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Radio chip coming soon to your driver's license?

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posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 02:15 AM
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That's interesting. I know that the modern military ID cards all have a chip in them that is commonly used for accessing buildings and computer terminals. Some military computers/keyboards have slots in them for dropping your card in. That basically unlocks the system and tells it that you are the person logging in.

If you could develop or "acquire" similar technology you might be able to tweak the hardware and make it useful for any such chip, including those in drivers licenses. This opens up a pandoras box of possible ways around the RFID mess. You could even make a fake drivers license using an alter ego, obtain a chip, program it to match that information on the card and anything else would normally be on the chip. That way if they read the card they say.. This must be him.

The idea here is that they are wanting to use the chip as a means of verifying your identity (at the very least). Somehow they think that if the chip tells them who you are, it must be correct. You could reprogram the chip, insert it into a fake drivers license, and you would be removing all those doubts about who you really are. They wouldn't question it as being fake because nothing would seem out of the ordinary.

More importantly, if it can be made public that the usefulness of such a chip can be compromised so easily, it could solve the problem of RFID chips in ID cards and drivers licenses altogether. And if the government still chose to stick with the chip system, you would at least know it can be "worked around".

All this talk of de-magnetizing the chip is one thing. But how would you go about jamming the signal from the chip without demagnetizing everything in your wallet? Is it possible to have, say, a powerful magnet in your pocket and not have to worry about being scanned by something/someone?

-ChriS

[edit on 1-3-2009 by BlasteR]




posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 02:16 AM
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One point I want to bring up with everyone...

Even if you're not paranoid about being tracked... I still highly recommend avoiding RFID enabled cards, and/or smashing the RFID chip.

Essentially, there's zero security in RFID chips.
I can literally walk past you with a $10 card reader and have your Credit Card number, card holder name, and expiry date, stolen right from your credit cards RFID tag, and you haven't got a clue I just did it.

Your personal address information can be stolen from a variety of other cards...

Basically, I can steal your entire life and finances by simply walking past you.


This is NOT an exaggeration.
RFID chips carry zero security.
It is now easier to steal your information than it has ever been in my lifetime.

Disable those chips people. Keep your identity and your finances safe.


A hammer is your safest bet... you can still use the magnetic stripe that way.

I know it's a cool novelty to be able to walk up to a pay booth and simply bring your card near it... but it's not worth being ripped off by some jerk walking past you with a $10 card reader.



At least until they finally put some proper security on there.

Credit card numbers shouldn't be allowed on RFID tags, but they are.
Personal information shouldn't be allowed on RFID tags, but it is.
I don't know why credit card companies and other companies would do something so blatantly stupid as to broadcast your vital information, I don't have answers for you, but there you have it. That's what they're doing.

I suspect though that they're doing it simply because it's "convenient"... a cool novelty trick to lure in customers with.

Just because they're complete morons doesn't mean you have to be.

[edit on 1-3-2009 by johnsky]



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 03:18 AM
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Originally posted by johnsky
One point I want to bring up with everyone...

Even if you're not paranoid about being tracked... I still highly recommend avoiding RFID enabled cards, and/or smashing the RFID chip.

Essentially, there's zero security in RFID chips.
I can literally walk past you with a $10 card reader and have your Credit Card number, card holder name, and expiry date, stolen right from your credit cards RFID tag, and you haven't got a clue I just did it.

Your personal address information can be stolen from a variety of other cards...

Basically, I can steal your entire life and finances by simply walking past you.


This is NOT an exaggeration.
RFID chips carry zero security.
It is now easier to steal your information than it has ever been in my lifetime.

Disable those chips people. Keep your identity and your finances safe.


A hammer is your safest bet... you can still use the magnetic stripe that way.

I know it's a cool novelty to be able to walk up to a pay booth and simply bring your card near it... but it's not worth being ripped off by some jerk walking past you with a $10 card reader.




At least until they finally put some proper security on there.

Credit card numbers shouldn't be allowed on RFID tags, but they are.
Personal information shouldn't be allowed on RFID tags, but it is.
I don't know why credit card companies and other companies would do something so blatantly stupid as to broadcast your vital information, I don't have answers for you, but there you have it. That's what they're doing.

I suspect though that they're doing it simply because it's "convenient"... a cool novelty trick to lure in customers with.

Just because they're complete morons doesn't mean you have to be.

[edit on 1-3-2009 by johnsky]


Many of the RFID tags i am finding are encrypted with a algorithm that we have not been able to read.
Only store type RFIDs are open for the most part.

Railroad cars are encrypted and have a large date storage.
but they still can be changed to read garbage.

We have tried to find the tag on railroad cars but our reader can not pinpoint it.
When we do it will be fun to remove or hammer them.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 10:55 AM
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I'm reasonably certain an ordinary pair of pliers could dysfunction mr. Chip. This falls into the same category as traffic tickets, etc.. Quiet protests are best. The next time you get stopped by a "Police Officer" (who only has authority over fictions like person, citizen, strawman, not you) then take your time reading the ticket. Make it hurt for them to issue it to you. Take a half hour studying the wording before signing. Circle the words you don't understand and "Reject for Clarification", sign as your name, agent and write "without prejudice", etc.. The same with the drivers license. Find out where the "Chip" is and apply some force to break it. Or, even better don't get one. A Drivers license is really not required for individuals it is for commercial purposes. Study up on the difference between Law and Legal.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 11:11 AM
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reply to post by ANNED
 


back in the day when I worked on railcars they looked like this

railcar ID

on the base of the car body



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 11:25 AM
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it would be hilarious to have some fema death cop read your tag with their ezpass and have a series of knock knock jokes come up ion the screen, wouldnt it? just like everything else we have in this world we will figure out how to decode, alter, destroy or render them useless. dont worry. im sure some 12 year old from san dimas ca will be the first one arrested for tampering to change his grades or something. then itll get posted on youtube how to do it. but yeah, until then a hammer, monitor degauss, pliers a welder, or something will work



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 12:10 PM
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I saw this in another thread a couple of days ago. I am glad this is getting more attention. Like I said before, nuke the offending "papers" in the microwave. I am sure 5 seconds would do it.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 12:14 PM
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Originally posted by ReelView

Circle the words you don't understand and "Reject for Clarification", sign as your name, agent and write "without prejudice", etc.. Study up on the difference between Law and Legal.


These are interesting points, Reelview. I would appreciate it if you could elaborate on this some more. I would love to learn more.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 12:44 PM
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It would be nice to have some type of ID which is impossible to fake. Employers have a really difficult time today trying to figure out if an employee is legal or not. Businesses unwittingly accept fake ID's and issue credit for some loser to purchase that new TV in your name. Yet, I'm not convinced a radio chip in all ID's is the right form. Hmm.... But then again, they can follow me using my cell phone, so is it so different following me with my license?



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 01:46 PM
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reply to post by ANNED
 
Anyone that has the ability to do this should remain cool, calm, and collected until the time is right,(hopefully never). It's never a good thing to show ur hand during a poker game and those who read this will happily pay to counter your move if they haven't already.Be ready to counter their counter. Not from the WW2 era but loose lips and all that rot. No offence meant. Tough love. Think about it.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 01:47 PM
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Don't even let this happen to begin with and you won't have to worry
about putting foil over your license. Are you all going to just lay down
and let them pull this off? Would George Washington lay down and take
this? Sounds like instead of plotting to work around the implemention,
that you would work to put an end to it before it starts.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 03:20 PM
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I have a badge for work that has an RFID chip in it that I have to use to open certain doors in the building I have access to...

Since I'm worried about personal information on these chips too I went searching for some type of faraday cage style wallet and found this. The first bold line in the description says "More comfortable than aluminum foil in your pants..."


Anyway I bought the wallet and went up to a door with the reader and scanned my card, door opened. I shut the door and put the card in the wallet and went to scan... nothing happened. I tried different angles, putting the card in different slots in the wallet, nothing. I don't have one of those $10 readers mentioned above or information on how to make or buy one, but if I did I would tell how it works.

I'm not plugging that site or anything, just mentioning what I did to have at least a little protection against RFID bandits. They do have other fun neat toys and such there too so it's worth a little time to browse


linked page: www.thinkgeek.com...



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 05:00 PM
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reply to post by daeoeste
 


I have to agree, I will warm mine up with a cup of coffee!



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 05:19 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 05:30 PM
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I keep looking around and, except for the manufactured "terrorist," I seldom see issues of people carrying others' licenses. Except to buy booze and cigs, I guess.

Does under age drinking and smoking and a very rare other issue really warrant tracking all citizens...?

Really?

Oh. That's right. They've brewed terrorists for our own good - so that we will submit to their surveillance.

[sigh]



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 05:59 PM
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reply to post by johnsky
 


You are right they are very sensitive and the chip can be damage easily.

They will also be very costly and the federal government will have to foot the bill as many states will not do it.

Still to make a DL tampered proof and unbreakable is going to be very difficult.

this may be plans but they may very be just that.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 07:27 PM
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The DMV tried something similar here in Georgia over 15 years ago. They passed a law requiring everyone to present their index finger when they got their license. They then digitally encoded the fingerprint on the back of the license. The idea was that they could catch all of the fugatives when they came to get a drivers license.

Well the plan was eventually scrapped because the law enforcement agencies didn't have enough manpower to check everyone's fingerprint everytime they stopped someone. So, the plans of Big Brother were defeated.

My encoded fingerprint is still on the back of my license however, but a few deep scratches in the back of my license, make it impossible to read.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 09:48 PM
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3 seconds in the microwave will render any RFID/microchip back to silicon. Just letting you know.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 09:53 PM
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reply to post by SphinxMontreal
 


Unless you get hit by someone driving a car. Wouldn't it be funny if they had the RFID License?

Peel the damn chip out. Oops, clumsy me, I laundered the thing to many times while it was in me jeans pocket.



posted on Mar, 1 2009 @ 09:55 PM
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Originally posted by hotrodturbo7
reply to post by ANNED
 


back in the day when I worked on railcars they looked like this

railcar ID

on the base of the car body


Thanks Now i know what to look for and test our equipment against.

If nothing else we will just unbolt them and swap them with other railroad car.


it might also be fun to take them off railroad car and mount them on Chinese shipping containers. i wonder where they might end up.


[edit on 1-3-2009 by ANNED]



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