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History of Un-armed Citizens

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posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:37 AM
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Originally posted by Jay-in-AR
reply to post by W3RLIED2
 


Ummm... No, I don't think so. You combined known history and what you SPECULATE is fact about Obama.

Like I said. History and conspiracy theory.
In fact, Obama is ON THE RECORD stating that he WILL NOT take a hunter's weapons away.
Therefore, your entire premise is jacked up. Unless you are now willing to grant me that you are postulating a theory of conspiracy.


Ummmm. He won't exactly be the one doing it. Will he? So, he's being honest, but, truth can still hurt.




posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 03:44 AM
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reply to post by psyko45
 


I'm a missouri resident, also, and for a large city, it's actually very moderate as far as crime violent goes. It exists, but, I walk around there in the dark even near Grand and Delour (and I'm white) even unarmed I am met with politeness and not bothered by anyone, in fact in STL I found some of the nicest communities you'd ever want to be in. Everyone has a high level of respect for themselves. I wonder if the fact that you can own handguns and get concealment licenses fairly easy have anything to do with that? In fact, I know a lot of Police and all the County sheriff's there, and, they are greatful for armed law abiding citizen's backing them up in hot and heavy firefights that do occur. Not that there are alot of them. People generally handle it before they get there and they sort out the mess like Police are supposed to do. That's actually how it was supposed to work in the first place.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 04:13 AM
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reply to post by coven
 


You jumped in a little to fast, my frind J said a background check was enough. All that other crap he said the Government does NOT need to know. Pay attention to detail. That you didn't makes me wonder about your age or true intent. Only a complete baffoon would believe this thread, much less this sit, isn't heavily trolled by Government monitors, disinformants, discreditors, and instigators. Your style makes me ponder this aspect, I wonder why that I is. I think I'll keep to my instinct on this and add you to the growing list of those to be more attentive to.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 09:25 AM
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Let see how this work. You got to store and by a rifle with ammo. Then bunch of a solders are showing up and demand you to go with them. You live in a normal house and have wife and kids with you in that house. You decided to refuse to go and start firing with your rifle. The solders return fire and you and your family are dead. Question #1: Who give to you a right to decide of life of your wife and kids. Did you ask them before you open a fire?
#2: Did you really think at that moment that you can defend their life's?.
The brave one will exit the house and draw attention to himself so his family could escape(small chance but it is a chance). You could pay for that with your life, but you will give to your family a chance to live.
Now imagine another scenario: You are( and your family) living in a mountains. You build a house inside a mountain, Not too low and not at the top. You have a food supply and water to last for at least 5 years. You have a mine field surrounding that mountain and heavy gun machine. Few missile to take a planes down. The whole complex is good enough to sustain even a nuke blast,
Noe the solders are coming to get you and you respond. They run for their life's.
You have a chance to defend your and your family life`s.
That would be a smart.
As I said before - there it is a difference between being brave and being stupid.
With one are you?
Sport hunting - what it is a sport have to do with?. You get a rifle with a scope and shut an animal from a distance without any chance that any harm can be done to yourself. In my book - that it is not a sport - it is a "chicken #" game. Real man will chase that animal on foot and combat "hand to hand".
I guess that will be too much for most of those "hunters" as they are too fat to make 20 yards.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 09:46 AM
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Originally posted by liesnomore
I do not own a gun and I do not want a gun. Any firearms promote a violence.
The most people what "scare" me with guns are the Law Enforcement in any form. The can kill innocent person and "walk away" free of any charges.
If you want to feel safe - write petition to your Governor to enforce existing gun law.Draft all gang members to serve in military - that will solve the shortage and disarm all Law Enforcement officers. That way the law obedient citizens will have no reason to fear and firearms will not be needed.
There are many ways to stop the opponent without taking a life.



WTF???
I would rather see gang members in jail. Not in the military where they can get training in how to kill and terrorize better or more efficiently.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 10:25 AM
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Originally posted by groingrinder

Originally posted by liesnomore
I do not own a gun and I do not want a gun. Any firearms promote a violence.
The most people what "scare" me with guns are the Law Enforcement in any form. The can kill innocent person and "walk away" free of any charges.
If you want to feel safe - write petition to your Governor to enforce existing gun law.Draft all gang members to serve in military - that will solve the shortage and disarm all Law Enforcement officers. That way the law obedient citizens will have no reason to fear and firearms will not be needed.
There are many ways to stop the opponent without taking a life.



WTF???
I would rather see gang members in jail. Not in the military where they can get training in how to kill and terrorize better or more efficiently.

When you take a gang member and send him to a training camp - you will be surprise of how many of them will turn up to be a "decent" human being. Training and discipline can do a "miracle" and turn a man around



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 02:17 PM
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Since you have plenty of smarter people here explaining things, I'll go somewhere with more testosterone and gang bang stories, OP.
grunt, grunt.

P.S. Try to take my guns, and see what happens fool.
No your vest wont do ya any good either.

Edit cuz I'm a moron, sorry for the intrusion!
One moron leaving, thanks for noticing and pointing that out!
I'm going to special olympics right now.
Bye, totally always smart people that know everything.
Now you can have more grown up conversations for sure!



[edit on 20-2-2009 by dodadoom]



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 02:21 PM
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Originally posted by liesnomore
When you take a gang member and send him to a training camp - you will be surprise of how many of them will turn up to be a "decent" human being. Training and discipline can do a "miracle" and turn a man around


Or, in respect to sending them to the military, we get a gang-banger whose now proficient in small-arms, physically fit, and trained in squad tactics.

www.stripes.com...

FBI says gangs using military to spread

Gangs spreading in the military

Damned if you do, etc...



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 04:28 PM
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I am stocking up on ammo! I have enough guns and I am afraid that ammo will soon be in short supply. YES Obama wants to elimiate private ownership of firearms. He has voted for EVERY gun control bill that came before him. He has never seen a gun control bill he didn't like! Check his record! If you unarm the people it is easy to control them. WAKE UP AMERICA!



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 04:52 PM
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One can not dismiss the whole class because of few bad students. Gangs,fraternity,secret society always was in military and among civilian society. There always be a small portion of people enjoy killing, but by drafting a gang members - some of them my have a chance to become a good citizen.
Gang,fraternity,secret society - different name, but the some effect.
Gang member my come up to you on a street and shut you for a dollar.
Others will use a silencer and shut you from a distance. What it is a difference?.
A dead it is a dead. Just give them a chance.



posted on Feb, 20 2009 @ 05:22 PM
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This is utterly ridiculous

We don't have guns in the UK and it hasn't done us any harm.

The few people that DO own guns are ridiculous.

It was recently all over our news that an 11 yr old child died it the crossfire of a gang shooting in Liverpool, all over the national media.

I bet over there it wouldn't have made the front page in any newspaper apart from the local ones.

You guys are a world apart. Guns are violent. Guns kill.

There is no need for a gun this day and age.



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 01:38 AM
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Originally posted by msm1003
Only in America can someone try to affectively use events such as Bloody Sunday and the Nazi Regime as arguments towards the need for guns. You claim that it isn't guns that kill people but its people that kill people? And you are damn right, but maybe this slipped you by, but people are killing people with GUNS. You claim that taking away guns will mean you can't defend yourself, and maybe that is true to an extent, but if it is done correctly then you shouldn’t need a gun to defend yourself because there wouldn't be any more guns...

Shame on you all.


If we did as you proposed we would all be equal. Then, we would all have an equal chance to gang up on America and do what many would loved to have done along time ago. Fear. Yes. If I wanted to live under your laws, I would move there. Because we don't I live here. I am my Government. I can legally overthrow my Government. I have a say, and, because of guns, I am heard. It is as simple as that. I don't really care what others do. If they want to go about killing. Fine. I will shoot back. Then, I won't have to worry about them anymore. Shoot at my kid, she will shoot you. Shoot at her friends, she will shoot you. Shoot at her, We both will shoot you. See how that works. Since, noone is stupid enough to shoot at her or me. I am also an Ambassador of my Country. I have leverage in a debate. I don't impose my will on my fellow man because he is armed. He doesn't impose his will on me because I am armed. And, in a Global meltdown, seems like your farmer fairs better odds than your scholar. Life and Decay, that is the natural world. Man is a mimic of all he sees in nature, that is his survival ability. His eyes are located not to the side where you must certainly be straining to look, but, forward looking. That is because man is by nature a predator. Now, we sugar coat that with words like racist, supremist, greed, fearful, and the like, but, to deny the nature of a wild animal is foolish. To believe man is not a natural creature of the wild is a delusion. You live in fantasy land. It's not about guns. It's about control. Give that up for guns, or anything else, and another will seize on it. That is not fear. That is nature. You'd think environmentalists would be less naive. No wonder the Grizzly man got ate and Steve Irwin got pirced through the heart, and so many victims ignored their instincts.
Maybe, you will live a ripe old peaceful life, bless ya, I hope so, but, if there really is holding companies created just to go into a controlled bankruptcy, so, the primary banks can keep all the money, as service agents, and we are paying into the global bank takeover scam, everytime we buy a house that forecloses during high unemployment, while they buy up all the forclosures and stocks as collateral, to own everything, etc. If even an ounce is correct. You may find you were tricked into thinking exactly what they have taught you to think. Use your Instinct. If the UK is unarmed, and it all becomes one big free for all, do you trust that I and others won't come a callin'? Do you really think you are as safe as you presume. I am a predator. All man is. If he pretends to be an herbivore, when he is an omnivore, what is really going on? Who convinced him he is what he's not. Why?

[edit on 21-2-2009 by PhyberDragon]



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 02:04 AM
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Originally posted by americandingbat
reply to post by thisguyrighthere
 


Perhaps that's because the '94 bill wasn't unconstitutional.

What I'm arguing is that you don't need to worry about them repealing the 2nd Amendment. Some gun control, yes that's probably on the agenda. But the OP's claim that President Obama wants to abolish the 2nd Amendment as one of his main goals is unwarranted.

As I said in an earlier post, it is at the least unwarranted because even someone who leans as far to the left and hates guns as much as I do, would not stand for repealing a part of the Bill of Rights.

edit: and Clinton did not "ban firearms"


[edit on 2/19/09 by americandingbat]


No. You just want to piecemeal it away. That is abolishment. The OP is correct and justified.

"You know that little white speck on top of chicken sh@%? That's chicken sh@%, too."-- Pure Country



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 02:36 AM
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If one student . . . certainly if 2-3 students in each of the student killing situations had had a gun . . . and been trained to use it . . .


Then, maybe, the wrong one would have been shot.
I am originally from Paducah, Ky (Little Chicago) and knowing the friends and families of those involved, here's an inside source you won't get from the news. Michael (the shooter)'s father was a lawyer, he was authoritarian, and had little time for Michael, and, I personally knew the man before the event and he was not a very empathetic or emotional person. He was guarded emotionally, so, they weren't close as far as emotional bond's go. Those kid's in the prayer group, those saint's of the media's delusional world, they beat, bullied, harrassed, and embarrassed Michael every day before and after school. Michael could not get his father to listen and was told the turn the other cheek and report it spill. So, he'd report it at the school, the teachers would ask the kid's of the prayer group and they'd deny it, saying Michael harrased them daily because they prayed. Michael one morning decides he's had enough, and, he's scared to go to school, only, he could play hookey only so long. One morning, he decides to scare them, not kill them, to make them stop. He wasn't very skilled with using a gun, as he rarely did any father son bonding things like that, and he thought he had an empty gun. No. It was loaded and one in the chamber. He get's to school, the kid's gave him his morning dose of ass whooping, then, congregated in the building by their locker's. If you knew the school building at all, it's in a back wing with an outer door to the grounds, and the teacher's had either not arrived yet, or, were off down the other side of the building having coffee in their lounge. One or two may have been in the classrooms that early. Most other kids were off in the cafeteria. A few other straglers running around , but, too early for class. The prayer group met in a side class not too far off from the outer door. They congregate by their lockers. Michael comes in and says, you need to leave me alone. You can't keep beating me up. The boy who led the prayer group, their pack leader, we'll say, steps towards him and says, basically, what are you going to do if we don't? The others start laughing at Michael because of this. Michael, scared and nervous, reaches down to pick up his back pack and leave. The boy shoves him to the ground and says don't walk away from me when I'm talking to you. Michael, hurt and angry, and scared, unzips his backpack, fumbles a bit, when the boy kicks him, and shakily pulls out the gun. He warns them to back off. Then he gets up and starts walking backwards out the door (he was going home). The boy, steps forward at Michael and says what are you going to do shoot me? That thing's not even loaded. You want to shoot me? Now, I'm really going to kick your ass! He lunges toward's Michael, who scared, pulls the trigger. Some of the others went to bumrush him and take the gun, he shot them, too. He let the others run away. It's a long hall. It's the only way they could have gotten away.

The media was told this. The authorities and lawyers were told this, the locals know this. I heard it from firsthand witnesses. But, anti gun, prison schools, mental health pushes, anti school prayer, and other agenda's were the only thing any of them were concerned with. Raping the truth to do it.

Michael was painted as a 15 year old emotionless bully and monster who premeditatively went to school and targeted sweet innocent older kids from well to do background's because they pray, he preyed on them.

Fact is always stranger than fiction. It is not the man with a gun who has scared people throughout history, it is the man in the cloth.


[edit on 21-2-2009 by PhyberDragon]



posted on Feb, 21 2009 @ 02:58 AM
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An arguement for gun bans is an arguement for slaverly. Read your history. Only slaves are unarmed, and the first act of any tyrant is to disarm the populace.

In light of the current situation, which is dire, who would want to remain unable to defend themselves? Willing slaves.



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 12:50 AM
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Originally posted by PhyberDragon
reply to post by coven
 


You jumped in a little to fast, my frind J said a background check was enough. All that other crap he said the Government does NOT need to know.


And my opinion is that they should. Too bad we differ on that, eh?
thank god we both live in America, or you could actually tell me otherwise!



Pay attention to detail. That you didn't makes me wonder about your age or true intent.


I would advise speaking in the mirror with that comment. Those that make it validate others questions of their age and intent.



Only a complete baffoon would believe this thread, much less this sit(e), isn't heavily trolled by Government monitors, disinformants, discreditors, and instigators.

Really...

What about this....


I had a cop want to shoot me once when I was about 17. He was notorious for shooting at unarmed people and planting weapons from the crime locker on them. Fortuanately I had a couple of handguns and shotgun to hold him off. Reenforcements arrived and I and some friends found ourselves in a standoff with over 56 agents.


So not only did you get off for being involved in a police stand-off, but you were a media darling for it. Funny, you claim growing up in Paducah... Something like that would have surely made the news 35 miles south...

Or this



I simply select the leader of the group. And I go after them only. I block out everyone else and go straight for the leader. When I take them down, I target the next leader apparent. And usually by the third leader they disperse. I make it a point to permanately scar their face. So that every day they look in the mirror they remember me. Image is a key to survival, people are self conscience of their appearance. I make them know I was there. And when next me meet, they cross the street. They decide I am not worth losing their face, literally, over. I have no problems taking it all off.


So you're a solo gang-bust in Missouri now? WOW...

or this



I have a say, and, because of guns, I am heard. It is as simple as that. I don't really care what others do. If they want to go about killing. Fine. I will shoot back. Then, I won't have to worry about them anymore. Shoot at my kid, she will shoot you. Shoot at her friends, she will shoot you. Shoot at her, We both will shoot you. See how that works. Since, noone is stupid enough to shoot at her or me.


You both are bound to be killed by police one day with that mindset...

There is a Term often used in the law enforcement field for this mindset. Shoot first ask questions later.





Your style makes me ponder this aspect, I wonder why that I is. I think I'll keep to my instinct on this and add you to the growing list of those to be more attentive to.


Being that I draw up negative feelings within you, Please do me a favor, and ignore I even exist... you're blatant accusation is neither founded, nor necessary to my comment.

If you have the audacity to contrive me within a listing which your own quotes prove you to be within, I would rather not have to debate you.

your posts prove some other things as well, which need to brought to the attention of my fellow ATSer's.

a) you have some kind of Super man complex (read quotes Above)

b) if what you say is true, you should be in jail for assault (even if it was on criminals, you have no authority to distribute justice)

c) your posting style shows the tell-tale signs of either a compulsive liar, or one so desperate for attention as to spin yarns even Hollywood would find too unbelievable to sell...
Cont. next post




[edit on 2/22/2009 by coven]



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 12:57 AM
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So, to finish... you see the little

Ignore Button?

Push it and we can be a happy family again.


after all Dis-agreement, is what leads to Dis-information. It's a two way street pal.

Coven Out

[edit on 2/22/2009 by coven]



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 12:05 PM
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reply to post by rufusthestuntbum
 


Well, over here we don't like the thought of our government getting a big head over its people and deciding to one day remove the U.S. Constitution (even though they have slowly, systematically done so). It is the Constitution that posses limited government and thereby protects our people from a totalitarian authority. The reason you still have your freedoms in the UK (along with your perception on this issue) is because we Americans still have our 2nd amendment right over here. The NWO UK takeover will not happen until they get our guns away from us first. ...Why? Because if the EU pushed you further into a police state, the average American Joe Six Pack would see the outcome, losing any trust he has left in our government, and would arm up a real resistance rather than willingly turn in his assault weapons via the brain washing you have succumbed to.

You see, hunting rifles pose little to no threat to a martial law scenario where our government overthrows (suspends indefinitely with prejudice) our Constitution and Bill of Rights in order to force us into a one world government starting with the NAU.

It is easier for the NWO (shadow government) to go forth with its diabolical plans if the people are unarmed or pose little to no resistance as is the case in the U.K.

Think about the reason (we) freedom fighting Americans will not give up our right to own any gun, which would give complete power and control to the state. Remember: it is not guns that kill people; people kill people.

Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely: Friedrich Nietzsche



posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 02:29 PM
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i just wish they would hurry up and enact the gun grabbing laws so the uprising can start OR toss the bill out so i can start buying ammo again at reasonable prices. I went to 5, count em, 5 gun stores friday in search of one single box of Federal HST's for my XD40 and every place was plumb out of ammo. ALL ammo for every gun i own is gone ,just an empty shelf with a ridiculous price tag underneath it.

at one of the stores i went to the owner of the place had a sweet ride outside with 22 inch rims, custom paint etc. and had a sticker that said "GO OBAMA." this "fear" reverberating through the gun community about Obama taking guns has made this man rich. Obama has become a better gun salesman that Sam Colt. The sooner the fear mongering stops the sooner i can go back to enjoying my hobby.

as far as the HR 45 bill goes. if there was any time better for something like this to pass it is now, the political stage is set for something like this to breeze through.. BUT we are lucky enough to have a financial crisis on our hands to tie up this slew of gun grabbers we elected into office.
sooo.. thank god for the recession ???? ...???



posted on Feb, 23 2009 @ 06:30 AM
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reply to post by ExistenceUnknown
 


What stupid white americans need is bullet control. Watch Bowling for Columbine.



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