When does a group belief become a cult and why?

page: 5
12
<< 2  3  4    6  7  8 >>

log in

join

posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 09:12 AM
link   
reply to post by Paul_Richard
 





I firmly believe that it is quite possible to do, very hard to do - as it requires a great deal of dedication and spiritual discipline over a period of many years - and that it cannot be achieved at all through traditional methods. Which is why everyone up to this point has failed in the attempt.


This brings us to the concept of REINCARNATION.

Now, it may be really impossible to accomplish this goal in one life time, so the idea of reincarnation comes to play together with the idea of karma - the action-reaction principle.

The way I see it, knowledge is accumulated as our experience, and it is metaphysical package, pure force, which we call Self.

Since our combined perception including reason is actually our physical body, and this body is the experience of the world itself, when the body dies, what is left is this energy package - experience. Being the force it cannot be destroyed as physical body.

This remains an open question, because I have no experience to confirm it, but it seems logical to me:

IF this experience can survive physical death, it can be reborn.

Now, the newly born sentient being (not necessarily human) will have this energy package for starters. And it is relatively big, this person will probably express as some special talent, special ability of some kind. Like talent for arts, mathematics, philosophy, charisma, etc.

What is most certainly lost is just the concrete, "private" historical agenda, a biography so to say.

But energy package, being the force i.e. knowledge will give this person ability to deal with obstacles, first in form of intuition (silent knowledge, or sometimes simply designated as "luck", born under lucky star).

So, I believe that it is possible to accumulate and gradually advance towards the ideal state, which in Christianity is called God-Man and I don't think that the idea of monopolizing it makes any sense at all and it is very wrong and oppressive.

How many life times it may take, depends on the effort invested in this spiritual mode of being.

This is just my hypothesis, it is in accordance with many existing beliefs, and whether it is right or wrong is of less importance, because right now I find id quite operational and useful as a measure which applies to what I'm doing.




posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 09:23 AM
link   

Originally posted by DangerDeath
First, at least where I live, they prefer to call them a "sect" rather than "cult". In truth, Catholicism, Orthodoxy, Protestantism are sects of Christianity.

That's right, outside of those that have pedophiles in their clergy (making them malevolent or destructive cults), they are all technically sects.


Originally posted by DangerDeath
I say there probably are such Christian sects or cults which believe that it is possible for a man or a woman to gradually advance and become like Christ, to attain such "divine" nature. I didn't mean "gods" like in pagan sense.

I have not come across any that do, hence the reason behind my question.


Originally posted by DangerDeath
Protestantism was about denying authority of the Church, claiming that person didn't need mediating role of priest in order to be in communion. They chose the "Book" to be the highest authority as a source of instructions on how to accomplish this feat.

There are other fundamental differences - in theological focus at least - between Catholicism and Protestantism.

For example, the former sect espouses that good works as well as believing in Christ as Lord, are both necessary to get one into heaven.

In contrast, a key tenet in Protestantism is that you only have to believe in Jesus Christ as your personal savior, that in doing so you will be completely forgiven for your sins, and thereby be able to get into heaven.

As the quote from Emanuel Swedenborg in my signature suggests: I side more with the good works than personal savior opinion about going to a spiritual place after death.


[edit on 4-3-2009 by Paul_Richard]



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 09:31 AM
link   
reply to post by DangerDeath
 

That is a good hypothesis


I agree that all talents and genius stem from former experience. That is why certain people have more aptitudes in some areas than others, as they simply cultivated that at some point prior to their current incarnation.




posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 09:38 AM
link   
I really can't get into other people's heads and know exactly what it means "to believe in Jesus Christ".

Doing good certainly accumulates a bit of energy because it involves personal effort to abide by certain rules, which in turn has to increase one's understanding. So it is not necessarily some kind of "robotic" following of the precepts. But the latter cases I don't exclude. I think that protocol behavior alone doesn't contribute to one's experience.

Personal effort, intent, mindfulness, is of key importance for developing knowledge (ethics). The source of action is Self.



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 09:40 AM
link   
Somebody doesn't understand the Formless and the Formed Two-way flow sequence, clearly depicted by both Walter Russell and Don Juan, one as theoretical, the other experiential.

Throwing philosophical concepts in the 'understanding process' of the Cycle of Light, is hilarity itself. Yet this is exactly how control exudes power.

Let us dissemble a bit: Pretend there's Nothing: no symbol for this: just Nothing (which is something, both non-special and special): Now conceive this concept as a potential Oneness...Oh! It is! It has discovered Itself: It Pre-Existed as Itself (?), and It has Found Itself (Instrinsic Intelligence), and calls Itself The WORD....Both a dot and a waveform (line-to-curved line). Recognition of this potential turns the Wave and the Dot (particle, sorry) into a Potentiality of Expression, because it is Pre-Existing: It is called Absolute Perfection, the unique Circle. How could this exist? Well, it doesn't and it does. This is the very WORD Potency, this Pre-Existence Potential as Perfection: It is how it is all done.

The Original Motion, or Initial Impetus, was the First 'ID' to recognize this and Express this Truth, who has Always Been and Will Ever Be: That's why Mind (Substance-Force-Spirit) Recognizes Itself: It's the WORD: Can I explain this Pre-Existence or Intitial Impetus? No, and neither can anybody else. But it can be Perceived. Luckily, I was shown this, and mind you, it is not so unique that it is not found described here on ATS by others, and in many erudite links, because I have seen many of them, and they are All Wrong. Which is Why I haven't described What I was Shown: The description would make it wrong by the very Word: for what everybody must know is The WORD is Real, but Everything Else Isn't: It is All Reflection: Symbolism of Potency.

That's right, the Real and the Unreal. The Reflected or Symbolic Existence is what creates the seemingness of Being & Intelligence: It's a stunning journey of Perception that recognizes Itself and Blinks Off. People deny being symbols, and enhance their perpetuity, which, in the long run, is very good: long life. In Ignorance.

Let's take the LifeForce as an example of the Ultimate Truth: Substance-Force-Energy: Cash Symbol. Here is a Planet, called Earth, filled with these Ignorant self-aware 'becoming' things called 'humanity' (and othersuch): They represent themselves as Lifeforce, and Express as Cash or the Tirinity of Lifeforce Symbolism: Cash: It's merely a concept, whether it's 'based' on Something or Nothing: It actually is Power: All Power: people have Sold themselves (their 'Soul') for their Own Unreal Reflected Image of Themselves, their very LifeForce, which is Presented at the Ultimate Highest Level (the Eye in the Pyramid Capstone) as Cash.

Whoa! this guy is crazy! We could Sell this stuff: if only it was 'real.'

It is, and somebody Does sell this stuff: Creation, the Ultimate Cult (Mother-Father Cults). Grasping this is not possible from the Point of Self-Reflection or the Dot (viewpoint), which some here like to express as Particle awareness. When you overcome this, and perception grows-evolves, you become aware of One Self, which Dissolves all this: the Symbol Crashes: life dies: matter disappears in a seeming internal refolding flow of self-reflection (anybody following? this is often called or represented as the Double-Vortexes, by any other name).

So, now you all know what cash Truly Is. It's You. And your friends will do anything to Enslave you for this: and so will the aliens. 'Join their Cult' is the Irresistible Call!

Another little piece of info: it's an itty bitty one: The ARC, the Circle, the Pyramid, the Square. Let's not try to describe it all Right Now. Few here (if anybody) Know that I have just Described The WORD Potency. This is found endlessly as the 'hidden secret', this WORD. You can't touch It! You can Be it! but you can't Touch It (nothing exists that is solid, anywhere, except this WORD, Perfect Formless-Form). But I want to pick one of those aspects of this Perfect WORD: the Triangle:

Here is The Pyramid: but stop-it, didn't somebody say this was what is sold as illusion? Correct: You are a Pyramid of Consciousness! Oh, BS to the nth degree! (Re-read the beginning part of this post 'Now'). Yup, that's right, You Are Pyramid: Ensconced ("to place or conceal in a secure place") within your Sacred Center, your 'head' (the Captsone), is the Energetic Principle of Yourself: a Pyramid about 1-1/4" high, set in a circle of energy-potential: this actually exists as a template within your head, and it is clouded over by a grayish murky mist: I can see it: but few can, so they deny themselves. Go ahead Within: Search for it: It will eventually reveal Itself to you: I discovered it purely spontaneously, and everything Flowed from this Awareness Perception: We manifest as Pyramids, either Upright or Inverted (point up-point down). To deny this is to perpetuate self denial, or Self as Form.

Somebody who doesn't admit to the Capstone as the Living Light (please note the word 'living'), hasn't gone through the spontaneous generation of Cosmic Consciousness. Until this is experienced, you are Denial of Self, and can keep your Fear of Death, which generates you in Unknowing, or life as the Symbol made Flesh.

So, there is the Secret of the Pyramid: it is not open to argument, or debate, It merely Is as Truth. How did I discover all this? Spontaneous Cosmic Consciousness and the Transmission-Reception of The WORD (as Substance and Structure) via the SilverLight Radiating terrestrial alien naga being (1984). So, until you enter such Realization~Knowing~Wisdom~Awareness-[Emanation], you will deny all this, and pay your lifeForce out as Cash to the first and hopefully highest 'bidder.'

Deny the Pyramid, deny the Self as Symbol, and you will remain the Pyramid, which is Consciousness.

Now, consciousness evolves into Ultimate Awareness, don't forget: the ARC, the Circle, the Pyramid, the Square. And this is not explainable, regardless what science is able to 'do' with the study of this knowledge: to build 'things' to express it makes it Powerful: to Become It, Is Power. This is the War of the Cults.

+++Continued+++++Continued++++++Continued+++

This is called the Capstone Path.

I would like you to join my 'Cult.'

All I ask, is $10,000! Hey, come back!

How about $1000!? Stop! How about $1.00!!??? (what a deal!)

(Dagnabbit, these people need to be shown!)

I have Power, and I will Show You How to Have This Power! It's Free!

Slowly, the people return.

If you Reveal the Truth, they (Power) will Run; if you Lure with Deception, the will Gather to You in endless droves (didn't know this? can you say: religion: somebody at the 'Capstone' of all religions actually 'Knows'.)

Truth is frightening: It reveals Death-Rebirth-Resurrection (Regeneration), and is the scariest thing of All: if you don't believe me, wait until you stand upon the Abyss, and A voice calls: Jump! You will feel a vertigo like none other, and fall into the abysssss (of Self-Death), because you recognize what it is: Annihilation of Self (Ego) [see signature]. Doesn't matter if there's a Shiny Rainbow Bridge running across the Eye of the Abyss that you stand upon, you will be Impelled to Run, and this running will guarantee your falling into the Abyss, for the Secret is this: Hesitation is called Impurity, and the minute you touch the Rainbow Bridge, it will disappear beneath you! You are Unworthy to Join the Ancients (the Many in One: Awareness of One Self, the Living Capstone).

Along comes this Form: oh, it's a reincarnator! Good! "hey, you!' 'Wanna learn some secrets!?'

You are a Renewable Source of Lifeforce Energy, forever for the taking by those who are at the Top, but Refuse to Enter Within the Capstone, (call it the 'cistern') which path Itself is...through the Eye of the Vortex.



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 10:29 AM
link   
reply to post by DangerDeath
 



Not everybody is quite so self-motivated

Jesus at times can be a good excuse not to get caught up with the wrong people



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 10:35 AM
link   
the fractal frog


the old frog with slanted eyes
lazy, hungry -
the sage–frog;
so strong, so quick
so emotionally still;
:no one to challenge it,
no one to bother this stubborn,
spiteful, bulging
gaping-being

shaded well and ever watching
from its flowing–and–unrolling dream,
dreaming the limits,
the bug-food,
the softest humid bed,
heaving, breathing thru its gleaming skin…
the lazy, old, frog:
so unquestionably sad

whoever would have thought he was
the scientist
once,
hubologist–preacher
the most cunning thinker in this
rusty world,
the biggest liar of his lot!
then he died the canker–death,
was reborn
as swollen fish–eyed frog…

he is settled in the dark–deep jungle
not so endless, not so big
just a patch
in concrete&asphalt grid:
aetherical–vibrant space;
his pigment matches that of moss:
yellow and green,
he drinks rain, he winks at sun
he hears voices, like torrents
and swims with them
towards their silent, spinning whirl…
for he has found the all–embracing
end

:not particles, not waves
not tilted spheres,
trajectories,
accelerated mass
of the burnt red stars…
none of them is the cause
of his inexplicable presence:
just like
the surface of the pond:
still, soft, reflecting:
there he can reach for,
but never touch,
his ever–springing source

yes, this pulsing vivid frog: knows
how the dreamer can be dreamt
and how to, yet unmoved,
turn the wheel of life–and–death
and still be one
with god

21.07.1999.



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 10:39 AM
link   
Not to mention, jesu never existed. Period.

It was a composite contrivement spearheaded by Emperor Constantine during the Council of Nicea.

A joshua existed (reputedly), who's ideals were idealized in many pre-Nicea writings. He was not the inspiration of the jesu figurine used for the bible mythos. This was 'jesu,' or I-E-SU, meaning All Knowledge.

But, whoever prefers the Great Darkness is welcome to live in their Cave (womb): it's Bright out here (blinding). We understand.

Cult. Sect. No difference. Ignorance turned into an Effigy.

[edit on 4-3-2009 by SS,Naga]



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 10:57 AM
link   

Originally posted by SS,Naga

You are a Renewable Source of Lifeforce Energy, forever for the taking by those who are at the Top, but Refuse to Enter Within the Capstone, (call it the 'cistern') which path Itself is...through the Eye of the Vortex.


Hello SS,Naga. I must say this thread is worth reading just for your posts. There is something I find about them very interesting , maybe its because I have to really really think to follow them. Its as if they push my quest to understand more...or something like that!

What you have wrote above sounds very interesting indeed, but I cant say I totally get it (I dont think Im alone here!) I will read it again but are you saying we get constantly reincarnated when really we dont need to?



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 11:14 AM
link   
reply to post by Mr Green
 


It's more like people choose reincarnation rather than Realization, which leads to the opportunity of Death-Rebirth-Resurrection-[regeneration].

Both Poles of Being (matter and Spirit) may be Unified (through hard effort Intent), and the Androgynous State attempted: Both aspects of the Self (Higher & Lower, or Spirit-Matter) are needed, just as Two Wings are required in order to 'Fly.' These are the Wings of the Soul (I could say mind, but I would lose everyone: same thing).

Fear of Annihilation is what stops everyone: it's a horrid fear, self-perpetuating through endless incarnations, and with good reason. To attain the 'Chance,' even, one must plumb the depths (hell) so they may rise to the heights (heaven): this is the Springboarding of Energy, or the Mystical Marriage: the Leap of 'Faith.' See the Beauty?

In the End, even obtaining this opportunity, it is Worth Sacrificing All.

This is called the Denouement of the Cycle of Light, and what It is all about. Very few succeed: on the Other side, you will find old friends, legends, The Ancients, the Many in One: Immortal Self-Perpetuating Oneness. One always remains behind, waiting to Catch your Hand in Your Leap, if you only will make the Pure Effort. But nobody knows this. They think they are are alone: SomeOne is Waiting.


I would open you to the attack so that you could eventually understand the nature of such instances of experience as we of the Fellowship have come to know. This is the only way to be free. You cannot attain Freedom in the dark enclosures of your closets. You must not let the closet consciousness delude you. You must step out of the closet into the larger world. You must confront what is there in the larger realm and reconcile it even though it might kill you. What is death in comparison to the possibility of Realization?
("Scales of the Dragon," A.Dragon)


[edit on 4-3-2009 by SS,Naga]



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 11:22 AM
link   

Originally posted by SS,Naga

Fear of Annihilation is what stops everyone: it's a horrid fear, self-perpetuating through endless incarnations, and with good reason. To attain the 'Chance,' even, one must plumb the depths (hell) so they may rise to the heights (heaven): this is the Springboarding of Energy, or the mystical Marriage: the Leap of 'Faith.'

In the End, even obtaining this opportunity, it is Worth Sacrificing All.



Yes it seems fear is at the root of a lot of our problems. Its like its so deeply wired into us its hard to break free from, especially in the situation above that you describe. If it is so horrid I can see why we would fear it.



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 11:26 AM
link   
Fear is the expression of a system falling apart.
It persists as one clings to things which are of impermanent nature.



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 11:32 AM
link   

Originally posted by SS,Naga
Both Poles of Being (matter and Spirit) may be Unified (through hard effort Intent), and the Androgynous State attempted: Both aspects of the Self (Higher & Lower, or Spirit-Matter) are needed, just as Two Wings are required in order to 'Fly.' These are the Wings of the Soul (I could say mind, but I would lose everyone: same thing).



Then to go with the OP does this require a group mentality/cult to achieve or is it a single path? can another aid us in reaching this point ...Id hazard a guess and say no one can help us reach this point except ourselves. Groups give comfort, they are easier than stepping out into the void.

This question could be asked of any other route or belief in the ultimate light, and is not just applicable to yours.



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 11:42 AM
link   
reply to post by DangerDeath
 


reply to post by Mr Green
 


There is no denying this fear: You Know that what is required means leaving the Material Planes of expression behind Forever: There is No Returning, for at this juncture, you are willing to enter the Final Stage of AllBeing, or the 3rd state of attention: There is no returning to Matter...for if successful, you will have Rounded the Cycle of Light, and become Pure Energy (very difficult!). Here is the Tale Told:

The Cycle of Light:

Reincarnation: -- It rounds and rounds upon itself, a pyramidic spiral.

Eternal Progression: -- Onward & Inward & Upward Forever, until the True Dissolving Into Infinity is Achieved, in the spiraling Cone.

Reincarnation - or - Eternal Progression.

Will you leave your friends behind, can you? It is Illusion.

Aristotle: "O my friends, there are no friends!"

[edit on 4-3-2009 by SS,Naga]



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 11:45 AM
link   

Originally posted by Mr Green


Then to go with the OP does this require a group mentality/cult to achieve or is it a single path? can another aid us in reaching this point ...Id hazard a guess and say no one can help us reach this point except ourselves. Groups give comfort, they are easier than stepping out into the void.

This question could be asked of any other route or belief in the ultimate light, and is not just applicable to yours.


I think groups are dangerous for several reasons. Paying attention to what others are doing and talking about is very distracting and prevents you to properly focus on what you are doing.

In meditation centers you are separated from everyone and you communicate with your instructor.

Another person can help you indirectly, helping you articulate your experience. You may adopt someone else's system of interpretation, but don't take it for granted. You should confirm everything with your own experience.

I don't believe that reminders and advices from circular letters are of much help, because phrases learned by heart will never aid you when need be for immediate action.

One has to strive to explain whatever is experienced and should form an interpretation system which is compatible to other existing such systems (philosophical, religious or poetical). Philosophical discourse is the most precise of all.



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 11:54 AM
link   

Originally posted by Mr Green

Originally posted by SS,Naga
Both Poles of Being (matter and Spirit) may be Unified (through hard effort Intent), and the Androgynous State attempted: Both aspects of the Self (Higher & Lower, or Spirit-Matter) are needed, just as Two Wings are required in order to 'Fly.' These are the Wings of the Soul (I could say mind, but I would lose everyone: same thing).



Then to go with the OP does this require a group mentality/cult to achieve or is it a single path? can another aid us in reaching this point ...Id hazard a guess and say no one can help us reach this point except ourselves. Groups give comfort, they are easier than stepping out into the void.

This question could be asked of any other route or belief in the ultimate light, and is not just applicable to yours.


You are entirely alone in this endeavor. You will take clues and insights, and use them to guide yourself. This is called inner unfoldment: everybody wants to hurry and are willing to pay with their Soul energy, as I've posted. Ignore that.

Only in Power can you enter the Company of others in Power. This should be borne in mind. Any group setting is kept seperate until the proper moment, when all acquire the requisite degree of Inner Power. Without it, you are chicken meat, and will be eaten (also as I've posted).

And this paradigm isn't mine, of course, but it is akin to all other 'seemingly different' paths of knowledge: all lead to the same One Place: The Source-Force-Power of Infinity. We all just adopt a method or map that will lead but halfway there, then we are at the Edge of the Abyss, and there is no map. Again, there is no promise.

If one fails, one will succeed. Each who succeeds will Raise All Others below them, until finally, everybody is Brought Home: This Universe blinks Off. It will happen sector by sector. It is seen as Light for a short quick blast* (reflection), then Blinks Off, Becomes Invisible (I have seen this):
Return to the (Invisible)-Brilliance: Alpha & Omega: the #13.

(*This 'blast' can be seen as the White Light of the Constructed Universe; and though it is felt as quick [as described above], in the material plane, it is perceived as Eternity, and can feel like quite a long while. Relative state of awareness, of course.)

[edit on 4-3-2009 by SS,Naga]



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 01:18 PM
link   
when does a cult become a religion?

2nd line



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 01:21 PM
link   
reply to post by SS,Naga
 


The capstone path this is the truth.
You got me interested on this subject, IT IS SCARY ,
That old corny line "The Truth You Cant Handle The Truth" applys rather well.
To let go totally as a self aware self and destroy the EGO which exists in the conscious and the super EGO The inner child which Freud and Berne
write lay in the deep unconscious must be at the point of no return terrifying.
The Cult leader really hasnt got that much work to do.
At some point due to conditioning and deep emotional human level attachment we all condem ourselves.
The advantage the TruthHolder has is he knows we are an infinate bundle of energy and we are harvested.
I see what you mean those at the top be they Illuminati,aliens,spacegods.
have accepted the "truth" and dont enter the inner "cistern" they take from us.
I am not well versed as yourself with all this and dont really understand how the energy is taken.
Is the reincarnation process the key for them is that why most religions
cater for this warm tummy feeling belief.
I see that if everyone jumped without fear into the abyss, energy would stop feeding up to the capstone What would the pyramid model look like without reincarnation.
Its very thought provoking reading .



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 01:27 PM
link   
reply to post by Paul_Richard
 


Why would you label "Scientology" as benevolent? Just curious ...



posted on Mar, 4 2009 @ 01:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by THELONIO
when does a cult become a religion?

2nd line


When it reaches "critical mass". Every cult has the potential for a world religion. The question is what parameters need to be in place for that to happen? Are we due for a new world religion?





new topics
top topics
 
12
<< 2  3  4    6  7  8 >>

log in

join