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If the US Splits...

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posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 03:01 AM
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i in no way would want this to even happen, but its better to discuss and be prepared, rather than being caught off gaurd due to a lack of discussion.

i'd much prefer it if there were a few days notice so i could mobilize and get to my families rendevous, but i don't quite see getting a "memo" so to speak.

If it comes down to the Military, i have full confidence that they will in no way, shape, or form, turn their backs to or their guns upon American citizens. i'm more worried about foreign troops ie, NATO, or UN troops come to "restore the peace" IMO these forces would be the Federal G. only form of offense, with fifteen twenty thousand of our own armed forces who were somehow persuaded to turn on the citizens.

When it comes to our military though, unless its a concise whole organized military effort, will only help us by not fighting us. it may just completely disband as soldiers rush to help their families. i don't see them making off with apaches and abrams.

if it was a complete, organized military effort on behalf of the citizenry, that is a whole other story. That would be quick decisive and close to bloodless. Which would be highly preferable.

Who knows?

love and peace




posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 08:03 AM
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As far as I'm concerned if the US Government breaches the constitution - that voids my contract to the US Army.

I'd go right the f home to Texas.

Not saying I'd ever want to shoot Americans for any reason - but I'd be headed to Texas to do whatever my state decided to do.

That's just me though.



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 08:09 AM
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reply to post by mf_luder
 

1 question befor i post answer

why did usa split?(economy/revolution/coup de tat.) ????



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 08:11 AM
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reply to post by lycopersicum
 


Don't know man -

Easiest one would be the one the others are saying - the federal government goes against the constitution because of the bad economy so the states split up into regions and dispute the fed govt because of the breach of the constitution.



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 08:30 AM
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Originally posted by lunarminer
This is an excellent question and I hope that every American who reads this thread gives it some thought.

The real issue is, do you consider yourself an American first and foremost? Or, do you consider yourself to be a northerner, southerner, westerner, or something else?

If you are an American first and foremost then you will stand with the US, the Union, the Constitution, and the President.

If you are something else first, then you will be part of the rift. You will separate yourself from the rest of the country, and/or join with those who are also something else.



I am a American first, but i would be with what ever part stands for what America is or should be, what thousands have died for, not a fascist dictatorship where insane and limiting rules are put upon us with out our consent or vote, but following the lead of the founding fathers.



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 09:13 AM
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reply to post by mf_luder
 

then i would have to say

i would join the side of the ones trying to up hold the constitution of the united states of america,

i atleast owe my founding fathers that respect
they did fight for all of us in the usa

and the constitution of the united states of america,
works great aslong as it is upheld ,but when its not !!!...
a revolution is a must !! but not a civil war.
civil wars are for ignorant people trying to controll their neighbor

in times like these a civil war in the usa would be about the stoopest thing we can do to our selves

civil war shouldnt even be propagated in thought, only revolution to gain back the constitution of the united states of america, thats it and only it IMO

once the constitution of the united states of america, is restored go back to the way things should be .

we should be so far evolved from civil war !!!.. what do we rally have to fight each other about ??

his truck is bigger then mine or his LCD tv is wider then mine?? give me a break

we as neibors aernt the problem . its the propaganda of greed that is the problem, the propaganda of economic classes, the propaganda of you need credit not knowledge , the propaganda of you need it now and not latter,the propaganda of entitlement, we need to feel more important then we really are.

pure Gobbally goop WHAT EVER !! people need to get a back bone.
you are who you are .

dont pretend to be what your not, thats it !! if we would all do that we wouldnt have the CREDIT issue/economic issue, that we have would we?

buy what you can afford ,if you cant afford it work harder so you can !! not to much to ask now is it??

IMHO

up hold the constitution of the united states of america,
thats all that needs to be done thats it
nothing more and nothing less



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 09:46 AM
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reply to post by lycopersicum
 


And I agree with you my friend.

Unfortunately in this day and age, many Americans aren't even aware of the tenents of that sacred document and wouldn't even blink at changes to it by the government.

That worries me.

These are the same types who will blindly flock to certain administrations because of their figureheads as opposed to their policies.

I don't want there to be a civil war. Hell - I don't want the US to ever fall. Regardless of all the whining and crap talking - we are still #1. Hands down. If there were a split, it would be disasterous.



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 09:51 AM
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reply to post by mf_luder
 


The fact that most people know nothing about the constitution is the problem and the good ole feds take full advantage of that. I only hope that the states putting together this legislation to tell the Feds to stand down is enought to keep in war or revolution from happening.

I don't welcome it althought I would not run from it it would cause a lot of harm before it ever did any good.



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 09:57 AM
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Its about time somebody did something down on the border.
In my opinion the US has gotten so big and so over governed that we have no choice but to break up. Our government has gotten so huge it is involved in our every waking hour. The original purpose of the US was to stay out of the American citizens business. We are not American anymore, at least by the constitutions standards.



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 09:59 AM
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here for anyone who wants to refresh their rights of the The Constitution of the United States of America



www.law.cornell.edu...



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 10:11 AM
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The scary part Ive read in a few posts here becomes not the idea of getting back to our roots and following the constitution and other founding principles but it seems more of a struggle between Nationalism and Patriotism. I dont think regions would be based along those lines but it would be the difference in those two terms that would spell the doom (and currently causing states to have clearly defined lines that the govt, should they cross them, would be nullified) for the country.

Those followers of Obama are prime examples of NATIONALISTS. They have blind obedience to the central Government.

Dr Ron Paul once said that "In earlier times patriotism meant having the willingness and courage to challenge government policies regardless of popular perceptions." Now days, people have confused patriotism with nationalism and the two have become synonymous with standing behind your govt regardless of what kind of crap they pull.

THAT is where the war lines would be drawn. Those that follow their GOVT will be shown and believe that those that follow the countries founding principles will be the secessionists/terrorists/proverbial bad guys. The potential here for both the opportunity/impetus to redraw the lines and also for demonizing those that try is extremely high. No fear mongering here, everyone else is doing plenty of that. Simply one logical outcome of the current situation in the United States.



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 10:31 AM
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reply to post by SHNIPE
 


"regardless of popular perceptions" THAT phrase is what scares the hell out of me

because if the popular perceptions comes from the sheeple we are doomed,.. if it comes from true free thinking patriots then we are are better off regardless the outcome

but when talking "popular perceptions"

whos "popular perceptions" are you talking about ?? the governments ???/ the sheeples??/ or the informed patriots who truly wish to uphold The Constitution of the United States of America??



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 03:15 PM
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I am an American, first and foremost. Every country/state/local government has subdivisions and always will. That is no reason to divide. A collapsing USA would lead to the collapse of the world in my opinion. The problem is that America used to be a melting pot, and now, it is a salad bowl. Think about that analogy.

If division of the USA becomes a threat, then I could see the military stepping in and then the government trying to solve society's problems with social conditioning. I actually wrote about that in my first novel, 'A World Without Divide' (www.awwd.us.com). The premise of that story is that a covert government military project called the Utopia Project (with the militaries of several countries involved in a social conditioning experiment) leads to the end of the world. Sorry for the plug, but this type of topic ties in with my mindset exactly when I wrote the book. It is a fiction book, but the more I read about issues like this, the less 'fiction' it seems!



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 06:03 PM
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I wouldn't mind getting rid of California...



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 10:10 AM
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Very interesting ebook on the subject Here

it is based on a pretty thoroughly thought out (albeit politically incorrect) premis.

Igor Panarin, Dmitri Orlov and others feel that the cultural situation in the US demands that balkanization will take place...and not necessarily via a hot civil war...

My personal feeling is that the devolution of federal powers is inevitable, and I'm watching the trends very carefully...

[edit on 22-2-2009 by RolandBrichter]

[edit on 22-2-2009 by RolandBrichter]



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 03:39 PM
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reply to post by RolandBrichter
 


You're watching the trends very carefully. What do they say? If it does happen - do you think it will be sooner or later when it happens?

I find it hard to imagine having to get papers to travel between states. Can you imagine having to use a passport to visit relatives in another state? Crazy.



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 03:46 PM
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The problem is that the size of the US Government can not be sustained. The programs they want to pay for they can't afford today, or over the long haul. The societal imbalance is already too great and we are sliding downhill. The cost of the government and their mandates can not be afforded, so they are borrowing from tomorrow's citizens and using one-time gimmicks to pay for today. Eventually, it will come to a head, and those who have been paying too much and working too much all the while (aka; the middle class, since the poor don't work or pay in and the rich have accountants and professionals to find ways to avoid paying their real share of taxes) will either revolt, stop working, take over the government or move out of the US, leaving nobody to pay for the mess.



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 04:39 PM
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Originally posted by mf_luder
reply to post by RolandBrichter
 


You're watching the trends very carefully. What do they say? If it does happen - do you think it will be sooner or later when it happens?

I find it hard to imagine having to get papers to travel between states. Can you imagine having to use a passport to visit relatives in another state? Crazy.


Timeframe? Who really knows, but my bet would be within the next ten years....States will join with neighboring states comprised of citizens of like mind...more like a loose confederation....like was initially envisioned...the united States..not the UNITED states



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 07:44 PM
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reply to post by RolandBrichter
 


So it leaves me to wonder what the split would look like.

I know the Russian guy had the US forming into a loose confederation of states based off of regions - like the North East, the Southern States, stuff like that.

I have the strong feeling if something like that did go down, Texas especially would be the first to separate all on its own.

What do you think?



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 08:30 PM
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Originally posted by WatchNLearn
I think the people of the the USA need to grow up! Haven't you learnt anything from the first Civil War? After 200 years you are ALL brothers and sisters. Would you pick up a gun and shoot your brother, your mother your sister? It is obviously time for diplomacy. Many Americans dis Muslims for their barbaric laws and the way they treat one another. I agree, and that is why I would hate to see Americans killing Americans. It is no better than the barbaric events in the Middle East.

Learn from you mistakes America. Violence begets violence and nothing is gained from it.

The USA has the opportunity to lead the world as one of the great nations on earth, but right now you are all behaving like school children.

Calm down, take a deep breath and ask "What would the wise mind do?"



A wise mind would start with the lawyers, then politicians, then bankers...no, bankers first.

Then we shoot the mimes.



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