Illegal Immigrant - White Caucasian Settlers - Let Truth Be Spoken

reply to post by Jenna


That is just because the focus is on latin immigrants. No one goes around checking the asians, eastern indians, or africans if they are legal or not. And..there are quite a few illegal canadians, but no one cares about them either.

Originally posted by ModernAcademia
So i've been somewhat active in the thread about the ranch owner that assaulted some illegal immigrants and got fined, and because of this vigilanteism many are angry at the court outcome.

This angers me so much that many educated people on this board think this way.

I am sorry.

[Whether you want to remember or not, whether you think it's currently important or not all white caucasians in North America are the sons and daughters of not only illegal immigrants but crusaders that came here with Genocide as their passports.

My grandparents came on ellis island, i have their tickets if you wanna see them.

And they are quite pissed at the situation. Seeing as they had to perform child labor and eat oatmeal for years in order to afford to be here....legally. They quickly learned english and became contributing members of society.

[So the logic where, your grandfathers crusaded over here, then killed, raped, murdered the natives and then stuck the rest of them in 'reservations', and now after settling here through amnesty(because children born here are citizens even though their parents are immigrants) you call other illegals immigrants when they are just more peaceful and hungry versions of you great grandfathers is so very sad and has no logic whatsoever.

My grandfathers would smack you for saying such a thing. The father came over and worked till he could bring the next child. they worked till they could bring the next. It was two and a half years before the youngest child and the mother saw the family again, and were brought over. All legally. They went to college and volunteered to be in the war, and learned english.

If you went to the future and read this story in a book you would look at these people as horrible human beings. Before reading on please take a pause, close your eyes and pretend you are looking back at this as so.

I would think it quite dangerous to have 15 million people ignore the culture and the laws of a country and let them in anyways. Probably the same way I see Ceasar when he invaded the Gauls.

If Israel completely took over palestine, some of these same people would be anti-israel because they know it's wrong. But when they are the descendants of oppressors they have a different opinion.

Apples and oranges.For one, that is their problem. For two, it is a fight over a religious piece of land. And no, I don't agree with what Israel is doing.

You want to say that we are not our ancestors?

I should hope not. I would never eradicate the entire species of buffalo. I would not give the pox to children. I would not have participated in the gold rush.

BUT

What teh forebearers did was was leave oppression behind The survived under the worst duresses, then they created a revolution when oppression continued. They survived a civil war.

Fact is, in this country, we fight for what we want. When things got tough, we didn't go anywhere else. We pitted brother against brother in the civil war. We had 600000 people die, to either free slaves, and gain governmental rights.

We did NOT take our problems somewhere else. We asked for help when we needed it. But we kept put till we got it right and how we liked it.

See the thing is, our country has an entire history of taking care of business. So we don't think very highly of a people who just scoot when things got rough, instead of trying to fix their own problems.

If they ASK for help? sure. But they haven't. They have just taken it.

[And even if you refuse to remember it you still cannot call this your land.
So people should be able to go wherever their feet takes them.

So are you gonna pay for the property taxes for 350 million americans for the last 200 years or so? Are you gonna pay for the houses we built, the cities we built? We pay quite a bit of money for this land and as far as I am concerned, it is ours.

BTW, the native americans also own land.
Adn they can buy land whereever they want too, if they can get the hell out of the reservations.

Stop talking about the past and focus on future problems.

It's so unfair, your ancestors invade this place and today you call others who come here illegally yet peacefully and you call them what you are but are exempt because of amnesty.

There is nothing peaceful about it. Phoenix is now the kidnapping capital of the US. My car has been broken into three times in three years by illegal immigrants.

They come to my office and collect welfare checks in their brand name clothes and drive there in their new suvs and talk smack aobut the very americans who just paid for their welfare. They pretend they can't speak english. Our schools have degraded because teachers have to spend their time mentoring latin speaking children.

Your govt. sells guns, arms, puts a dictator in place in foreign nations, the people riot and you call them savages.

What does this have to do with the current subject?

Your govt. imperializes, installs bases in foreign land and the people retaliate and you call them terroists.

What are you smoking?

Many, none here i'm sure, but many tell black people to go back to their country when it was their ancestors who brought them here in the first place against their will.

To be clear, a lot of the black people were sold off by their own villages.
But I really don't recall anyone saying that anytime recently.

It's all so damn backwards, but you refuse to empathize because of the side of the fence which you reside in will hurt your conscience once you acknowledge it.

I am not un empathetic. But if it is so bad for them, maybe they should do somethign about it.
And, ASK for help. Don't take it.
And if one of these people who jump the fence without getting proper medical screening, and they bring a disease here, ask me how sympathetic I will be.

So if I am broke and I walk into your house and take 300 bucks out of your wallet you would be okay with that? becasue I am in need. And according to your theory, I should just be able to walk in and take it. I will eat your food, mess up your house, with no apologies. But hey, I am in NEED, so therefore I can do it. Since you are an immigrant, it is not your house.

This is hypocrisity in it's highest form!

I agree

So I ask you, please flag this thread, I wish for as many ATS members to come here and debate this topic as possible.

Even your asking for handouts.

But thank you for asking nicely.

reply to post by ModernAcademia


“Whether you want to remember or not, whether you think it's currently important or not all white caucasians in North America are the sons and daughters of not only illegal immigrants but crusaders that came here with Genocide as their passports.”

This is indicative of the reasoning of one who has suffered through the outcome based education system, or sat in some Socialist Reeducation Facility that is currently passed off as a college in America. Such revisionism of American history is at best sad; though apparently popular with statist bleeding hearts.

First off, such a crass generalization is symptomatic of the inability to reason; but I shall endeavor to attempt it. After reading some of the post to this thread, it appears I have a snowballs chance in hell however; ‘fearing not to charge in where angels fear to tread’, I digress.

Lest you forget, THIS is the reason the first Caucasians came to America: “In the name of God, Amen. We, whose names are underwritten, the Loyal Subjects of our dread Sovereign Lord, King James, by the Grace of God, of Great Britain, France and Ireland, King, Defender of the Faith, etc.

Having undertaken for the Glory of God, and Advancement of the Christian Faith, and the Honour of our King and Country, a voyage to plant the first colony in the northern Parts of Virginia; do by these Presents, solemnly and mutually in the Presence of God and one of another, covenant and combine ourselves together into a civil Body Politick, for our better Ordering and Preservation, and Furtherance of the Ends aforesaid…”

Notice the “Advancement of the Christian Faith” clause in the Mayflower Compact? This was the basis for the Doctrine of Manifest Destiny, which was that Europeans had been sent to establish a Christian nation in America.

While I acknowledge many evils have been done in the name of Christ, as well as by individual colonial state and local governments from the founding of our nation, this was never the intent of the Lord OR of the men who penned the Mayflower Compact, Declaration of Independence, and Bill of Rights and of those who signed the Constitution. While facing the obvious contradictions of what we said we believed and the reality of what was, our Founding Fathers began to challenge the national consciousness and worked to frame the national debate with the new and totally radical concepts that “All men are created equal…” To accuse them of having failed in this quest is to ignore the thousands of honored dead buried on battlefields across the southern United States. Remember the Amistad was NOT a limited example of our Courts siding with these radical ideals.

As has been said “The victor writes the history”, for certain the Liberals that have victoriously taken over our education system who have been “busy at historical revisionism, social reeducation and progressive enlightenment in our colleges and universities” have also been very busy rewriting our history books. Hence, our evil capitalist nation is the cause of all the world’s problems; to include all war, world hunger, social injustice and whatever else the liberal left needs to shift the blame for. Your problems of reeducation can be addressed, by the acquiring of some pre 1963 American and World History text.

"Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she with silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,

Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore.

Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

THIS is the clarion call of America; our greatness and purpose as defined as our national destiny.

[edit on 4/7/2009 by SGTChas]

You really really need to take this energy, take it out of history, and use it to bring attention to the plight of the native americans now. The fact is the native americans survived. But right now their culture is being eradicated every single day, to be lost forever. I have a friend who is the last of his tribe to speak his language. The atrocities they are suffering now is terrible. So stop worrying about what happened a long time ago and can't be undone and start helping the people who need it now.

Here, I will start. Because this needs peoples attention.


25% of native americans live below the poverty line

Present-Day Native American Life • The average life span in some tribes is 45 years. – Nationally, the average life span is about 10 years less than the average. • Deaths by suicide among Native American males aged 15 to 24 is 50% greater than among the general population’s youth. • The most serious problem facing Native Americans today is alcohol abuse.

the native americans



Native American women suffering shocking rates of rape


Charity Scams: Making Big Business Out of Native American Poverty

Just like the Jews with Israel this is the Mexican, and Native American homeland. All you white people do need to go home. God gave US this land and we will throw you out all in time. Same with the blacks and the asians. They all need to go back to their homelands. There is no reason why only one people (the jews) can claim a divine right to a land.

reply to post by romdog11


Well than I guess everyone needs to somehow cram themselves in Africa since that's where all of our modern DNA originated. By everyone I mean everyone: Americans, Native Americans, Asians, Europeans, Australians, etc. So that would mean that you have to leave too since your ancestors invaded the land when they first came here.

Originally posted by ModernAcademia
Thank you all for the above posts showing logic, understanding and empathy, the posts above the ones I am quoting.

I starred each of your posts.

Originally posted by stevegmu
You just seem to be pretty upset at the US. I take it you are American Indian?

Well, my grandparents on my father's side came here legally from Ireland and Germany, while my mother is Sicilian. Just one exception proves your statement incorrect.

No I was born in NY, my parents are east indian not native indian
and if your parents came here legally then correct me if i'm wrong but you are not a white caucasian.

I am talking solely about the descendants of european colonists.
But also everyone else to show some empathy, understanding and knowledge of history.

Originally posted by Jenna
Two wrongs don't make a right. Yeah our ancestors did some pretty awful things, none of which I condone, but none of us had any say in what happened nor can we help where we are born. Even though they came here and took over does not make it ok for people to enter the country illegally now. By that logic it would be perfectly fine for us to revert to slavery, except this time lets enslave all the white people and call those who aren't white indentured servants. We can even go back to whipping people for not doing farm work quickly enough. It'll be great.

Yes I understand what you are saying but that is not the purpose of this thread.

I don't believe in an eye for an eye, so I am not at all suggesting that the same should happen to you.

But at least remember and understand your history and how are here now.
Your race does not own this land, and it is imperative that you understand this.

Fine you don't like what happened in the past.
But you didn't mention that many of what happened in the past is occuring today again.

So it's so important that you remember.

Originally posted by Mynaeris
reply to post by stevegmu

 

I was pretty amazed by ModernAcademia's post. Mostly because he doesn't live in America. As far as I understand he lives in Canada and is an Indian immigrant there.

I am more confused by his statement about everybody being illegal immigrants. I suppose he never heard of Ellis Island?

I was born in NY as if that makes a difference.
Because no it doesn't.
I am not an illegal immigrant but I am still somewhat speaking on their behalf. But I guess that perspective is beyond you, or you wouldn't have mention where I live.

I never said everyone is an illegal immigrant you must have not understand my post.

Secondly it's imporant to understand that I am not insulting white caucasians living in North America, which includes both USA and Canada.
You only think the word immigrant is an insult because the media made you think so.

An immigrant is just a setter, and it's okay to settle.

But to be a son of a settler and then insult more 'recent' settlers has no logic whatsoever.

Your statements show your fierce lack of intelligence. Since 20 million + are in this country illegally. That's not just illegal IT'S AN INVASION.

reply to post by ModernAcademia


I understand what you are saying totally and agree to a point. However my sticking point with all this is that based on the current system we have in place, and the financial crisis we are in we cannot afford to have them essentially stealing American jobs, driving without licenses, car insurance, can't speak or read English, etc....atleast we eventually learned the language the Native Americans spoke instead of lazily expecting them to just understand us. If they are going to be here they have to follow the law or the hell with them. There's another post saying illegal immigrant children welfare cost just reached 600 million to the U.S. do you know what kind of costs and negative effect they are having on this economy. I'd say instead of just quoting history you need to look at the present and see all of the problems it is causing the country before you just say oh well we should just have a free for all and people should just be able to go where they want. I'd love it and in a perfect utopian world or atleast the simple world of 200 years ago that might work but based on the system, laws, population, and economic problems of today it's just not working so something has to be done.