Proving God to be fake... In under ten seconds...

Originally posted by Gregor100
www.youtube.com...

If you cant be bothered going to youtube the video says this:

"The god of the bible is claimed to be omnipotent and omniscient.

If you can change the future you are not omniscient.

If you cannot you are not omnipotent.

Myth busted"

Pretty hard evidence right there....

Edit - Well spotted out i mis-quoted... wooops..

[edit on 19/2/09 by Gregor100]

To understand nature of omnipotent being you have to be omnipotent too. In other case you simple cant.

The only thing you can prove is that humans are to narrow-minded to understand that mystery about everything which is vaster than ours three dimensional space. It’s simple, you cannot understand how the hypercube is but it is not a prove that hypercube is not possible. If you can explain every detail of God nature you have to be God too.
It’s ten second prove that your claim is wrong.


[edit on 20-2-2009 by odyseusz]

Okay... the only thing we've established in this thread is that it all comes down to one's personal opinion. The only problem I see is in everyone thinking their opinion is right all the time.

Originally posted by badmedia
But he can choose to create a rock that he can not lift, and he will not be able to lift it until he changes the rules that he can not lift it. Then he will lift it again. If you are all powerful it is nothing but a choice.

Haha! Reminds me of those "Homosexuality is a choice' t-shirts. Omnipotence is a choice!

Originally posted by mytquin
Like I said before on a similar thread...I'd rather place my trust in God and after I die, find out he doesn't exist than to NOT believe and find out that he DOES exist when it's too late...oops!
Let us know how that works out for ya bud.

Thats such a cop-out answer though... like "Im too afraid of getting dumped and heartbroken so Im never getting into a relationship". I'd rather not be dumped and find out it would have worked than take a chance...

Originally posted by username371
And then saying "What about a circle? Can god reach the end of that?

It doesnt take God to find the end of a circle. A circle ends with 'e'.

Originally posted by smokingmonkey
Atheism is among the most closed minded of dogmas. You owe it to yourself to stretch your mind and think a little harder about existence.

I wish that everyone would be forced to stand in front of a mirror while they say things. From all sides.

reply to post by Gregor100


Dude, these paradoxes even make atheist I know cringe. How do you show something is impossible by injecting an impossibility into the arguement.
There are much better arguements than these lame attempts, do some homework and on paradoxes, leave them alone as that is all they are good for.


What is the future to God? To us it is one thing, as we are finite, but are we using our interpretation of the future as the way God has to see it, a being infinite and eternal in nature. To know all possibilities is not the same as making them happen. What if all things are possible yet we define single events by acting within a field of all possibilities? God could still change single events along any finite time line as they are all possible within his eternal and infinite omniscetence, simply because they are finite, just measures of time, past, present, future. So really, there is no future or past for God. LOL. Only us. Paradox that into your conundrum.

This is almost as Bad as nj2days thread , www.belowtopsecret.com... with his omnipotent and omniscetent paradoxes. The mind boggles that people still cling on to these faulty paradoxes. It makes IDiers look positively rational.

p.s. Where is the rest of the chance of the gaps squad....noob and GW, nj?

Gooday nj2day

you seem like a very inteligent individual so i would like to ask you your Beleifs if i may

IS there a GOD or isnt there a GOD?

This has obviously been said as it's just that obvious, but hey. The god of the bible is only an interpretation of God, as seen by other religion's individual perspective of what a 'God' is.

Religion needs God, God does not need religion.

EMM

reply to post by ElectroMagnetic Multivers


The choice is simple: one chooses either a self existent God or a self existent universe, and the universe is not behaving as if it is self existent. In fact, according to the second law of thermodynamics, the universe is running down like a clock or, better, cooling off like a giant stove. Energy is constantly being diffused or dissipated, that is, progressively distributed throughout the universe. If this process goes on for a few billion more years, and scientists have never observed a restoration of dissipated energy, then the result will be a state of thermal equilibrium, a "heat death," a random degradation of energy throughout the entire cosmos and hence the stagnation of all physical activity.

Originally posted by ElectroMagnetic Multivers
This has obviously been said as it's just that obvious, but hey. The god of the bible is only an interpretation of God, as seen by other religion's individual perspective of what a 'God' is.

Religion needs God, God does not need religion.

EMM

I feel God is looking for a relationship. Not a religion.

Originally posted by ElectroMagnetic Multivers
This has obviously been said as it's just that obvious, but hey. The god of the bible is only an interpretation of God, as seen by other religion's individual perspective of what a 'God' is.

Religion needs God, God does not need religion.

EMM

To those who have accepted the bible, God as described within is not an interpretation. God is the alpha and the omega, he is NOT all things but exists within all things. The words of the bible are God breathed and the only way to salvation. This is true for all his children, but his gift of free will is the reason people deny him.

[edit on 20-2-2009 by doodle99]

reply to post by lunarminer


I believe that Greeks did have a concept of afterlife (Hades) and there was judgment upon which was decided where people go (heaven or hell)...

I never, ever claimed that there was not, or that there never will be God. Even though I consider myself an Atheist I always "preached" gospel of I do NOT know. I'm not willing to give up my free thinking for promise of afterlife because it's highly illogical and quite frankly self destructive (mentally).

Whales you say ?

For all we know we could be just the dream of the dolphin, lol

reply to post by Gregor100


You've proved nothing, but maybe your wisdom makes you feel better?

Deep down inside you know there is a Creator, because the argument that everything has been created by nothing doesn't take a YouTube video to debunk- it is complete nonsense.

The wisdom of man is foolishness to God.

You mock and discredit those who chose to believe in the God of the Bible, yet this is a complete waste of your time- and it is a LOSE/LOSE proposition for you. If you are correct, you won't even be able to say "I told you so" when you die. If you are incorrect, (and you are), you will have an eternity in torment to ponder your foolish "wisdom" so expertly documented here.

Humble yourself and seek God while you have time and He will reveal Himself to you.

reply to post by 5thElement


I very clearly stated that the earliest form of the Greek religion did not allow for an afterlife. The concept of Hades came out of the second or third generation of their religion and was probably due to the Greek religion being influenced by the Egyptians.

The modern interpretation of Hades, is Hell. However that is not how the Greeks saw it. The human spirit did not really exist for the Greeks. What endured after death was the shade, more or less a memory image of the person. All human life went to Hades, whether they were good, bad, or indifferent. Your afterlife lasted only as long as you were remembered. So, the Greeks put a lot of stock into making a great name for ones self, because the longer the memory of a person endured, the longer their shade endured in the afterlife.

So, do a little study on the subject, then think about it. The existance of an afterlife is not necessary to a religion. Many religions exist that do not have the concept of afterlife.

Now, the western interpretation of God does include an afterlife. Most religions of the Judeo-Christian-Muslem type do have a heaven and a hell. It is interesting to note that while these terms are in common usage among the various sects, they have vastly different meanings to them. Some emphasise Heaven, while minimizing Hell. Others do the opposite. Anyway, to most of them the idea of afterlife is gift from a benevolent and caring God.

This thread however is about the existance of God and as I have pointed out, the existance (or non-existance) of God does not depend upon a mortal humans prospects for an afterlife. So, I stuck to the topic.

I would also like to point out that your attempts in inject the Bible, Heaven, Hell, afterlife, etc. is a lame attempt to ferritt out my personal religious beliefs, then you can find some crack in the belief system to exploit. Nice try, but my personal beliefs are also irrelevant to the topic. God either exists, or He does not. My beliefs do not, and cannot change that.

Originally posted by doodle99

To those who have accepted the bible, God as described within is not an interpretation. God is the alpha and the omega, he is NOT all things but exists within all things. The words of the bible are God breathed and the only way to salvation. This is true for all his children, but his gift of free will is the reason people deny him.

[edit on 20-2-2009 by doodle99]

Very true, I do not prescribe to the God of the bible, but I was hoping to point out that 'proving' God does not exist as the bible states, does not disprove the existence of God.

EMM

reply to post by lunarminer


Humble yourself and seek God while you have time and He will reveal Himself to you.

Because in the end God's creations even though they will go through bad times will come out 100times better than the first idea in the long run, either way he wins. If you don't do anything in life, nothing comes out of it and sometimes along the way there will be obsticles but in the end you know your choice was right otherwise it would have been an idea without any outcome.

God knew that if he did not send the flood in Noah's time we would not be here today. He helps us along if man and fallen angels battle it out in earth that is ruled by the Devil who want's to wipe Adam's bloodline off the map which then God know's that is cheating because he has his own plans too.

I think i can do the exact opposite and prove that God does exist in under 10 seconds. one of the most basic laws of physics is cause and effect, for every action there is a reaction. if we trace that back all the way to the beginning of existence, we run into a problem; something had to start existence without itself being started. this phenomena is "God", although some choose to humanize Him, but basically something had to create without being created.

Originally posted by nj2day
I didn't say that... But if hell exists... its gotta be where the party's at.

This is such a idiotic response to the concept of Hell. Now I'm not saying that Hell is real or not, but if you subscribe to the descriptions of Hell, it simply cannot be a "party".

This is a very similar attitude as the saying "I'd rather be partying with the sinners than crying with the saints." It doesn't make sense. Why would anyone consider Hell a place where anyone can have any sense of joy?

Here is my short list of misconceptions regarding Hell:

- Satan does not rule in Hell. He is there to be punished for eternity after the final judgement.
- Satan does not currently reside in Hell. He is free to roam the Earth.
- Joy will not exist in Hell.
- Love will not exist in Hell.

What makes anyone think that there is some form of companionship in Hell? It's not a social club for the "bad kids".

You can flame me if you want, but either you don't believe in Hell at all or you believe in Hell as the ultimate punishment. Period.

Originally posted by AdmiralObamaGFOL

Humble yourself and seek God while you have time and He will reveal Himself to you.

AdmiralObamaGFOL,

Galactic Federation of Light perhaps? The UFO Cult?

How can you believe in the old testament "fire and brimstone" god and the GFL space brothers of eternal Love, Light & Laughter at the same time? Just Curious because they are diabolically opposed from an idealogical stand point.



Nanoo Nanoo etc
IRM

reply to post by WickettheRabbit


I think hell is the bottomless pit and a seperate realm but the lake of fire is the ultimate punishment or closure where everything stops existing there which included death it self. The two are different things all together and myth seems to have distorted the truth which is why people seem to hate God for it or question his motives. There seems to be a few stages before the lake of fire it does not happen untill the 1000 years of peace is over anyway when the Devil is in Hell then let out again to cause another deception in which God tehn throws him and his followers in the lake of fire which is not hell but another realm.

Originally posted by mytquin
Like I said before on a similar thread...I'd rather place my trust in God and after I die, find out he doesn't exist than to NOT believe and find out that he DOES exist when it's too late...oops!
Let us know how that works out for ya bud.

So, you are hedging your bets?

Do you understand why Jesus is driving the money changers out of "the temple" saying, this is supposed to be a house of prayer for all nations, but you have turned it into a den of thieves"?

Peace

reply to post by The time lord



I was talking about the concept of Hell, not the "nuts and bolts" of the difference between Sheol, Hell, the Lake of Fire, etc. Your common believer and non-believer know the concept of Hell, so that's what I was referring to.

All that being said...I believe you are right.