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When does a group belief become a cult and why?

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posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 02:38 PM
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We talk about cultleaders .This guy was one of the Daddies ,You cant have a thread about Cults without a mention of "Charles Manson" If you reckon the eyes are the windows to the soul.What do yoiu make of this guys soul.
I dont know about you but I get a funny feeling just watching this guy on video. The author of his book reckons he is just a small time thief.
NO WAY.


video.google.co.uk... eo_result_group&resnum=5&ct=title#




posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 03:49 PM
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Cheap demagogy. I'm sure it worked fine with his followers, but anywhere north of that, he is an idiot.

He has no ideology.

He is empty.

A big hammer in his head


But he understands very well that it is better to be irresponsible (incompetent) than responsible.

This is the course of denial so common among people. This decision is made early in childhood. It is much more comfortable to be stupid than smart.

[edit on 7-3-2009 by DangerDeath]



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 04:00 PM
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reply to post by headlightone
 


His eyes in that video look completely dark and dead. His eyes show the true nature of his soul, dark.



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 04:00 PM
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reply to post by DangerDeath
 


I agree his sort make Humanity descend.
He is a totaly indicative of sub human But somehow he really mesmerised his female followers and what he demanded of them they carried out to the letter.
Manson, Jim Jones on the group level Hitler to some extent on the mass level. They all had a sinister mesmerising power over people.
That power in my opinion came not from this world it was something emanating from another dimension.



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 04:11 PM
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reply to post by headlightone
 


What men are afraid the most of is freedom.
Especially if freedom is manifested in - women



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 04:39 PM
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reply to post by DangerDeath
 


You said it! No fair women having an advantage...

I got it! We just won't tell them! Also, we'll make it look
like we're the superior ones! Nah, nobody'd fall for that...

Don Juan gave a slight edge to women.
I don't think the edgewas so slight....
(But please, keep it secret!)



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 04:55 PM
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Sooooo.....

Lets see.

Is Patriarchate a cult?
God the father?
Matriarchy - same inverse?
Mother Goddess? Re-interpretation of Mother Earth idea?

How 'bout monogamy?
Of course, the intensity varies, especially in a monogamist arrangements which can in truth be based on personal relationship rather than on social contract.

But the idea of "contract", "tradition", is totally anti-creative-behavior.
And with consequences...



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 05:10 PM
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One of the most dangerous manipulations in the ritual of "courting".
Women so fall for flattering! Life long decisions are made upon this weakness, the emotional yielding.

(Of course, it applies to both sexes.)

Flatter man, feed his hubris. So easy to gain control. So hard to break the bonds... Mata Harri trickery.

Psychological types, they are creations of this kind to a great extent. Especially useful in social type upgrading. Social protocols.

Cult behavior is everywhere!
The very idea of society is the idea of cult!



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 05:11 PM
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Sorry, that reminds me of my favorite cult of all time!

LDS Polygamy!

Now, there is a horror cult for these times! It's the same thing, if the wives don't do as their told, they loose salvation (big time!).

Man, people still fall for this mind-wash, all because of fear and ignorance.
And quite a bit of coercion, of course.

My wife's mom was polygamist. She also 'killed' herself by refusing operable cancer surgery due to her religious beliefs. Yup, she died.
You know how she spent the last years of her life...care to know? Raising the children of her 'husband's' other wife...so they could have some peace, of course (seperate house, even!). Yeah, free babysitter! Cult power.



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 05:19 PM
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An excellent reading about this is a classic Euripides' "Medea".

Total critic of society from woman's point of view, plus total critic, in form of tragedy, of the "famous" - emotional intelligence!
To kill her own children as a revenge to husband who "abandoned" her...

I recommend this to everyone with slow and contemplating reading.



[edit on 7-3-2009 by DangerDeath]



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 05:56 PM
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One of the strongest tools of submission in some cults, as well as societies, is the idea and feeling of "guilt".

To feel guilt is a conditioned state of self-denial in all cases when an individual goes against the rules, and is not capable of understanding the underlying mechanism of it production.

In most cases, going against the rules, is actually behaving in a responsible way, as opposed to blindly following the rules imposed by the cult or society.

Responsible behavior is taken as opposition by the authority.



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 06:00 PM
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ATS is somewhat cultlike, if you don't go along with the theme you are an outsider and suspect,

Heaven forebid you have doubts and voice them about some of the topics, then they start callling you a government operative.

They wont trust you if you don't go along.

[edit on 063131p://bSaturday2009 by Stormdancer777]

[edit on 063131p://bSaturday2009 by Stormdancer777]



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 06:17 PM
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reply to post by Stormdancer777
 


People gettin' disappearing...
I was following the mod's thread



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 06:27 PM
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Originally posted by DangerDeath
reply to post by Stormdancer777
 


People gettin' disappearing...
I was following the mod's thread


what?

I am sorry you lost me.



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 06:36 PM
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reply to post by Stormdancer777
 


People who opposed mod's opinion were banned.
A conspiracy against ATS? thread.



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 06:48 PM
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Originally posted by DangerDeath
reply to post by Stormdancer777
 


People who opposed mod's opinion were banned.
A conspiracy against ATS? thread.



I see, yes that could happen,
this is not a one line post.



posted on Mar, 7 2009 @ 07:02 PM
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Does anyone have an opinion on eugenics, regarding cult ideology?

Here's one source of information. I didn't read it all. Some of the texts talk about importance of IQ, but they don't give real definition of what intelligence really is. Their finding is that IQ is genetically determined in greatest part.

In my opinion, scientific understanding of intelligence is in most cases observed without any reference to ethics (typical for science). Which is a great mistake.


www.eugenics.net...

This one is interesting and indicative.

www.eugenics.net...

Problem with PC...

www.eugenics.net...



[edit on 7-3-2009 by DangerDeath]



posted on Mar, 8 2009 @ 12:30 AM
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I see a lot of semi-cults (more 'cultish and getting worse') form and unform over the years in the remote viewing field. Which is pretty much a cult waiting to happen--but that could be said for nearly any psychic endeavor, historically that's been the case with psi arts--but RV has a boatload of very left brain logical sorts and a minor warzone of doctrinal-method, so it's like the worst of all worlds combined when it comes to cultism.

The main thing that seems to tip the balance usually comes from the leader, and specifically, it's their ego. I don't just mean being an egomaniac; that's not such a big deal. I mean the leader behaving badly in some way, and should anybody even mildly question a behavior, a practice, an opinion, anything, the leader takes "great umbrage" about it (and/or acts like a victim about it) and all the followers then rally to their leader's side and then the person who dared ask or point out the blindingly obvious, is completely castigated. They're either excluded entirely or, at the least, will never have the guts to stand up for their own opinion again.

This is actually so common in the field that you can have big groups of people in discussion areas and almost nobody says a word, and many say privately it's because no matter what they say their 'trainer' will be irked at them, or for them participating with others, or all the enemies (of other doctrinal-methods) are out there and they don't want to interact with them. It makes it truly exasperating trying to promote something healthy, non-partisan and positive.

Combine that with training methods that amount to cult indoctrination (as much out of ethic-less stupidity as design) in a lot of subtle ways most people don't understand, as well as "private advice" during training that amounts to, "Well we don't discuss X and Y publicly because the scientists are uptight and people on the internet get all prissy about it, but you and I know how it REALLY is." So it becomes secret-beliefs within different public-beliefs the leader then defends as being reality and the whole group is forced to develop this dysfunctional shell-of-respectability to the degree that a lot of the stuff 'underneath' literally starts falling out of their awareness; they know it's there, they operate based upon it, but their mind doesn't really put together the 'difference' between the public and private story anymore, it just becomes habit.

Onlookers (such as scientists) are forced to believe the commercially-driven leaders who 'say' things are this or that way (everything is kosher and legit and gosh we have no idea why some of our former trainees now say this is cultism...) because they don't have to deal with the reality of what individual people really believe on a daily basis, they're operating at a higher level where their only real source of information are the people telling them what they want to believe. It's pretty frustrating. But oh well.

There's some degree of this in every field I imagine.

PJ



posted on Mar, 8 2009 @ 03:40 AM
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A cult is always "exclusive" and never tolerates a dissenting opinion.
Oh wait, that reminds me of this thread ....



posted on Mar, 8 2009 @ 05:29 AM
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reply to post by RedCairo
 





they know it's there, they operate based upon it, but their mind doesn't really put together the 'difference' between the public and private story anymore, it just becomes habit.


I have come to conclusion that, not only "public" language, but all language was invented with one purpose only: to hide the truth.

Knowledge, being direct, doesn't need a medium to be communicated. On the contrary, the principle of sharing can be applied to language with heavy limitations, because truth gets diluted and lost in meaning (lost in translation).

In public speech there is no truth, it is always lies, in order to hide intentions.



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