I lost it at work today.

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posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 01:50 PM
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If one more person equates being unemployed, poor, or in foreclosure with being lazy then I am going to lose it as well. Since when do we live in such a black and white world?

Hard work does not always equal wealth. Well educated certainly doesn't equal wealth either.




posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 01:52 PM
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Originally posted by saint4God
Not at all. When you trust in humanity, humanity will let you down most of the time. This is why people get so upset. My spouse yells at other drivers, "You should KNOW better!" but I don't get angry at other drivers. I expect other drivers to do whatever they feel like with complete disregard for others. I'm never disappointed. I do see an occasional courtesous driver smile, wave, and let me in and that really makes my day.
I always expect the worst from my fellow man as well. It's something that I know I can always count on. LOL


Where is that in the Bible again?
Actually it's from one of Aesop's fables about a wagoner that gets stuck and prays to Hercules to help him. This was hercules' reply to his prayer.


[edit on 20-2-2009 by LLoyd45]



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 01:55 PM
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Originally posted by jsmappy
Just an FYI- Its an $8000 tax deduction - not cash.


Yes! Everyone take note - tax deduction, not cash up front. Maybe people will calm down if they ponder this.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 01:58 PM
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Originally posted by compwiz32190
As much as I hate this whole "free money" idea, he is right...you might as well take what you can grab now because things are only getting worse.


But it's the taking what you can grab now that actually makes things worse. If nobody took the "free" money, then it wouldn't get spent.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 02:01 PM
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The problem is 50% of the working force in America and all of the non-working force pay zero Federal taxes, and low if any state taxes. This means that many of these people have little issues with taxing the upper 50% more and more while trying to get all they can from the government since it is basically freebees to them.

It is also easy to get into office when your agendas are geared towards the non-tax/low tax paying population. Getting 10k for buying a house would just be a tax brake for me, and not free money as it would be for so many others.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 02:05 PM
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Originally posted by nixie_nox
I have to respond to the driver thing. My husband does this all the time. I said, you don't know what kind of day they are having. They could be trying to get to urgent care, just lost their job, or found out their parent is dying.

Even if someone is being a blatant jerk, I think: there must be a reason, and go about my merry way.

I was looking in my car mirror the other. Just because I was losing count of the grey hairs, and admiring my new wrinkles. When the driver next door rolled down his window and yelled, you look beautiful.

Totally made my day.

I said people need to do this sort of thing more often.


All very good points, thank you



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 02:16 PM
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Originally posted by LLoyd45
I always expect the worst from my fellow man as well. It's something that I know I can always count on. LOL


I don't usually look to Jackie Chan for deep philosophical statements, though was impressed when he said a variation of an English proverb in the opening of one of his movies: "I always prepare for the worst and hope for the best."


Originally posted by LLoyd45

Where is that in the Bible again?
Actually it's from one of Aesop's fables about a wagoner that gets stuck and prays to Hercules to help him. This was hercules' reply to his prayer.


Thank you! You're the first person who could answer that question I'd posed many times. Hopefully there's satisfaction that you've taught me something new today. I'd heard Christians quote the Bible in one hand and deliver this phrase on the other as if it were gospel truth as well. I think this bears examination.

Which do we believe?



Hercules and the Wagoner
A CARTER was driving a wagon along a country lane, when the wheels sank down deep into a rut. The rustic driver, stupefied and aghast, stood looking at the wagon, and did nothing but utter loud cries to Hercules to come and help him. Hercules, it is said, appeared and thus addressed him: "Put your shoulders to the wheels, my man. Goad on your bullocks, and never more pray to me for help, until you have done your best to help yourself, or depend upon it you will henceforth pray in vain."

Self-help is the best help.
- ancienthistory.about.com...

or

"So do not fear, for I am with you; do not be dismayed, for I am your God. I will strengthen you and help you; I will uphold you with my righteous right hand." - Isaiah 41:10

"Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened." - Matthew 7:7-8

[edit on 20-2-2009 by saint4God]



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 02:44 PM
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Originally posted by KaginD
[...] I don't want to have another failed attempt that lays on the taxpayers wallet. And I certainly don't want to see more people default on their homes! I think everyone should live within their own means for now. If you can afford a house, then yes, go for it. But, if you can't and you just want to take advantage of the opportunity because you don't want to miss out.. Well, thats an issue for me.



I agree - people should live within their means. I can say that for myself, I live frugally. I would also like a house, but I'm very grateful for my little apartment. I look around and see a lot of people with what, in my opinion, are fancy clothes, cars and toys. To me, it's ridiculous; these are not necessary things in life. That's their choice, though, if they want to get into debt or work away for those things. Part of my comfort is knowing that I will be able to live on less. I hear that some of these rich, suicidal people who lost a lot in the crisis are that way because they don't know how to get by on less like regular people do. It's hard for me to have sympathy for people who are upset at having fewer millions, but I could put myself in their positions and understand their pain because we all suffer.

So my point is that I think we should be careful with the anger and judgementalism, live by example, and be glad for the ethics each of us has which helps to serve us. We can also work to change the system in various ways.

I should add that I do understand the sense of unfairness some of you are feeling about all this. There have been situations in my own life when I felt self-righteous for a time about how I was doing things the right way and others were skating along having an easy time of it. College was one time. I had worked my butt off to get scholarships to go to a school where I came in contact with a lot of well-to-do kids. It really bothered me that they were so arrogant for who they were and what they had, while their parents paid their tuition. And here I got there by merit, and didn't have that kind of attitude. In retrospect, however, I had a little of the same attitude since I looked down on them for something they were simply lucky to have. It also isolated me from them because I felt so different (though it probably was only natural that I couldn't relate to a lot of them). Each of us has our own path, and our own pain (and I'm sure those kids had suffering which was real to them, too). To a certain extent, when you walk a harder path you hopefully end up with resilience and strength from it. These are things nobody can give to you. I hope you can recognize that, especially because I believe we'll all need those qualities to get through the troubles yet to come our way from this mess.

Another example where I could envy people is with relationships and getting material things out of them. I'm not trying to indict anyone here, but there have been times when I had a hard time understanding how women get stuff out of men for having sex with them (often called dating). I feel for men who think they have to give things to women in order to be with them (not talking about a general sharing attitude couples should have), and I have before looked down on women who took advantage of this. In time, I have come to simply be glad for myself that I am true to what works for my conscience, and to not be so hard on the other women. Good things come from being true to yourself. I would not want to switch places with the women who take stuff from men. I'm sure some of them pay dearly for it in other ways. Just look at the woman who puts up with abuse because her husband makes good money. And I'm sure it works fine for some women, too. Look at the woman who is very happy with her s.o. who also happens to buy her things. Great. To each his own. Not to oversimplify, of course.

We can always be unhappy about someone else getting an easier ride. Just my point of view to appeal to people to be kinder, though I understand your anger and I hope you all find constructive ways to deal with it (just as I have to when the state of the world gets to me too). I bet some good music will come out of all this!

[edit on 20-2-2009 by wintermarches]



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 02:50 PM
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reply to post by David9176
 


Yea, i'm totally in your corner on this. I said something at my buddy with whom I work with last week when we were talking about Homeland Security show and how they were busting ppl.

I never should have made a comment and kept to myself, but, I just get sick and tired of hearing 'all about HLS" ...

He threw up his arms at me and left the table. We're still friends, but, I think he got the picture.

As for me and buying a home, HA! How can we ever trust the banks again...as the saying goes....

'Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice...SHAME ONE ME!"



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:00 PM
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reply to post by wintermarches
 


But just because people have material things still doesn't mean life is cake.

My bff had everything she wanted, including college paid for. And I was completely broke. But her mother had a serious illness and only lived for a few more years.

They did a show once on stereotypes in high school. Everyone talked about the rich kid who never had to work for anything. he finally came out and said: all I hear is how easy I have it. That I don't have to work and have everything handed to me a on a silver platter. My mother is dying from cancer. Everyday, instead of doing anything, I come home and take care of her. Not what a juinor in high school should be doing.


I personally, just never assume because people have some things handed to them, that they have it easy.

I don't worry about what differences they can make, I only worry about the differences I can make. I am the one I have to account for.



[edit on 20-2-2009 by nixie_nox]



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:02 PM
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reply to post by nixie_nox
 


Exactly. You elaborated on what I hinted at. I eventually learned this through life experience. You don't always know what someone goes through behind closed doors. It can be very surprising.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:22 PM
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Originally posted by Komodo
I never should have made a comment and kept to myself, but, I just get sick and tired of hearing 'all about HLS" ...


Married couples go through this all the time too. When done with work, they're looking to dump on someone about work. If they can't do that with their spouse, then tend to a bar.


Originally posted by Komodo
'Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice...SHAME ON ME!"


Or if you're an ex-president:

"There's an old saying in Tennessee—I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee—that says, fool me once, shame on—shame on you. Fool me—you can't get fooled again."— George Bush, Sept. 17, 2002



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:31 PM
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I came from a family that couldn't pay for anything after the age of 16 for me. No car for me, college paid for, nor apartment deposit. When you start at $0, there's only one direction a person can go. College loans at $58,000 , car payment, $128,000 due on the house, $50,000 on the re-finance, $18,000 credit card debt. The plus is that there is no more debt necessary. I have all I need including the job I've always wanted, a college degree, a home, and family. This is now the paydown cycle. I must spend the remaining years making good on my commitments. Do I regret my purchases? No. Not at all. They were necessary. Debt isn't always a bad thing (in my case it's a very good thing), but defaulting on promises to pay most certainly is. I don't need any hand-outs, more loans, more credit or government assistance, just time to repay as promised. In exchange, the government and bank will make back the interest we'd both agreed I'd pay. It is a working system when people keep their word.

"And do not swear by your head, for you cannot make even one hair white or black. Simply let your 'Yes' be 'Yes,' and your 'No,' 'No'; anything beyond this comes from the evil one." - Matthew 5:36-37

[edit on 20-2-2009 by saint4God]



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:34 PM
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reply to post by badgerprints
 


It's ridiculous not to take the 8 to 10k. Whether it's "stealing" or not, if you don't take the money, the government already took it from where they took it from, so the money is just going to go to someone else. It's not like you're going to stand up and say "NO sir I will not take your dirty money!" and then the President is like "Most certainly, I'll put it right back where I got it from..." yeah right. If you don't take the money you're stupid, especially with the economy the way it is. Burn THIS, baby!


DisasterBoy911



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:44 PM
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Originally posted by David9176
[

If this continues to happen it will just keep ballooning the problem.

This is a huge part of why this country is in trouble yet we keep doing it.

I won't be apart of this. I refuse to.

If i'm missing out on thieving taxpayers then so be it.

I hope everyone else enjoys my money.


According to this jackass it's not your money.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:50 PM
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I think it is right you had a go at your workmate, but people need to stop scapegoating about this whole credit crunch.

I mean the attitude of "grab it while you can" got us into the s***. The people themselves got into the s*** not the governement or the bankers.

Just because something is there you dont need to take it. I made the mistake when i was younger and now i'm in debt and paying for it, that was MY bad decision, NOT the government or anyone else, I could have said no, and I was greedy, and other people got greedy and bit off more than they could chew, thats the fact.

Of course this is ATS though, and everything gets put on the scapegoat, its nothing short of brainwashing.

The bankers offered us the money, with that comes the responsibility on our part to make sure we can manage the money. We NEVER had it so good and WE squandered it, people need to realise that so we NEVER get ourselves in the s*** again.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:58 PM
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"And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell."

-King James Bible



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 04:06 PM
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Originally posted by LLoyd45
"And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell."

-King James Bible


Good quote, I just need to find out the application of it in this context. I never saw borrowing as a sin, but perhaps I'm wrong? There's an agreement between me an my creditors and so far both of us are sticking to it.

[edit on 20-2-2009 by saint4God]



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 04:11 PM
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reply to post by David9176
 

i can sympathise with you , the price of a starter home here is £400,000 + and the only mortgage u can get needs 30% deposit. yet they build on the limited space we have here and sell the properties to investors on the main land. truth is were all f###ed roll on 2012 ,wipe the slate clean and start over



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 04:32 PM
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Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by LLoyd45
"And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell."

-King James Bible


Good quote, I just need to find out the application of it in this context. I never saw borrowing as a sin, but perhaps I'm wrong? There's an agreement between me an my creditors and so far both of us are sticking to it.

[edit on 20-2-2009 by saint4God]
It came to mind after reading the comments about people refusing to take money that is rightfully theirs. Maybe the comment about "Cutting off your nose to spite your face" made by another poster was more appropriate.. Both represents overreactions to something you personally find offensive.





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