say it back to him at 1:59

Originally posted by Pimpish
reply to post by MarrsAttax

 

If they're going to go to all the effort of installing fishing wire, pullies, drilling holes in the floor and whatever else has been suggested to make their hoax convincing

I personally think it would be much more easy to just tie about a 15 pound test line to the head area of the horse, run the string down using the metal frame on the bottom as a sort of pulley, and then run the string underneath to the closet. Then just pull the string from inside the closet, and tada, ghost horse!!

I'm not saying this is what they did, how could I possibly know. What i'm saying is, I do not think this would be as hard to fake as you're making out, no need for a pulley system or holes in the floor, too elaborate.

Even so, the point remains why would they whisper the word 'wire'? Say there was someone in a cupboard who couldn't see a hand signal. Wouldn't somebody be more likely to say 'ok' or 'now' as a signal? Saying 'wire' seems a little odd to me.

Saying that why the need for a signal at all? Why not just wait for an agreed amount of time before pulling the wire? If they were to start too early before the other person was ready (for what?) then they could have just reshot the video at their leisure.

I'm not sure why such a hoax would have required two people in the first place. One person can set the camera rolling, hide off screen or in a cupboard, wait for a bit and then pull the wire, wait a bit longer before emerging and stopping the camera. The video could then be edited to remove the person's movement or reshot as many times as necessary to get the 'perfect' take.

Also I think you can hear the word 'liar' at other points in the video, which suggests to me this may have been something dad said a lot to his son when they were joking around.

reply to post by MarrsAttax


I don't have an answer for that, but I also couldn't tell you why someone would sit in a building and snipe innocent people, so...not much help there. Really it's a minor point as far as I'm concerned, the word "liar/wire" is really a non-issue. It seems pretty odd to me that a dad would be yelling LIAR at his 3-year-old son, but that's just me...I probably do things with my nephew that people would never do with theirs, so...

Can we please get off that word now though? It's a non-issue and had very little to nothing to do with why I don't think this video is real. You can prove to me that its a yell from the other room, you can prove to me that it's a whisper behind the mic...either way, I would think the video is a fake because of the other reasons I already stated.

The horse does NOT stop on a dime, watch more closely, there is a very slight pause before it goes back to neutral. The horse never goes backwards other than momentum that the spring would carry it from being pulled forward, but then again I see it act the same way when the child is on it so that doesn't tell us much. The date stamp is gone. The horse has been moved, conveniently near not one, but TWO doors. It's poor video quality, so there could easily be a fishing line there that we wouldn't be able to see...or...it's a ghost.

Believe what you will, just don't go spouting off that this is definitely real and that it could not be faked, that is absolutely not true. As for motives...fun? Playing a prank on his wife, who starts telling other people in the family, and next thing you know it's family legend and they're telling stories around the campfire. Why would you come out about faking it at that point? It would be much more fun as a campfire story.

Once again, just my opinion, and I have no facts to back it up other than what I stated that I see above, and really that is inconclusive anyways. So, who knows?


*EDIT* The entire post is not directed at you Mars, sorry it kind of seemed that way. I don't recall you ever saying that this could not be faked

[edit on 8-3-2009 by Pimpish]

Originally posted by Pimpish

The horse does NOT stop on a dime, watch more closely, there is a very slight pause before it goes back to neutral. The horse never goes backwards other than momentum that the spring would carry it from being pulled forward, but then again I see it act the same way when the child is on it so that doesn't tell us much. The date stamp is gone. The horse has been moved, conveniently near not one, but TWO doors. It's poor video quality, so there could easily be a fishing line there that we wouldn't be able to see...or...it's a ghost.

You want us to explain the movements of what many people believe is a ghost? Although I'm still not sure if I believe in ghosts or not I definitely couldnt tell you why one would slightly pause before going to neutral. We are working on getting a better quality conversion done but untill then poor video quality is a good point. Everyone worrying about the time stamp, it doesnt really matter you can tell its the same horse and same room and if you watch the 2nd video you can just about be assured that the ghost video was taken in between the other two, if not its definitely way before 2009 as we havent lived in that house for years and no longer own that horse.

reply to post by MethosWare

You want us to explain the movements of what many people believe is a ghost?

I never asked anyone to explain any movement of any ghost. I'm not sure where that came from, or why it is relevant. I was pointing out why it could easily be a line of some sort, not why it could be a ghost.

[edit on 8-3-2009 by Pimpish]

Sorry, "proof" of NOTHING. Dark, heavily pixilated video from a low-res source. I don't mean to be casting aspersions, but it COULD hide all sorts of fraudulent methods, so we just can't call it proof. If you want to believe, it's sort of creepy, but in addition to fraud we have no information on the location so I also could not rule out some type of natural phenomena acting on the springs. But mostly, the video quality could quite easily hide a prank. The more you believe in real ghosts, the more you have to admit that or you undermine the basis for all your other "evidence".