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Counterfeiting gold and silver coinage is legal in China, how widespread is this?

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posted on Mar, 3 2009 @ 01:54 PM
I was tipped into a developing story that the MSM is reluctant to report on which we began discussing in "The Official 'up-to-the-minute Market Data' thread". . Apparently a lot of gold and silver coins and bars are being found to be counterfeit. The source is from China, and the scope of this operation may very widespread.

From external source:
Liu Ciyun (who prefers to be known by his eBay handle, “Jinghuashei”) is a typical young upwardly-mobile Chinese suburbanite. Married, with a 2-year-old son, Jinghuashei has worked hard the past few years to build a business. Like most legitimate businessmen, Jinghuashei operates within the laws of his country, and has earned official certification for his small production facility, which employs up to 30 people. The products he sells are properly licensed, where appropriate, and absolutely, 100 percent legal to produce and sell in China. The only fault that most Americans might find with Jinghuashei’s business model is that he is in the business of producing counterfeit coins. Jinghuashei’s company is called the Big Tree Coin Factory. It is located in the Fujian (also known as Fukien) province in the southeast portion of the People’s Republic of China. This area is well known to be a hotbed of counterfeiting activity and Jinghuashei acknowledges being aware of approximately 100 competitors who are manufacturing fake coins. Jinghuashei says that his coin factory is probably the largest of its type in China. It produces in excess of 100,000 fake coins per month for Chinese coin types alone. He says he is currently only selling about 1,000 counterfeit U.S. coins per month, mostly on eBay. His primary motivation for servicing this comparatively small volume business is that he is making contacts with people he hopes will come to China to buy counterfeit coins on a wholesale basis.

Sorry that this link requires you to fill in email address. Just put anything in the field.

Here is a listing of some of the frauds uncovered so far:

1. The U.S .Morgan silver dollar. All dates and all mint marks

2. The U.S. gold coins viz the $2.50, $5.00 and $10.00 Indian head.

3. The U.S. copper penny viz 1909 S vdb

4. Three gold Imperial Russian roubles from the reign of Nicholas II

5. A gold 20 franc coin with the head of Napoleon I on the obverse

6. The South African Krugerrand

7. British sovereigns and half sovereigns of different monarchs and dates

8. And in addition, they are also making fake gold bars from the Credit Suisse people.

There is an unsubstantiated rumor that this may be the tip of the iceberg and that there may be a LOT of bars out there which are also counterfeit. Perhaps part of Hillary's recent trip to China? Surely something to keep an eye on.

A special thanks to Hx3_1963, redhatty and pause4thought (as well as a few others) for pointing me to additional sources for this little-reported story.

[edit on 3-3-2009 by nydsdan]

posted on Mar, 3 2009 @ 02:23 PM
Wonder how ebay will respond to this if he is selling coins on their site. Now I have to check on the coins I already have. Good find, keep us posted.

posted on Mar, 3 2009 @ 02:27 PM
Well...being as most of US & UK gold has already been looted...what better way to get the rest...good or bad types...start illegal bogus gold or rumor of it...everyone sells...price goes buy it up on the have it all...NWO...

see how it works?!?!?

posted on Mar, 3 2009 @ 02:29 PM
2 reasons why I find this story dubious. The author downplays it and Rense as a source.

1. had a second report from Susan Headley on the counterfeiting problem in China.


Long term, probably this report on Chinese counterfeiting may not amount to much.

[edit on 3-3-2009 by venividivici]

posted on Mar, 3 2009 @ 02:34 PM
That is a good point, venividivici. Hopefully you are right and the rumor I have heard is false. If the unsubstantiated (as of now) rumor starts to yield some evidence, I will be sure to update this thread. It is a scary thought to think that certain entities could be manipulating the markets via counterfeit precious metals.

Wow, I actually had a hard time keeping a straight face when talking about 'manipulating the markets' since the US has been doing it for so long.

[edit on 3-3-2009 by nydsdan]

posted on Mar, 3 2009 @ 02:36 PM
reply to post by venividivici
You MIGHT be right...

I'd poke through this

Here's just one of MANY...
PCGS to Display Chinese Coin Dies for Counterfeit Coins

[edit on 3/3/2009 by Hx3_1963]

posted on Mar, 3 2009 @ 03:24 PM
Before posting my reply to the OP I did a Google NEWS search ( last 30 days) on "counterfeit gold silver china" and got one hit. The article the OP cited. So, either the OP has a scoop on the story, the MSM is ignoring it or it has already been debunked and found to be a rumor. I don't doubt there is massive market manipulations on all the markets but I would need more reputable sources before I believe a rumor of this scale.

posted on Mar, 3 2009 @ 03:35 PM
I hope it's not true, especially about the Morgan silver dollars. I'm not a coin collector but several years ago I saw a Morgan that I liked so I picked it up and have held on to it ever since. On today's market it might be worth $20 at most, but a bunch of cheap counterfeits would still hurt it's value.

It's my lucky piece

posted on Mar, 3 2009 @ 03:39 PM
reply to post by venividivici
Well I did a straight home page search and got lots of references...

...of course MSM isn't gonna jump on this...think of who owns/controls 'em...why would they?

Let it "leak" to start a rumor fear factor...much more effective...under the direct links to manipulation?

[edit on 3/3/2009 by Hx3_1963]

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