Al-Qaeda founder launches fierce attack on Osama bin Laden

Originally posted by rufusdrak
I'm amazed that some of you people even believe any of these Al-CIA-Duh press releases anymore. What a joke.

I am amazed some of you continue to fall for the twisting of the truth and facts, thereby laying blame on the wrong people in order to give the real perpetrators of 9/11 a pass, and by doing so encourage more attacks.

you are the real enemy.

There, I said it.

I guess I'll get negative stars for this one.

[edit on 112828p://bSaturday2009 by Stormdancer777]

It sounds like a forced confession. Maybe he is saying what he thinks he has to get the heat off him and get out as quick as he can.

So many statements are thrown around by higher ups and quoted by the Legion of Armchair Investigators you have to just dismiss most of them after a while.

People are what they do, not always what they say.


Mike F

reply to post by thebeast2012


Well, it is a fact that American and a few Japanese soldiers did torture and rape the citizens of Iraq and Afghanistan. I understand that the actions committed by the guilty, don't necessarily speak for all but the US is a strong country armed with many many toys. I think he was tortured, drugged. That's how things were done yesterday, and that's how things are being done today.

Cruel? Yes, but the world won't be changing for another 7 to 15 years.

[edit on 21-2-2009 by Red Shield]

I, along with you, have no idea why the sudden reversal here. However, I find it very difficult to trust this man's intentions. I'm not saying he's not being truthful, I'm just saying do not trust WORDS... only trust ACTIONS.

It means little IMHO really. He was a co-founder not really the lone founder and the hard core types will say his commnets are a result of torture so It may sway a few but not the die hards.

reply to post by Swatman


"The CIA did not *create* al qaeda. they funded them to stop the russians."

Lets put it this way. The CIA legitimized Al-Qaeda through funding and they became a very valuable asset.
I don't have any reason to believe that they are no longer an asset to the Gov.

The CIA has been known to prop up its own enemies for quite some time. I don't see how this is any different. It is all about funding. If they don't have an enemy, they don't get the latest gadgets.

reply to post by Jay-in-AR


Its actually a bit more complicated than that. The CIA blindly handed over $$$$$ to the ISI which in turn funded the most extreem of the Islamic militants. They wanted access to Islamic countrys beyond Afganistan and a place to train extremist to use in Kashmir. Bin laden had other ideas.

An excllent reference is the book Ghost Wars

reply to post by FredT


Whether it be directly or indirectly, the US Gov. legitimized Al-Qaeda and others.
My point is that I'm quite sure we are still funnelling money over there in one form or another to keep people fighting.
If everyone just quit fighting, the US may not be able to put the right meglomaniacs in power that they prefer.

why the hell would anyone on this forum even trust the words coming out of a tortured man's mouth.

From his speech, what is he implying?

Al Qaeda started the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq

Al Qaeda is responsible for 9/11


Those are all blatant lies.

"remarkable changes", can't believe the OP would say something like that.


To tell you the truth, I do not believe in words, because we see and understand things not as they are but as we are.

Originally posted by JBA2848


Makes you wonder what they did to this guy over there in that Egyptian prison. Clearly they did something that was very remarkable to change a person from a Alqaeda jihadist into someone who speaks out against them in such a way. Don't know if it was drugs and shock treatment with repeated mind trance videos saying Al QQaeda is bad or what.

www. telegraph.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

From your post here it seems like you believe his wisdom was achieved through hypnosis or brain washing?

It doesn't take a genius to understand what he has stated is very accurate.

Their tactics are very primitive, that's why they haven't achieved anything. If they had any brains they would put down their guns and pick up some books, study, become educated, then get involved in the real "terrorism" which is raping middle class and poor people via banks and politics in America.

The US doesn't need terrorists anymore. We destroyed ourselves, or more accurately, the American banks and politicians destroyed us.

(I wonder of Al Qaeda or whoever the hell they are realize this yet.)




[edit on 21-2-2009 by Electro38]

Originally posted by JBA2848
Makes you wonder what they did to this guy over there in that Egyptian prison. Clearly they did something that was very remarkable to change a person from a Alqaeda jihadist into someone who speaks out against them in such a way. Don't know if it was drugs and shock treatment with repeated mind trance videos saying Al QQaeda is bad or what.

This guy, apparently, has changed his views before.

First he joins and is reported to be one of the key leaders of the Egyptian Islamic Jihad, ...

Egyptian Islamic Jihad

In Pakistan Sharif worked with Ayman al-Zawahri to rebuild Egyptian Islamic Jihad in exile. In the mid-eighties, Sharif is thought to have become Egyptian Islamic Jihad’s emir
******SKIP******
According to one source, al-Sharif stayed in the background, “Ayman was the one in front, but the real leader was [al-Sharif, aka] Dr. Fadl.”

He even writes a book to teach Jihadists how to fight, ...

The Essential Guide for Preparation

In Peshwar, Imam Al-Sharif (aka Fadl) wrote a text for jihadis to "school them in the proper way to fight battles" and preached that the "real objective was not victory over the Soviets but martyrdom and eternal salvation". This work, “The Essential Guide for Preparation,” appeared in 1988 and became "one of the most important texts in the jihadis’ training".

then he writes a book which condemns any kind of aggression, even against enemies, as being prohibited by their religion and says that "most forms of terrorism as illegal under Islamic law and restrict the possibility of holy war to extremely rare circumstances.

Criticism of Jihad movement

On February 28, 2004 Al-Sharif was transferred to Egypt. He was eventually transferred to the Scorpion, a facility inside Tora Prison where major political figures were held.
******SKIP******
During his imprisonment in Egypt he wrote Wathiqat Tarshid Al-'Aml Al-Jihadi fi Misr w'Al-'Alam ("Document of Right Guidance for Jihad Activity in Egypt and the World", also transliterated as "Rationalizing Jihad in Egypt and the World"). In it he proclaimed “We are prohibited from committing aggression, even if the enemies of Islam do that”
******SKIP******
Restrictions on jihad

The book Rationalizing Jihad opens with the premise that “there is nothing that invokes the anger of God and His wrath like the unwarranted spilling of blood and wrecking of property.” It defines most forms of terrorism as illegal under Islamic law and restrict the possibility of holy war to extremely rare circumstances. Requirements for the lawful declaration of jihad include: a place of refuge, adequate financial resources to wage the campaign without resort to stealing or kidnapping, a means of providing for and protecting family members, properly identified enemy to avoiding killing the innocent. The "blowing up of hotels, buildings, and public transportation” is not permitted.
******SKIP******
In November-December 2007 this book/initiative attacking al-Qaeda and calling for a stop to jihad activities both in the West and in Muslim countries, was published in serial form in two Arab dailies, the Kuwaiti Al-Jarida and the Egyptian Al-Masri Al-Yawm

So, it seems to me that his views and beliefs have been changing/evolving his whole life,

There's a lot more to read about this guy. Here's a link to a Wikipedia article about him.

Sayyed Imam Al-Sharif (aka Dr. Fadl )

[edit on 2/21/2009 by Keyhole]