I might receive some harsh responses to this because the mass-consensus is that we are in "one of the worst economic crises ever" and anyone who denies that is an idiot and there is no hope and no escape blablablabla...

This is what has been forcefully conditioned into the hive-mind by the mass-media and surprisingly many at this non-msm-site have bought into it too and are raving and ranting about the dire times we supposedly live in.

But are we really in a crisis or are we...

...in a mass-awakening showing us that we have been in debt all along as a country, a world and on individual levels? Isnt it a great thing to finally confront the truth about our situation? Claiming that this is something new or unforseen is a lie, imo.

Are we really in a crisis or are we...

...beginning to realize that being laid-off and fired from crappy jobs based on a corporate-slave paradigm that gave us a false and illusionary sense of security in a 9-to-5 treadmill may not be such a bad thing?

Are we really in a crisis or are we...

...beginning to learn that the government cant fix things for us because they are not overlords but just humans. Will this "crisis" help us regain our self-determination and strengthen our personal responsibility?

Are we really in a crisis or...

...is the manufacturing of artificial panic, fear, hate and blame actually meant to weaken us rather than strengthen us?

Is our current situation a cause to keep our heads low and cower in fear or is it an opportunity to keep our heads high, see through the illusion of gaining any kind of "security" from others and become more free?

I choose the latter. I dont buy into what everyone else seems to be thinking these days.

Yes, but what about those poor people who got laid off?

...some will no doubt say.

To which I respond:

Why did they give up all of their independence and self-sufficency in the first place? Because thats what everyone else in society was doing and it seemed safe?

[edit on 2-3-2009 by Skyfloating]

Interesting post - I actually agree with you (sharing all the flaming coming our way)

I've had the same thoughts. Sure, I was (still am) lucky I wasn't laid off (yet). But the upside for me personally is that I now live frugally, paying off credit cards, buying only the necessary and canceling services I don't need any more (i.e. landline which is in addition to cell phones (saving $60 a month), newspaper (saving $180 in 2009), going back to the basic cable package (saving $40 a month) and more).

Now, I'll also say that I really feel for the people who lost their jobs. Here in Michigan, for example, there are tons of people laid off by the "big 3". Just this morning, I talked to a family where both parents AND 2 of their adult kids where all laid off by Chrysler. It sucks no doubt.

But they are also seeing this as a chance. They found out that the "no worker left behind" program pays $3,000 per person towards education expenses. These guys are going out and learning new skills, paid by the gov.

To be honest, I haven't felt this crisis whatsoever. If it weren't for the markets going down, I would think this economic downturn is just fear-mongering by politicians and the media. I don't know anyone who has lost their job, nor house.

Reply to skeeveeve:

Thanks for sharing the flame possibly heading towards us.

I´ll especially emphasize your sentence: "They are seeing this as a chance, going out and learning new skills".

Thats the attitude that will turn this "crisis" into a blessing in disguise.

[edit on 2-3-2009 by Skyfloating]

Originally posted by stevegmu
To be honest, I haven't felt this crisis whatsoever. If it weren't for the markets going down, I would think this economic downturn is just fear-mongering by politicians and the media. I don't know anyone who has lost their job, nor house.

Neither do I. Not a single person. Thats not to say its not happening. But I agree that the extent to which it is happening might be exaggerated.

I agree, and I think a fair amount of research will not deny this.

It is still rough though, having paradigms crumble and finding out everything we were doing in life was based on lies.

One must purge, before one can be reborn.

But they are also seeing this as a chance. They found out that the "no worker left behind" program pays $3,000 per person towards education expenses. These guys are going out and learning new skills, paid by the gov.

These new skills are gonna make them SECURE and SELF-SUFFICANT (Skyfloating) and in which fields. Saw a want ad in a Harvy's today. These banks are failing for...... #z and giggles. It's real, the reasons for it may be self-induced , living beyond their means but its real.

I always appreciate your thoughtful posts. They really do make me look at things differently, including this one. But...

Regardless of any of the possibilities (or opportunities, whichever) you put forth, we - including you - are going to have to deal with the collective reality of the society in which we live. We can deal with our own personal situations however we choose but we are still part of a collective experience and we will have to deal with whatever outcome the prevailing mindset has set in motion.

I agree that we can choose to change our thinking and our actions from this point forward but there will still be a price to pay for our past transgressions. There is no such thing as a free pass in the real world.

There now, that was relatively flame free wasn't it? I'm quite sure you will have a rebuttal that will almost make me change my mind.

Originally posted by kosmicjack
Regardless of any of the possibilities (or opportunities, whichever) you put forth, we - including you - are going to have to deal with the collective reality of the society in which we live. We can deal with our own personal situations however we choose but we are still part of a collective experience and we will have to deal with whatever outcome the prevailing mindset has set in motion.

we have to pay for our transgressions.

Well, FWIW, here`s a "rebuttal" (although I dont really disagree with what you`re saying).

What the "prevailing mindset" puts into motion does not have to be something I, as an individual put into motion. It doesnt have to have anything to do with me. Its called "going against the grain".

I´ve cleaned up on a personal level. At the age of 25 I filed a voluntary tax evasion report on myself thereby experiencing the joy (not the "have to") of dealing with my transgressions. I lost a lot of money. Having lost all, I had nothing more too loose...which can be quite a liberating feeling.

Later on I again lost everything because my field of business was in a "crisis". This "loss" inspired my own self-employment which has generated more fun and income than I would have ever had had I tried to keep that job I lost. It is the sort of income that (I will not share it here) is crisis-proof, purposefully having chosen stuff that would be somewhat independent of the "collective" you say I have to deal with.

I wouldnt have made it crisis-proof if I hadnt experienced several crises myself.

So this "crisis" is not really a bad thing. It wakes up complacent minds, imo.



[edit on 2-3-2009 by Skyfloating]

Originally posted by beebs

It is still rough though, having paradigms crumble and finding out everything we were doing in life was based on lies.

One must purge, before one can be reborn.

Its rough for sure but ultimately there is nothing more liberating than the truth.

Some people I know have lost their jobs. Another one I spoke with last week said her company just cut their pay by 40%! They still work 40 hours a week...

I also see that this can be a good wake up call. Maybe just what we need.
I was just reading a thread yesterday (slipped my mind which one) about this financial crisis, and even some on that board were starting to get it.
The posts were leaning towards, 'hey, maybe we should go back to the way it was. we can farm our fields and learn trades, etc...'

Something has to wake people up. Crisis or no crisis. Wake up!!!

Originally posted by branty
Im glad for you that this Depression is liberating to you. Maybe that liberation can passed around at the local Food Bank where they are swamped with request from people who are not yet "Liberated"

I didnt say that the depression is liberating to me did I? I said my own personal "loss of everything" was liberating to me. Dont misquote. Thanks.

[edit on 2-3-2009 by Skyfloating]

Originally posted by blujay
The posts were leaning towards, 'hey, maybe we should go back to the way it was. we can farm our fields and learn trades, etc...'

You know whats amazing? The amount of people unable to grow their own food or build their own house.

When did we stop building our own houses?

Originally posted by TheWayISeeIt

asking people who don't know they have legs to get up and run with those unused things that dangle off their torsos.

To build on that analogy: Ever see a kid who is learning to evolve from crawling to walking fall down and say "Im not getting up again because I fell down!" No, you havent. They all eventually get up.

Too bad adults are often not that way

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by TheWayISeeIt

asking people who don't know they have legs to get up and run with those unused things that dangle off their torsos.

To build on that analogy: Ever see a kid who is learning to evolve from crawling to walking fall down and say "Im not getting up again because I fell down!" No, you havent. They all eventually get up.

Too bad adults are often not that way

You sound like you given up on folks Sky, the original op was about current crisis, my message was it was real, Im sure people will rebound and rebuild, but to deny any problem, is falling down on yourself

[edit on 2-3-2009 by branty]

Originally posted by branty
You sound like you given up on folks Sky, the original op was about current crisis, my message was it was real, Im sure people will rebound and rebuild, but to deny any problem, is falling down on yourself

If I´d given up on them I wouldnt make this thread.

Denying the Problem? No. Just thinking its a good thing the truth of it has to be faced now. As far as Im concerned we`ve been in a crisis for many decades longer than just this and last year.

_____________________________________________________

Would anybody happen to know (serious question, not rhetorical) when the last time was the USA was debt free?

[edit on 2-3-2009 by Skyfloating]