The most Important thing you'll never read...

reply to post by dingleberry77

Sorry for the delay there, I was on another site.
One way or another, we will have to develop sustainable mini communities.
I see this as inevitable as resources get more critical, food scarce and prices inevitably rise.
So many luxuries we take for granted now, we will probably have to do without eventually because they are too costly for whatever reason. They will be outdated and frowned upon eventually as indicitive of the wanton excess shown by previous generations.(hopefully) Our progeny will realize more than we, what our greed had done to US and our very future at this point. I'm sure history will record this all. For good and bad. Once again and as always in these threads, only my most humble opinion mate. Nice to see ya here. (Dig your environmental minister, was in one of my favorite bands)! Sorry bout da fires! Tragic! Best wishes to you and yours from Idaho!
Once again I missed your question and truth is, I dont know.
That's a very good question worthy of deeper thought, and I will "sleep on it".
Thank you for your great posts!


[edit on 22-2-2009 by dodadoom]

reply to post by dodadoom


Good points mate. But do you think we have to go to hell before we re-build again? It seems like that is the only option on the table. It almost seems like we have to live through the harsh realities before we look at new alternatives. Hopefully those alternatives are real and for the people. Not a greedy grab at power.

Thanks for the well wishes. It's pretty rough in Victoria at the moment. Although when things like that happen it gives me hope with society. The whole country has rallied together.

Midnight Oil. Legends.

Good to talk to you. See you around.

I hate to be a wet blanket but is there anything out there that can confirm the existence of this manifesto beyond sites or blogs that obv have some sort of conspiratorial slant to them? And why can we only pinpoint within a 10yr window when this congressman allegedly warned congress about it. Is there any reputable record of this taking place?

It seems to me that this is a smoking gun in terms of what we need to wake up the masses, so why don't we do the responsible thing and try to dig up some sort of official record to back up this remarkable claim.

reply to post by dingleberry77

Unfortunately I do. The bad thing is the people who dont see it coming or who dont care will drag us all down together. The people still holding power,(nukes,etc.)will doubtfully relinquish it for whatever reason. Someone else willl just step in to terrorize. We will continue to blame each other instead of focusing on the real problems facing us squarely in the face. IMO.
If you are a spiritual person, I would have to say indeed without some type of "miracle of conscienceness", intervention will be required if mankind is to survive at all. Statistics show most species all do indeed eventually become extinct.
U2!


[edit on 22-2-2009 by dodadoom]

I agree that the system we have is a catastrophe. And, I agree that the game is fixed, that those on the top have made into law a ruleset that ensures that they will always come out ahead of the people on the bottom.

What I am not certain I agree with is that there is genius behind it all. I think that greedy and unethical people with a lot of power can all act in very similar ways without having a master plan. Sort of by a form of financial natural selective action. (ie; people who behave in x way tend to do better in our culture than people who behave in y fashion, and over time, there is a predominance of people behaving like x in the halls of power and privilege.) You can have people act in very similar ways without actual conscious collusion.

Noam Chomsky points this out when he discusses how a corporate run media works when answering questions after a lecture. Someone in the audience brought up that the media is serving the corporate agenda. He said he felt this showed that they were being controlled by corporate interests. Chomsky answered that no, there was no outside control of the media, but rather that the media was also corporate in form. And it should be no surprise that a corporate media would share interests with other corporations. He actually argued it might be better if the government or other corporations attempted to "force" an agenda on the media, because then there would be the possibility that the media might rebel at being bullied and tell tales about it.

I think what has happened is simple. Over time, the little people, you and I, have turned a blind eye to the fact that the people who seek power and wealth tend to be a bit sociopathic. We dont seem to mind that sort of behavior enough to punish it when things are going well for us as a people. We all joke about lying, stealing, politicians, and vote them in anyway. We all know that CEO are robbing their companies blind with outrageous salaries and other perks, but as long as we also benefit, we just feel they are entitled to what they can get.

In short, what we have today is not the result of some evil geniuses plotting against us. It is the sum total of our own willingness to turn a blind eye as long as things are not so bad for us to the sociopathic behavior of those in power. When it is third world countries being pillaged, well, thats ok. We dont mind it so much then. But when the natural consequence of letting sociopaths run our businesses and nations hits us, then it is a huge problem. And surely there must be someone conspiring against us.

If there is a conspiracy, we are all in on it. But I dont think there really is. I think this is just the natural outcome of greed being elevated in a group of cultures to a level that approaches worship.

This is part of the fabrication of "Society" -- though not directly referring to the fabrication of the Fed and Income Tax this is video is the underlying issues. It's based on a lecture related to England but the principle (principles) are the same ie Vatican corporations.

bbc5.tv...

Originally posted by dingleberry77
Post like this have been going around and around for the last 12 months or so.

I keep saying it, and I'll say it again. What are we going to do about it.

Nobody out there has come up with a simple and plausible explanation or response.

It seems like we've dug a hole so deep that we have to go down to the bottom to see a way out.

the ONLY thing you could possibly do about it .. is develop time travel technology..

then go back in time.. and form your own secret society to counter theirs.. or take over theirs.. and ensure the survival of the american culture..
of course.. you yourself may become drunk with power and greed.. detesting the serfs.. and put about the same exact events you see now..

OR

you may at that level of power.. become privvy to specific undiscloseable information regarding the human race's future..
and because of which.. you find it absolutely necessary to prepare for .. and in doing so.. do the exact same thing that's happening now.


-

All good books and material posted here. However, having read all that, I know recommend the book "Web of Debt" by Ellen Brown. It was written in 2007, updated again in late 2008. It builds on the information in "The Creature From Jeckyl Island" and has more contemporary details about the derivatives mess.

And, I think it's an easier read and introduction to the subject for the uninformed.

www.webofdebt.com...

OK Here now is another few notes of interest, I will offer no PROOF, save The LORD BE FIRST SERVED, and I can neither confirm nor deny any allegations or accusations.... IBID.refer to my other writings for all of that, plus, I am legally ASP w D/H, so, in all honesty, I can not be trusted, although, I am alaways honest, even when I lie. Although mildly dyslexic. That said, here goes:

1. The American General Commandary of the Orders operates under the European Commandry of the Orders which has since before the 1200's existed.

2. The families are more numerous and embedded than any list you will ever find online. Keepimg all their names, addresses, phone numbers, and financial information in well guarded rolls and other records.

3. GOD is the Title/ name of the Head of the Order of the Orders.

4. As per certain Gambits go, the Spanish Prisoner is a novelty, but, the trump of things such as these, is always best, the Ship At Sea.

5. Admirality/ Maritime is the Jurisdiction of all things NAVY, even, Air, Space, and the Internet, and Signals of every kind, all fall under these.

6. The Guardians, great protectors bourne on that Noble Lie, they are growing tired, and want to be free, too.

7. And if you learn of Washington's ReDistricting of the States, you may find it worth your while to look at the Maps of the United Staes through the years. You will find that All of the US is in them. North and South Carolina as well as Georgia once ran from the central portion of the USA from the West Coast all the way to the East.

8. The state of Martial Law declared by Lincoln, though offered in the first term of each president since at the start of each 4 year term, has declined to Rescind it. How do you think the President has Power to write Law which cannot be Judged, that is Executive Orders? The US is still under Martial Law. Repeal it and all Executive Orders are null and void and the Executive Law Enforcement Entities, IE the military, Police, CIA, FBI, NSA, alphabet agenciesetc. would be reigned in under Congress whose sine die would be lifted. And the Presidential Office would be returned to a purely Administrative position. Washington was exercising War Powers to issue his Presidential Order's.

9. In Order to challenge the Authority of ANY CONtract, even the US Constitution, one must merely prove that the signatories did not adequately represent the Parties. And the Esquires, did not represent We the People of America, nor did the States or Districts, or Delegates. They Represented England. Unless, that is, "We the People" are the People of England and the Holy Roman Empire, by and through the Crown Templar Bar which are their Representatives, then, by Law, All of England, that is of Great Brittain (UK) and all of the Holy Roman Empire and their Alliances, are bound by US Law. That'll start a War for you. That Depends on who owns the United States then and now. And that is easy to decide. File A Motion for a Constitutional Question with the US Supreme Court (no prior Court is needed as only they, thanks to Marshall, say what the Constitution is Interpreted to be), the question being thus: Is Queen Elizabeth the Queen of the United States, in word and/ or deed? And, do not add "of America", since America refers to US Citizens and their United States of America and is not the same as England's United States of America in word, but, in deed only.

Further, I opine not.

"In GOD We Trust"

(Governors Of the Districts; District Of the Crown, or District of Columbia-- (GOD and DOC)) Just trying to DOC TORie up your mind a bit.

We Are Watching You Watching US Watching You-- PMP % tt IOI, et al.



[edit on 23-2-2009 by PhyberDragon]

reply to post by flybynight


Well...there is a censored entry in a Congressional House record...
www.afn.org...

and a complete transcript of the entry...
www.afn.org...

reply to post by inxion


I'm not down on the citizens of these countrys. It's not their fault the Greedy Bankers and Rating Agencys are crushing them.

I feel bad about it. I would like everyone to have a decent/comfortable standard of living.

The problem is...interest based fiat currency...from the first moment a currency is started, a loan is made, it's over...

I hope SOMEONE comes up with a solution that is fair to all and DOESN'T
involve a NWO!

reply to post by PhyberDragon

So are you saying we take it to the world or supreme court and see how they would rule, taking the worlds present situation into account?

These old laws made hundreds of years ago are a serious threat to our current situation...

[edit on 2/23/2009 by Hx3_1963]

reply to post by Anonymous ATS

Very nice read...

Web of Debt
www.webofdebt.com...

Our money system is not what we have been led to believe. The creation of money has been "privatized," or taken over by a private money cartel. Except for coins, all of our money is now created as loans advanced by private banking institutions — including the private Federal Reserve. Banks create the principal but not the interest to service their loans. To find the interest, new loans must continually be taken out, expanding the money supply, inflating prices — and robbing you of the value of your money.

Not only is virtually the entire money supply created privately by banks, but a mere handful of very big banks is responsible for a massive investment scheme known as "derivatives," which now tallies in at hundreds of trillions of dollars. The banking system has been contrived so that these big banks always get bailed out by the taxpayers from their risky ventures, but the scheme has reached its mathematical limits. There isn't enough money in the entire global economy to bail out the banks from a massive derivatives default today. When the investors realize that the "insurance" against catastrophe that they have purchased in the form of derivatives is worthless, they are liable to jump ship and bring the whole shaky edifice crashing down.

Hx3_1963 good job.

When I first read Jekyll - I ate it up - right up to the last 1/3, where Griffin dives deep into global conspiracy.

That was a few years ago.

Today as I watch the mental midgets in charge of continued global bailouts, acting in BLATANT contradiction to sound economic principle, it becomes apparent that the last third I had poo-poo'd so easily, may sadly be the most relevant chapters.

Originally posted by Hx3_1963
reply to post by flybynight

 

Well...there is a censored entry in a Congressional House record...
www.afn.org...

and a complete transcript of the entry...
www.afn.org...

I'm not exactly sure what this entry has to do with validating the source of the Banker's Manifesto. However it is interesting to note that Rep. Traficant has been incarcerated for some time now for a number of crimes, including tax evasion and accepting bribes.

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by flybynight

If you look about 1/3 down page 2 of my matrix thread you'll see a bunch of links to him and connected events...

reply to post by Hx3_1963


Thanks for that, seems there may be some sort of rabbit hole to crawl into here.

The main thing to remember is who has made the collapse happen
if your hungry eat the rich but start at the top
first those with trillions then those with billions then those in government who signed the bill for the banks bailout if there not hanging from trees by then
this way those responsible can at least feed the hungry

reply to post by flybynight
here's some links to look through...I'm getting lost going through them but if you want to look and get back to me...

sci.tech-archive.net...

The above was reprinted from the book, Economic Pinch written by the
late Charles A. Lindberg, Sr. which was first published in 1923. The
Bankers Manifesto of June 1892 was not intended for public reading,
but was propaganda to hold the big bankers together. Permission was
not needed to reprint the above as it predates copy write law.

www.paleoprogressives.org...

Lindbergh's books, Banking and Currency, and the Money Trust, 1913, Why is Your
Country at War? 1917, and The Economic Pinch, 1922, were suppressed and quietly
removed from practically every library in the country. One book by Lindbergh,
The House of Morgan, has disappeared without a trace, even out of the Library
of Congress. It has gone into the Orwellian memory-hole, and become a non-book,
as if it never existed.

The main thesis of Lindbergh's books posets the existence of a Super Trust,
developing out of an aglomeration of capital accumulated by a group of American
industrial and finance capitalists who are commonly known as the Robber Barons.
According to the elder Lindbergh, this group - which included the Stillman-
Rockefeller, J.P. Morgan, and Kuhn-Loeb interests - had unified their common
interests into a powerful Trust by the early 1870s. They then promoted the Sherman
anti-Trust Act, in order to prevent any other, late comers from climbing up
to enjoy the Olympian priveleges that they had acquired
on their plateau of Wealth.

books.google.com...'s+Manifesto+origins&source=bl&ots=xDtwH-k-0A&sig=AkOETvODomYNSpoPfhgOkBDi6 RM&hl=en&ei=f_SiSbzxJIS2nQeG2Y39DQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=4&ct=result#PPA109,M1

www.afn.org...

www.afn.org...

www.uhuh.com...

webskeptic.wikidot.com...

[edit on 2/23/2009 by Hx3_1963]

Originally posted by dodadoom
reply to post by yeastblood

 

Maybe we do need to hit rock bottom.(like an alcoholic for instance)
Maybe we need a major reset, like some have professed.
I'm not in favor of it myself, but we may have no choice in the matter.
Really is up to us, I guess........?

Hit rock bottom? My concern is this: does anyone know, if we do hit "rock bottom" what will happen with people on social security? My mom is on SS and she has asked me a couple times what I think will happen with Social Security. I have no idea, does anyone?