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OMG! Lock Bumping and Bump Keys (URGENT)

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posted on Feb, 18 2009 @ 08:21 AM
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They should never have exposed this!!!!

Think about how many criminals just found a new way into homes...They shouldn't have shown how to do it...It's ridiculous.

I will try on my door later to see what happens. I suggest anyone who doesn't feel safe to put a chain on the door.

And c'mon now..if your home, your going to hear someone "bumping" your lock.

I feel that this being exposed is going to create far more problems than solutions.




posted on Feb, 18 2009 @ 08:30 AM
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Originally posted by AceOfAces
They should never have exposed this!!!!

Think about how many criminals just found a new way into homes...They shouldn't have shown how to do it...It's ridiculous.

I will try on my door later to see what happens. I suggest anyone who doesn't feel safe to put a chain on the door.

And c'mon now..if your home, your going to hear someone "bumping" your lock.

I feel that this being exposed is going to create far more problems than solutions.


Do you have a bump key? They aren't simply your house key you do have to grind it down. Anyway the criminals already know this don't you get that? They knew it years ago because it was going on years ago. It has only recently surfaced in the media after the industry took action to make bump proof locks (which mostly failed).

Again, criminals don't generally have the brains to bother with this, they prefer just breaking in with other methods. I'm talking about your average burglar. Anyone with knowledge of bumping is very likely going to go for a slightly bigger prize and be well versed in security technologies.

Everyone needs to sit back and relax and try and think it through. Raising these issues forces the industry to deal with them.



posted on Feb, 18 2009 @ 08:43 AM
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Right.. you know. It's too much to ask for us to just get some flippin' privacy isn't it?

Humanity has lost its Humanity.



posted on Feb, 18 2009 @ 08:51 AM
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reply to post by earthman4
 


People always look at me like I'm crazy when I say that a lock only stops a lazy thief, and slows down the others.



posted on Feb, 18 2009 @ 09:14 AM
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I used to foreclose houses this is old news to me. en fact bump keys are old news very old. you can buy a whole set for 50ish bucks online(or at least when i last checked). you wanna discourage people? get a dog get a deadbolt and a gun. i can't count the amount of times i have found people peaking in threw my windows only to be scared off by my 3 dogs. I think of my dogs as a super high tech alarms that go off if anyone is within 10 feet of my house.



posted on Feb, 18 2009 @ 09:41 AM
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reply to post by Bringer
 


When you say a whole set i think you mean a small selection. A locksmith i know has an entire garage wall devoted to bump keys. He hammered in small peg and hangs keys on depending on year and manufacturer. I am unsure how many he has but it must be over 1000 and he's still going strong lol.

People really should not worry about this.



posted on Feb, 18 2009 @ 10:49 AM
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reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984
 


Ya kill from behind is never acceptable, wait for him to turn around!!!!!



posted on Feb, 18 2009 @ 12:23 PM
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no worries folks!

I'm a locksmith and as mentioned above, this method has existed since locks were invented. Any lock can be picked, drilled, pulled...on and on. So, the thought of bumping being a major threat is needles worry. Often times anyone that would break into a house wouldn't really care to be so sneaky. In fact, lock bumping is often noisy and also does not work well in many locks for a number of reasons, not the least of which is if your lock is gummy or dirty then bumping won't likely happen, in fact even if your lock is too old and weak it can also prevent bumping. Non bumpable locks exist if you want to spend the coin, but an alarm is better.



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 04:03 AM
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Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
no worries folks!

I'm a locksmith and as mentioned above, this method has existed since locks were invented. Any lock can be picked, drilled, pulled...on and on. So, the thought of bumping being a major threat is needles worry. Often times anyone that would break into a house wouldn't really care to be so sneaky. In fact, lock bumping is often noisy and also does not work well in many locks for a number of reasons, not the least of which is if your lock is gummy or dirty then bumping won't likely happen, in fact even if your lock is too old and weak it can also prevent bumping. Non bumpable locks exist if you want to spend the coin, but an alarm is better.


Totally agree and as a hobby lockpicker I'd like to put this overblown thread to bed.

Yes you can bump doors but unless you have a natural and very lucky technique it's both too noisy and too long for the average thief. There's also a far more scary / easier way to gain entry which is used pretty much as the first choice for a locksmith (NO, I'm not saying what it is but it's true).

But are these used by the thieves of today, NO, the average con either crow bars the door or smashes a window, it's the fastest point of entry.

What is scary is that people in this day and age don't have 2 locks on the door, most trust a standard cylinder lock which is for a locksmith normally very easy to get past but if you add a deadbolt lock then it's a whole new ballgame.

You see, that's why the thief boots the door down, faffing around with lock picks, bump keys etc is just too much hassle.

Oh, don't get conned too much into products which claim to make a lock bump proof, yes it makes the lock hard to bump, not much harder to pick and can be 'washed' out of the lock with the right freely available every day used chemical.

So please stop worrying about being 'bumped', it's a very old idea that's been around for many years and like this thread is used to scare rather than it being something that goes on, just get yourself a couple of good locks, an alarm if you fear the worst and perhaps CCTV if someone does get in.

Don't fall for these James Bond idea's of a person pushing a couple of bits of metal in the door and bingo it's open, the actual truth is that it's a skill that needs to be learnt and even for a seasoned locksmith is no guarantee of instant entry....



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 04:08 AM
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Oh, and just one last thing, don't be stupid and help a thief, the number of people who hang their keys up by the front door on a rack is dumbfounding. The nice thief carries a long pole with a hook on it and simply lifts the keys off the rack via the letter box.



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 05:16 AM
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Originally posted by DrumsRfun
reply to post by Ian McLean
 


I've tried to get those and unless you are a locksmith then they won't sell them to you.


Took me 15 seconds

Lock Guns

I'm not all that concerned about this and I will tell ya why. If a burglar or a well-trained murderer wants in, they are going to get in. Your mean dogs won't mean a thing if he takes care of that situation and your gun does absolutely nothing if you aren't there to use it. Bad things happen and as much as I don't want admit it myself, it could happen to me. So what you do is secure as best possible then try to live without freaking over everything.

-Kyo



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 05:32 AM
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Nothing I care about. Anyone with half a brain can break into my crappy house in 30 seconds with no tools, without bothering with the door. In fact, for the first couple of weeks I was here, I didn't have a key, so just broke into it whenever I wanted in. Sometimes, I practice picking my own lock. Regular lock picking does take longer than bump-keys though.

Chances are, your house is laughably unsecure, if you know what you're doing. Fortunately, your average criminal isn't much of an expert in such matters either. It's still next to impossible to stop a very determined person from getting in, though.

[edit on 19-2-2009 by mdiinican]



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 05:48 AM
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lol, tiger happy grand theft auto playing hillbillies. shut off the rambo show and quit the beear m'aam



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 09:35 AM
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reply to post by TrueAmerican
 


Oh, gee guys, think about it. Anyone wanting to invade a home can do any number of things to gain access.

There’s the old plastic card in the door crack, screw driver wedge, pop a lock, etc. Most of this info is available in the back of comic books and popular science mags. This is old stuff.

Anyone aspiring to this vocation starts off with the locksmith kit. They get arrested, and then they get a real education on home invasion while in jail.

The best defense is neighborhood watch program and to practice some common sense ideas, like keeping the house looking as if someone is always home. Timers on the lights, photo sensors, etc and never, never, never, never ever let a door to door salesman, a missionary, or anyone you haven’t contacted and purposefully requested to come to your house, inside the door. Dismiss then firmly and quickly, asap. Don’t give them the time of day.

There are scores of teams of groups that go door to door across the nation. Moving from town to town and then retracing the same routes over and over. They generally employee young people to sell anything and everything in this way. Magazine subscriptions, cleaning products, cologne, candles, ice cream and steak routes and even more bold, home security systems. They are coached to say anything to get the sale. They keep a record of good addresses, those who are receptive to this type of sales and how far a person gets into the home. Often the kids involved have no clue at this point as to what will happen to some of these people.

Once a database is created, the real purpose emerges and the adult team does a drive from town to town. They are quick, purposeful and have no BS about what they are doing. They will gain entry, take what they came to get and quickly move to the next target on the database. It is a very lucrative business and these people are quick and dangerous. The average boost time is under three mins which includes pulling into the driveway and pulling out.

Just thought I'd share!



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 10:24 AM
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This doesn't mean a lick a difference in my neighborhood where the thieves just kick in your back door and take what they want when you are at work in the broad daylight. Thats the MO for where I live. It's widespread and terrible.



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 12:10 PM
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reply to post by DrumsRfun
 


Wrong. You can get those lock guns at cheaperthandirt dot com. Forty bucks. Probably other places, too.



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 02:23 PM
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I've read through this thread and several times posters have said something along the lines of "windows break, locks can be drilled out, sledge hammers, door jam spreading etc, if someone wants in bad enough they're getting in, all your security measures are illusions anyway."

This is all true, but the important thing to remember is that your insurance company will only cover a robbery if there is evidence of forced entry. Bump keys leave no evidence of forced entry since nothing is damaged at all. If you try to tell the insurance company there are no signs of forced entry, the door was open and all your stuff is gone, they will conclude you left the door unlocked, thus leaving you completely screwed.

My recommendation is to at least make it difficult enough for a burglar to gain entry that they do have to break something to get in, thus leaving evidence of forced entry and thereby allowing you to make a claim on your home owners insurance.

Katy bars and and other such cheap methods could work wonders, and could be just the deterrent needed to keep a burglar looking for a quick easy score at bay.

journal.drfaulken.com...

and
www.alaskamodularspace.com...

FWIW


*edited links


[edit on 19-2-2009 by sinesolis]



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 02:53 PM
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Originally posted by mdiinican
Nothing I care about. Anyone with half a brain can break into my crappy house in 30 seconds with no tools, without bothering with the door. In fact, for the first couple of weeks I was here, I didn't have a key, so just broke into it whenever I wanted in. Sometimes, I practice picking my own lock. Regular lock picking does take longer than bump-keys though.



I would argue with this statement. A well used lock is actually often more difficult to bump because the pins have a lot of space. If we're talking about simple locks then raking can open them within 30 seconds, at most. I have a yale lock on my bedside table that i can rake open in less than 10 seconds. It has 2 security pins in it and yet it's easy to rake open. A bump key would struggle to do it any faster.

This is the point. Bump keys are usually used on high security locks and even then they take time, effort, experience and a great deal of research and skill.

I beg everyone in this thread who is worried about bump keys to forget them. If you're simply worried about home security then you seriously don't have to worry about bump keys. A burglar would rather smash a window or kick in a door. Most of them are so stupid they don't even know about this stuff as they're the "smash and grab" type of criminal.

I would simply suggest that you make your house less attractive for burglary than your neighbor. The simple fact is that if a burglar can see you have slightly protected yourself then they won't bother with you. The same goes for pick pockets. If you tell all of your neighbors then that burglar will just ignore your neighborhood.

Seriously stop worrying people.



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 03:20 PM
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Originally posted by AceOfAces
They should never have exposed this!!!!

Think about how many criminals just found a new way into homes...They shouldn't have shown how to do it...It's ridiculous.

I will try on my door later to see what happens. I suggest anyone who doesn't feel safe to put a chain on the door.

And c'mon now..if your home, your going to hear someone "bumping" your lock.

I feel that this being exposed is going to create far more problems than solutions.


This info has been out there for quite a long time so I wouldn't worry too much. I saw a report on this YEARS ago.

Also, if someone wants to get into a house, a lock is not going to stop them in any case.

I own a construction company and on occassion, have been contracted to get into foreclosed homes that the banks did not have keys to and it's easy to get into a house in seconds without a key or lock bumping and before anyone asks, no I'm not going t explain how to do it.



posted on Feb, 19 2009 @ 03:46 PM
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Originally posted by jfj123
This info has been out there for quite a long time so I wouldn't worry too much. I saw a report on this YEARS ago.

Also, if someone wants to get into a house, a lock is not going to stop them in any case.

I own a construction company and on occasion, have been contracted to get into foreclosed homes that the banks did not have keys to and it's easy to get into a house in seconds without a key or lock bumping and before anyone asks, no I'm not going t explain how to do it.


You know what gets to me? When someone says they aren't going to explain it, it's because it is so very easy that most people don't realize how easy it is! The simple fact is that everything you don't want to explain is available on the internet. I myself am a specialist in computer security but this led on to physical security and i became addicted to picking locks and other security measures.

The simple fact is that everything you know, criminals know. What frustrates me is that consumers think this information shouldn't be released. The criminals already know this stuff. If we, the community that deals with this, expose the problems then we can only help the public and encourage the manufacturers to up their game.



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