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A discussion with a wealth of information!!! About NDE's and whether they're purely physiological

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posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 10:42 AM
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This is very interesting info. It's a discussion between the owner of the near-death.com website and a doctor who is offering physiological explanations for the NDE's that people have.

At the end there's an immense amount of information such as scientific and experimental evidence which covers:

reductionism does not disprove survival

understanding how the brain causes NDEs to occur is not relevant to whether consciousness survives

Study suggests life after death

Evidence for out-of-body experiences

Quantum physics supports survival

And more...

www.near-death.com...




posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 08:21 PM
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More than 9 hours and no replies... Oh well, I guess I will never post the real, concrete stuff again, because no one is interested in that. Just the speculation people are interested in. Want to ask the questions, but don't want to know answers...



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 08:29 PM
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bandit...my bad, you know i'm interested in this stuff, but I totally missed this thread, glad you bumped it. The link is fascinating....lots of other related links within, gimme some time to read..i'll get back to you



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 08:56 PM
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I bookmarked that page, still more links to read

well since you know i believe in reincarnation and astral projection, you will understand when I say that even though it is possible that some projection/paranormal activities are directly related to actions and physiology of the brain/mind, I believe there is much more that hasn't been researched and proven yet. I have seen enough info to convince me that it goes beyond physchological effects and all experiences cannot be medically proven with the methods currently available.

btw, i've seen that link with cases claiming scientific evidence of reincarnation and I think it is one of the best studies/proof that it does indeed exist.



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 09:02 PM
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Nice worldwatcher,

As you saw, there are a lot of links with scientific studies which can answer a lot of the speculation that goes on around here about Oobe's, survival (or not) after death, materialism etc... But if they're seen by many; and that is by their own choice; is the question.

And I agree... dr Ian Stevenson has done some of the best research on reincarnation, but he is so often unfairly debunked.



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 09:07 PM
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well i look at it this way... there is no way someone can debunk Stevenson unless they died and came back to tell us, there's no reincarnation, he has provided sufficient documentation to prove (at least to me) that my belief is true.



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 09:08 PM
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You would think with all the members here at least one has had a NDE and would like to share what they experienced.

I think it is well within reason to look at the possibility of an after life. Spirits, ghosts, demons are very real to a lot of people. I think most are just afraid of death and dont wanna think about the possibilities.



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 09:10 PM
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A huge amount of people don't want to think about the possibilities indeed.



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 09:16 PM
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I briefly scanned the article, and it's something I'm definitely interested in, but I have to get out about a hundred u2u's in just a short time. What I've found that made any sence to me so far on the subject is in a book I read called "The Holographic Universe" By Michael Talbot that supposes holographic principles and a 'zero point field' is the basis for all concsiousness and even reality itself. I'm going to check this out more in the next couple of days and I'll be back.

DeltaChaos



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 09:26 PM
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Okay.
I had an NDE once.
You probably won't like what I have to say, though.

Ten years ago I went in to the doc's to have some minor routine surgery. So minor, in fact, that it didn't require general anesthetic, just local lidocaine.
So the doc sticks me with the lidocaine and leaves the room to get things ready. Said he'd be back in about 10 minutes.
Fortunately my mother was with me, else I might not be posting here now.
Within two or three minutes of the injections, I started having seizures and fell unconscious, still seizing. The doc came running back at my mother's screams, and quickly determined that my heart had stopped.
We didn't know I have an allergy to lidocaine.
Long story short, they got my heart going again and got me breathing and I eventually came out of it, and I'm here to tell my story today.

You know what my "experience" consisted of?
Nothingness. Utter and complete nothingness.
No "floating" sensation, no bright lights, no dead relatives....just nothingness.
One minute there...the next minute not. Nothing more.

If I weren't already an atheist at that point, that experience alone would've made me rethink things.

-B.



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 09:42 PM
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Very interesting Banshee. There is research that shows that some people do experience nothing. In fact, the majority of people having cardiac arrest experience nothing, or nothingness. This actually encourages the idea of NDE's being real, because if all people (who had cardiac arrests) were to have the visions and floating feelings etc... The NDE would be easier to explain (and predict!!!) using physiological means.

edit: btw... The research I'm referring to is a.o. the ones made by dr Pim van lommel. There are links to them in the first link I posted in the thread.



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 09:52 PM
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wow banshee that's a scary experience. I can understand why you wouldn't believe in an afterlife, but have you ever considered the possibility that since it was obviously not your time to die, whatever happened in that moment of complete blackness was blacked out by your conscious mind...

I on the other hand was haunted by my best friend, i have memories of past lives, and astral project...so either i have "special" brain or my beliefs are true...we'll just never know will we?



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 10:06 PM
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Wow, that's really scary Banshee. I don't blame you for being an atheist after that. I believe in something after death, I'm just not exactly sure what it is. But I think with NDE not everyone remembers exactly what happens and not everyone has them since it's not their time to die. Although, many NDEs that I have heard of consist of the person's relative or some kind of otherworldly being telling them that it is not their time to go.



posted on Apr, 16 2004 @ 10:52 PM
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NDE are supposed to be interpreted differently by everyone based on what they beleive


Banshee, you were already an atheiest, so you probably didnt expect anything and thats what you got (most likely no though)

But, everyone around the world that describes the traditional NDE similarly, but not exactly.... There's always a bright light, and usually a being there to help you 'cross over', whether it be an angel, Jesus, or an old relative...


crazy



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