Proof of Aliens & UFO'S!!!

Tell me where the trail starts. i'll go from there. there is too much information out there, for me to be looking for it without knowing what it is. The proverbial needle. Just a starting point. i'll find the rest.

As for going and discussing stuff with science types, i've tried it, didn't get any where. Apparently, i can understand physics better than a physics professor, but unless i have credentials, i won't get far. Kind of like your situation except you say you have the credentials but won't show them. i wasn't going to falsely say i had any, so i said i was an amateur physicist. i damn near got laughed out the forum.

Also, want to point out, 1500 years ago= 500 ad. That is not ancient. that is barely "old". Ancient is 12,000 years ago. Ancient is the Vedic literature which spoke of Vimana, flying craft. i'd say if they could really fly 12,000, then they were pretty advanced.

love and peace

hey mr jenka, ive got a few questions for you

1) what general field do you work in at lockheed martin?
2) im a sophmore in highschool right now and I have always wanted to be involved in companys like lockheed martin and boeing. I dont want to do it for all this alien and ufo stuff, I want to do it because of my passion for flight and the development of it. What do you suggest I major in while in college in order to obtain a job at one of these major corporations.
3) I have more questions about how to plan my life out, I think you could help me. Do you have an email address I can email you at. I dont want to discuss things on this thread, too messy.

Thanks!

reply to post by mrjenka


I found this today...it's the 15 of February 2009. Why have I not heard about this new technology yet?

Originally posted by branty
ok, on a serious note , TY IMPAIRED for a too have followed yhis thread for too long , hoping for something more to happen , it didnt, just a troll keeping his sunday nite interesting. But your link to the Tube was worth it, ive seen a lot of this before but not all, so IMPAIRED ty for saving what was getting to be alot about nothing.

You're very welcome, branty.

It is almost an honor to me on the side of truth. I am not saying that the OP is necessarily PURPOSELY posting disinfo - in-fact I think the contrary.

Some just don't know, or even just can accept the truth because it goes against belief systems that have been ingrained since birth. I mean this respectfully of course, and I don't mean to offend.

But what IF the truth were stranger than fiction? If what the op is saying is true, then that means that the Government(s) are indeed hiding something. Why? And since Lockheed-Martin (and perhaps others) HAVE this anti-gravity technology, why couldn't they admit it but NOT have it available to the public? Why the secrecy? If there is nothing to hide, there is nothing to hide.

If I may say, *I* at least think that the OP is working for a company that is a "pawn" to the governemt (or even works with them KNOWINGLY) to work on Anti-Gravity technology that was reverse engineered. I think the OP is telling all he knows, but the rabbit hole is deep.

And why compartmentalization? What would be so PROFOUND that even the people in intelligence couldn't even know the full truth? Why does it have to be scattered?

There is more than meets the eye, and we deserve to know. I demand to know.

Oh, hehe - I almost forgot.

Just like another poster said here (I'm sorry I don't remember your nick), if according to what the OP is saying is true, then the Government and Lockheed have supressed significant transportational technology from us - all while the worlds oil is being consumed to the point of extinction (100 years of oil left in the earth - look it up). Also while the enviornment and the so-called "greenhouse effect" is destroying our planet.

And maybe, my friend, that accounts for what are the small percentage of
ET crafts the OP confirmed. Perhaps they're trying to tell us something.

But I could be wrong, who knows....
Anyone with me on this??

But there IS something out there, there has been, and there always will be. More advanced, less advanced, and just as advanced as us (and in-between)

I would just like to say that I'm sure all those craft on the "Tether" incident video taken by NASA are just curious humans awed by a glow stick in space.

No not really.

Surely I agree some craft are man made, but man was not smart enough to develop that concept from its start. He was only smart enough to understand it.
Unfortunately the boys with big toys are most likely using those terrestrial craft for black op missions in space. With the negatively inclined military mindset, that wouldn't surprise me.

i think most people already know that 80% of ufo sightings are our craft and 10-15% are weather or atmospheric anomalies

but how does 5-10% of the unexplained sightings = Aliens ?

the title to your thread say's proof of Aliens

please explain yourself

I got bored and decided to copy and paste some comments by the OP that jumped out at me. Some are claims, some are just fun sound bites. Personally,after reading his posts, I don't believe him. I saw nothing to give him any credibility, so he's just another person making random claims on the internet to me. He didn't even make any interesting claims, just the same old recycled skeptic oriented crap. He's playing the opposite end of the spectrum than the typical "Nibiru shows up next month" or "An Angel told me aliens will land in Utah in 4 months" crap.




"I have been employed by Lockheed martin for the better part of 5+ years

many of the "Ufo's" that are reported, video-taped and seen are very much MAN MADE!

With in the next 3-4 quarters there will be "new" technology that will be made public

You guys are looking for UFO or proof of UFOS. THIS WILL NEVER HAPPEN, THERE WILL BE NO DISCLOSURE!!!!

So, instead of looking for proof of whatever you guys may think is out there YOU WONT FIND IT.....

Think about it guys... By you guys trying to find some type of proof out there bout ufos or aliens or advanced technology you will never find it.

If people are going to start attacking me which they usually do on this forum than I will cut off correspondence immediately and will not reply.

So, for everyone thinking out there that there will be some monumental release of information any time is a total joke....

Wow, you guys are really not getting this.
THERE IS NO PROOF.. What proof are you looking for?!?!
All I am saying to you is do your scientific and mathematical research.

why don;t you people go do your research

I never understood that statement "proof", "proof" is all around you... You just have to work on it and get it...

There is no disclosure to be made.. You guys really really make me laugh..

The Earth and human beings are a VERY VERY rare occurrence in the universe.

Therefore, in the grand scale of things you must understand that the earth and humans are like a 1.9 trillionc hance.. seriously, do you research guys.. please...

Hey.. thank you for your post. I am NOT saying that there is no proof. You guys may have misinterpreted what I was saying.

"fairy" dust(even if i had the right to tell you what it is, you wouldnt even understand what i am saying

you and i both know what happens when you assume....

Your also looking at cave paintings and texts from people who believed in trees, rivers, ants and anything else they may have though was a god.. If by some miracle we could bring a human from 1500 years ago and put him in a cave now and just observe him we could deem him "insane" and "unstable" so, by todays measures these people were below average on the intellectual scale, so how can we take that seriously.

I am not discrediting the cave painting or texts..

Who are "these" people?? and are you assuming?? or coming to me with straight hard facts?!

we wont talk to you on a conspiracy forum about what we know

I have a security clearance of S/TS/SCI(for lockheed) and others I do not wish to get into. I also hold S/SCI/COMINT/TK with different caveats such as: WNINTEL,NOFORN & CRYPTO with the military and again I don't want to get into which branch or whatever.

have you ever thought that this man made machine that can appear and disappear and that has the same characteristics of your "ufo" reports is really man made by a foreign power(korea, china, arab emirants) and is used to spy on very closely guarded national security secrets..

this is what I mean.. THINK guys!!! "

Originally posted by mystiq
To me this is one of those disinfo type threads, and the truth is that not only is disclosure truly coming, but our visitors will make sure of that soon enough themselves. This prison planet will end soon, and yes I know that Lougheed is one of the cabal players.

Let me get this right, mystiq; you treat "Commander Ly-On" as the "real deal", but this guy is a "dis-info" agent? Each has produced the same level of "proof" thus far: zero.

I appreciate that you'd love for the benevolent aliens to partake in a full disclosure, but the truth may well be that Lockheed Et Al may be behind the strange goings on in the sky. Until we get proof either way, I would put my money on a Lockheed insider posting here, rather than a benevolent alien residing in South America.

Not that our Military Industrial Complex"deep throat" seems likely to come up with any ID. Which, I must say does tend to undermine his argument.

Come on Mr Deep Throat - scan your ID; obliterate your photo and any identifiable markings, and post it!

omg people what is wrong with you
i thought the motto of this website was deny ignorance, when infact all you people have been doing is instigating it.

say this guys is bs and he has completely made this whole thing up , is it so wrong to look at one of the worlds biggest conspiracies from a different angle, hell there are no answers for this phenomenon right now so maybe by accident this guy has given us the clues that we needed,

but what if he is telling the truth and this is all he can really tell us
he has told us what to do why dont we actually do it instead of sit at our pc's and assume that he is lieing.
what if he really does fear for his future, family and livelyhood is him giving the information that he can so wrong, if he is telling the truth then he has done the best he possibly can yet you people still ask for more

i am very dissapointed as i thought those of you on ats were more open minded than this.

reply to post by Damezthe2nd


You should see the blind deference they show towards the alien posters!

I am, however amazed at the minimal standard of English used by Mr Jenga. I would have thought that they'd have quite high employment standards.

That's possibly a good place to start for my questioning of Mr Jenga:

1. Please describe (in as much detail as possible) the entrance criteria/assessment/induction for Lockheed.
2. Where is the assessment and induction done, and
3. How did you come to be employed by Lockheed?

Thanks!

Hi, inquisitive persons.

See my new edit in message posted on 09/2/15 @ 21:11

And see what we have to deal with:

Twenty-Five Rules of Disinformation.

Note: The first rule and last five (or six, depending on situation) rules are generally not directly within the ability of the traditional disinfo artist to apply. These rules are generally used more directly by those at the leadership, key players, or planning level of the criminal conspiracy or conspiracy to cover up.

1. Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil. Regardless of what you know, don't discuss it -- especially if you are a public figure, news anchor, etc. If it's not reported, it didn't happen, and you never have to deal with the issues.

2. Become incredulous and indignant. Avoid discussing key issues and instead focus on side issues which can be used show the topic as being critical of some otherwise sacrosanct group or theme. This is also known as the "How dare you!" gambit.

3. Create rumor mongers. Avoid discussing issues by describing all charges, regardless of venue or evidence, as mere rumors and wild accusations. Other derogatory terms mutually exclusive of truth may work as well. This method works especially well with a silent press, because the only way the public can learn of the facts are through such "arguable rumors". If you can associate the material with the Internet, use this fact to certify it a "wild rumor" which can have no basis in fact.

4. Use a straw man. Find or create a seeming element of your opponent's argument which you can easily knock down to make yourself look good and the opponent to look bad. Either make up an issue you may safely imply exists based on your interpretation of the opponent/opponent arguments/situation, or select the weakest aspect of the weakest charges. Amplify their significance and destroy them in a way which appears to debunk all the charges, real and fabricated alike, while actually avoiding discussion of the real issues.

5. Sidetrack opponents with name calling and ridicule. This is also known as the primary attack the messenger ploy, though other methods qualify as variants of that approach. Associate opponents with unpopular titles such as "kooks", "right-wing", "liberal", "left-wing", "terrorists", "conspiracy buffs", "radicals", "militia", "racists", "religious fanatics", "sexual deviates", and so forth. This makes others shrink from support out of fear of gaining the same label, and you avoid dealing with issues.

6. Hit and Run. In any public forum, make a brief attack of your opponent or the opponent position and then scamper off before an answer can be fielded, or simply ignore any answer. This works extremely well in Internet and letters-to-the-editor environments where a steady stream of new identities can be called upon without having to explain criticism reasoning -- simply make an accusation or other attack, never discussing issues, and never answering any subsequent response, for that would dignify the opponent's viewpoint.

7. Question motives. Twist or amplify any fact which could so taken to imply that the opponent operates out of a hidden personal agenda or other bias. This avoids discussing issues and forces the accuser on the defensive.

8. Invoke authority. Claim for yourself or associate yourself with authority and present your argument with enough "jargon" and "minutiae" to illustrate you are "one who knows", and simply say it isn't so without discussing issues or demonstrating concretely why or citing sources.

9. Play Dumb. No matter what evidence or logical argument is offered, avoid discussing issues with denial they have any credibility, make any sense, provide any proof, contain or make a point, have logic, or support a conclusion. Mix well for maximum effect.

. . .next message. . .

10. Associate opponent charges with old news. A derivative of the straw man usually, in any large-scale matter of high visibility, someone will make charges early on which can be or were already easily dealt with. Where it can be foreseen, have your own side raise a straw man issue and have it dealt with early on as part of the initial contingency plans. Subsequent charges, regardless of validity or new ground uncovered, can usually them be associated with the original charge and dismissed as simply being a rehash without need to address current issues -- so much the better where the opponent is or was involved with the original source.

11. Establish and rely upon fall-back positions. Using a minor matter or element of the facts, take the "high road" and "confess" with candor that some innocent mistake, in hindsight, was made -- but that opponents have seized on the opportunity to blow it all out of proportion and imply greater criminalities which, "just isn't so." Others can reinforce this on your behalf, later. Done properly, this can garner sympathy and respect for "coming clean" and "owning up" to your mistakes without addressing more serious issues.

12. Enigmas have no solution. Drawing upon the overall umbrella of events surrounding the crime and the multitude of players and events, paint the entire affair as too complex to solve. This causes those otherwise following the matter to begin to loose interest more quickly without having to address the actual issues.

13. Alice in Wonderland Logic. Avoid discussion of the issues by reasoning backwards with an apparent deductive logic in a way that forbears any actual material fact.

14. Demand complete solutions. Avoid the issues by requiring opponents to solve the crime at hand completely, a ploy which works best for items qualifying for rule 10.

15. Fit the facts to alternate conclusions. This requires creative thinking unless the crime was planned with contingency conclusions in place.

16. Vanishing evidence and witnesses. If it does not exist, it is not fact, and you won't have to address the issue.

17. Change the subject. Usually in connection with one of the other ploys listed here, find a way to side-track the discussion with abrasive or controversial comments in hopes of turning attention to a new, more manageable topic. This works especially well with companions who can "argue" with you over the new topic and polarize the discussion arena in order to avoid discussing more key issues.

18. Emotionalize, Antagonize, and Goad Opponents. If you can't do anything else, chide and taunt your opponents and draw them into emotional responses which will tend to make them look foolish and overly motivated, and generally render their material somewhat less coherent. Not only will you avoid discussing the issues in the first instance, but even if their emotional response addresses the issue, you can further avoid the issues by then focusing on how "sensitive they are to criticism".

19. Ignore proof presented, demand impossible proofs. This is perhaps a variant of the "play dumb" rule. Regardless of what material may be presented by an opponent in public forums, claim the material irrelevant and demand proof that is impossible for the opponent to come by (it may exist, but not be at his disposal, or it may be something which is known to be safely destroyed or withheld, such as a murder weapon). In order to completely avoid discussing issues may require you to categorically deny and be critical of media or books as valid sources, deny that witnesses are acceptable, or even deny that statements made by government or other authorities have any meaning or relevance.

. . .next message. . .

20. False evidence. Whenever possible, introduce new facts or clues designed and manufactured to conflict with opponent presentations as useful tools to neutralize sensitive issues or impede resolution. This works best when the crime was designed with contingencies for the purpose, and the facts cannot be easily separated from the fabrications.

21. Call a Grand Jury, Special Prosecutor, or other empowered investigative body. Subvert the (process) to your benefit and effectively neutralize all sensitive issues without open discussion. Once convened, the evidence and testimony are required to be secret when properly handled. For instance, if you own the prosecuting attorney, it can insure a Grand Jury hears no useful evidence and that the evidence is sealed an unavailable to subsequent investigators. Once a favorable verdict (usually, this technique is applied to find the guilty innocent, but it can also be used to obtain charges when seeking to frame a victim) is achieved, the matter can be considered officially closed.

22. Manufacture a new truth. Create your own expert(s), group(s), author(s), leader(s) or influence existing ones willing to forge new ground via scientific, investigative, or social research or testimony which concludes favorably. In this way, if you must actually address issues, you can do so authoritatively.

23. Create bigger distractions. If the above does not seem to be working to distract from sensitive issues, or to prevent unwanted media coverage of unstoppable events such as trials, create bigger news stories (or treat them as such) to distract the multitudes.

24. Silence critics. If the above methods do not prevail, consider removing opponents from circulation by some definitive solution so that the need to address issues is removed entirely. This can be by their death, arrest and detention, blackmail or destruction of their character by release of blackmail information, or merely by proper intimidation with blackmail or other threats.

25. Vanish. If you are a key holder of secrets or otherwise overly illuminated and you think the heat is getting too hot, to avoid the issues, vacate the kitchen.

==================
Now, THAT's a method ! ! B-)

Blue skies.

reply to post by MR1159


I know of people in even higher places than this guy that have worse english skills.


All I have to say is that the title of this thread is wholly and completely misleading.... This upsets the entire flow of the thread because it attracts UFO Alien Believers....then throws something right in their face which is against their belief.

Doing this puts many readers on the negative which is the basis for all the flame talk going on here.

OP - next time use a relavant subject title, then you should get replies of better substance and quality.

Originally posted by C-JEAN
Hi, inquisitive persons.

See my new edit in message posted on 09/2/15 @ 21:11

And see what we have to deal with:

Twenty-Five Rules of Disinformation.

And how is it, that you are so wise in the ways of disinformation?

Did you creates these "rules"? If not, from whence did they come?

Your tone seems quite "professorial".

reply to post by Nick_X


I agree about the title Nick_X. A fair call, and perhaps the poster now regrets it.

Now, what's the deal with your freakin' avatar??? Man, it's doing my head in; it's turning, not it's not...wait!...yes it's moving...no it's not...

your just a number cruncher, why would you or anybody that works with you upstairs in the 'office pygmy' section know anything. Im thinking your pulling our leg, even if you do work where you say the most youd know Top Secret is how much debt each company is in.

Please change your title, you've cheated me already with it .

reply to post by mrjenka


You said this:

"Wow, you guys are really not getting this.

THERE IS NO PROOF.."

A few posts later, you then say this:

"I am NOT saying that there is no proof. You guys may have misinterpreted what I was saying. "

*Have you stopped to consider the chance that YOU may be misinterpreting what YOU are saying?

Just sayin' ;0)

I believe many are man-made, and some from alien technology. I do give humans credit for coming up with technology. But some are not.

I could be wrong, but so could you

I don't think you have answered the question of historical sightings sufficiently. There are many anomilies throughout history that are depicted throughout asia, the americas, Australia and Europe etc and they are not simple minded peoples descriptions as you say. People are not as backward as you think 1500 years ago our brain capacity was the same, we just didnt have technolgy.

There is also the images captured in out of space, provided they arent hoaxes or photo anomolies, your theory would imply that we have managed to get craft in out of space already?

see mikesinghs threads...

www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I've never really dig anything Lockheed Martin does in the aerospace industry or any other relater company for that matter. Their as full of crap as anyone would believe when it comes to technology. Their the unbrella for NASAs pride and joy. Most of the projects that I have seen however in the past are a complete joke and waste of money. Stupid testing garbage that has been a veil of deception for so called advanced technologies. They sure hurry something along the back alley when they come across something relevant to antigravity. I'm surprised none of these companies have stepped up the par in advancements to benefit society. Almost all of it is military junk. The stuff never gets used unless a war is created. It's more of show and tell. Nothing more. Take a look at all these bogus commercial planes. Nothing has changed in years and nothing will change because of military spending. The striffe that comes from the military to take on bigger budgets just sets the pace until the next war strikes. Then there's the scary big black stimulus package that gets put to the side for the pass along side of NASA of course with the Vatican's praise. It's all blindfold and gag tactics to raise stakes for the upcoming year profiteers. An absolute recession proof industry that doesn't even exist. Who cares if they've been sniffing around the solar systems picking up the pieces. Good for them. It just goes to show how courageous they are to step into enemy territory. They may have survived this time around with their alliances but the power of the almighty will be upheld in due time once again. That will only leave us on cue to take over these facilities after the fallout. No one is safe here with these fools meddling within the power of the lord.