Someone Please Explain To Me - The Theory that Jupiter Ignited - while behind the Sun right now

reply to post by questioningall


There's no theory that Jupiter ignited. Theory requires science. It's just a SWAG that it ignited.

Originally posted by ngchunter

Originally posted by questioningall
it seems there IS SOMETHING GOING ON........

If there IS something going on then we will all get to see it tomorrow morning. Why so defensive if this is what you believe? Why am I not allowed to question if these theories match observations in any way? Jupiter is way too small to become a star; if it were going to it would have done so a long time ago. Any astronomer will tell you the same. I'm trying to be fair here by actually doing the footwork and going out to see if Jupiter has changed in nature since the last time I observed it.

Nobody is talking about a "star" - plus I am not defensive.......... but I will stick up for myself, when ridiculed........

Originally posted by SpacePunk
reply to post by questioningall

 

There's no theory that Jupiter ignited. Theory requires science. It's just a SWAG that it ignited.

From what I can gather from posts here, and other things I have now read... there is some science base to the fact that Jupiter "could" ignite.

The gases and explaination by a scientist that I read, said yes.... the possiblity IS THERE...

honestly, i would Love to look up and see a second sun

if only for the fact that everyone seems to think they "know" so much

yea we have a lot of knowledge but i think people need to be put back in their place by nature

we always think we know so much and know everything and know exactly whats possible and what isnt possible

we still cant really explain how we have life on this planet

yet we have people here acting egotistical saying what they know

i would really love to come back on this thread after seeing a second sun, just to see those peoples reaction

im not saying it is possible, but just saying sometimes, things happen we cant explain, or never could have expected

Originally posted by questioningall
Nobody is talking about a "star"

Actually that does seem to be what you're talking about. But even if you think it was some other kind of ignition, wouldn't that be immediately obvious in a telescope?

Originally posted by ngchunter

Originally posted by questioningall
it seems there IS SOMETHING GOING ON........

If there IS something going on then we will all get to see it tomorrow morning. Why so defensive if this is what you believe? Why am I not allowed to question if these theories match observations in any way? Jupiter is way too small to become a star; if it were going to it would have done so a long time ago. Any astronomer will tell you the same. I'm trying to be fair here by actually doing the footwork and going out to see if Jupiter has changed in nature since the last time I observed it.

again.. you're missing the "72 lbs of plutonium" on cassini .. component of all this.. yes cassini is far far away at Saturn.. but the idea is that once that is plunged into the core.. there could be a nuclear chain reaciton.. and who's to say there isnt a covert probe akin to cassini at jupiter... etc..

-it's the plutonium aspect of this that you're missing.

we're noot saying that jupiter just "decides" to blow up on it's own.

we're putting SOME actual ... phenomenon into this.



also.. i love how all humans know 100% of all probability and understanding of everything in the universe.

it's awesome.. i love how we all die of cancer and starve in africa.. and we know everything at the same time.. it's awesome.



-

Originally posted by InfaRedMan
reply to post by ngchunter

 

Post those pictures and the 'Ignited Jupiter' theory is a dead horse. Let's see who wishes to flog it after that!

IRM

funny thing how this sort of thing works....

if this is just a bunch of dis-info hype... to hype up the idea.. so that if it completely falls thought as just a bunch of hot air.. pun intended...once it's brought up again.. is instantly scoffed at by everybody.. even people interested...


then when it happens.. its like.. o yeah i was fooled into thinking that was impossible and i made fun of people and inflated my ego while doing so and i thou*FRY!!*

//insert baking/gasping/melting sounds here//

-

Originally posted by prevenge
again.. you're missing the "72 lbs of plutonium" on cassini .. component of all this.. yes cassini is far far away at Saturn.. but the idea is that once that is plunged into the core.. there could be a nuclear chain reaciton.. and who's to say there isnt a covert probe akin to cassini at jupiter... etc..

LOL!!! Hilarious. Covert probe? There was NOTHING covert about the Galileo probe, and guess what? It carried the exact same kind of plutonium RTGs and plunged into Jupiter years ago. Know what happened? Absolutely nothing, just like everyone has tried to tell you.

-it's the plutonium aspect of this that you're missing.

Actually, Galileo is a perfect example of why cassini is harmless. Furthermore, why would plutonium be expected to start fusion? Do you understand that the reason fusion starts from a plutonium 239 trigger in a hydrogen bomb is because the initial fission very forcefully compresses and heats every atom of hydrogen in the center of the bomb to the point that it fuses? The equivalent for jupiter would be like covering the entire planet in two halves of a giant plutonium shell and slamming them together with more force than you can imagine. You could dump as much plutonium 239 into jupiter as you want, that's not how you force a fusion reaction to occur - it'll just sheer apart and not even cause a small fission reaction. By the way, Galileo and Cassini both contained the wrong kind of plutonium for a fission trigger - 238 instead of 239.

we're putting SOME actual ... phenomenon into this.

Yet you were unaware of Galileo?

also.. i love how all humans know 100% of all probability and understanding of everything in the universe.

It doesn't take much understanding of astronomy or nuclear physics to see why dumping plutonium 238 into Jupiter's atmosphere is incapable of starting a fusion reaction.

It's interesting that those who believe in this conspiracy theory are completely unwilling to hold themselves accountable to actual observations, yet hold their opponents accountable to observations that have yet to occur and will only occur if the conspiracy is right.

[edit on 16-2-2009 by ngchunter]

reply to post by questioningall


No one is ridiculing you questioningall! But we are challenging the statement, whoever made it in whatever forum that Jupiter ignited. I think you are being overly defensive. No ones blaming you, or connecting you to the conspiracy. We understand that you are the messenger and you need to understand that we know this.

Accepted science says that Jupiter simply does not have enough mass to become a star. Some scientists probably do disagree but my bet is that they aren't esteemed scientists.

However I get the impression that you reject this because you keep saying that something is going on, even sighting the brightness of the moon as some possible link. I take your word for it that you have read many things in the last 24 hours since you first learned of gas giants in our solar system... that's great but I hope your reading from good sources and not just rogue elements.

You have to place more weight in the known science combined with probability - and both suggest that Jupiter will still be the Jupiter we know and love for a long time to come.

I hope I've clarified my position.

IRM

I am not rejecting anything.... I am learning about things right now.

I was not aware of anything to due with our planets... I have been one to accept our planets "are there", but have never fully investigated what they consisted of. Now I am learning about that.

The only reason, I feel there is "something" happening - though I am NOT SAY Jupiter "Ignited" - is from watching the slideshows I have watched.

I find something "did happen" on a slide show, that seemed to do with Jupiter.

Now some here have said, it was "just a reflection" of the Sun.... but that does not seem to be 'absolute" to me, due to the sun being on one side and Jupiter passing in front of the camera and then explosions happening, right as it was getting to the edge of the camera and out of screen.

I saw - what I saw - so people just saying it was a "sun thing" does not compute in my mind, due to it coming from Jupiter.

So, that is something, people are just trying to dismiss here - in what occured. Then there is another sequence from in front of the sun, where an explosion is seen - which could have come from behind it.... so there is a basis of trying to put two and two together and coming up with four.

Though what that "four" is, I don't know..... but no one can say "nothing at all happened" - because the sequence does show "something happened".

That has been my points.

When I see Jupiter in the sky - when it gets from behind the sun and it is "normal" - I will still wonder now,..... what happened and why we saw explosions.

Originally posted by questioningall
When I see Jupiter in the sky - when it gets from behind the sun and it is "normal" - I will still wonder now,..... what happened and why we saw explosions.

Or you could just accept the logical conclusion that what you saw was a CME from the sun and had nothing to do with Jupiter exploding. Honestly, if jupiter blasted part itself away into space, how could that NOT completely disrupt its system of counter-moving cloud belts or at least their appearance?

Jupiter is visible just before dawn. Very low on the horizon. I saw it rise this morning and everything is hunky dory.

reply to post by questioningall

Jupiter is a Gas Giant, isnt it? I suppose its possible, but if it had happen then I would think that we wouldve seen some results affecting our atmosphere and such by now.

reply to post by questioningall


Hello Questioningall...I had just heard about this today myself, and was glad someone started a thread...that is until peopl starting saying how dumb it was. how about just a logical explanation, of why YOU think its not possible, instead of all the dushbaggery. so thank s QA for the thread and hopefully we wont all die soon from the sudden additional massive gravity pull from jupiter.
Love and Light, Ronco

reply to post by altered_states


How do they know that? They don't have any clue. Mars was way off from what they said it would be as far as atmosphere and pressure. They are scientific guesses. Nothing more. If Jupiter ignited, we will know in a couple weeks.

These so called scientists don't know enough about anything. They haven't even completly mapped a third of our own ocean floor or the living species there(on our own planet).

I take these stories with a grain of salt, just like the theories of these so called scientists.

Originally posted by theresult
reply to post by altered_states

 

what he said...

and if it did happen trust me YOU WOULD KNOW ABOUT IT..

Let alone the BLAST WAVE that would toast planet earth.. some people think Oh look now its a sun.. yea it is and NOW YOUR TOAST

Not going to happen and if it has YOUR DEAD ALREADY

woops forgot to add something

Earth could fit in jupiters red spot "many times"...

thats how BIG it is.. so trust me if that thing turned into a star we are up a creek without a paddel...

TOAST

[edit on 15-2-2009 by theresult]

Not necessarily. As a result of the Sun having 10 times the diameter and slightly more density than Jupiter The Sun has a mass, and therefore the fusion products of H2, He2, CH4 and NH3, that is about 1000 times that of Jupiter. The absolute minimum mass needed for a fusion reaction is about .8 that of the Sun or 93 times the mass of Jupiter.

And the Sun hasn't toasted us yet.Since the critical mass needed to set off the nuclear reaction that powers stars is 0.06 times that of the sun, Jupiter would have to be 60 times bigger to become a star. Now we can all get back to Star Trek or BSG or AI or whatever.
For some trivia, as I tell my Physics students, even though the Sun is made of gases, it has a density 50% higher than water.

i'm tired of these lame threads. remember Oct 14th 2008, the nuke for New York in February, and no Jupiter ignited. I never believe any of these high prophecies.

I'm not saying this has happened or not and it appears from a previous poster that it has not but here is my own theory for what could possibly happen to make it appear that Jupiter may have ignited.

What if an asteroid of say 20km in diameter were to hit Jupiter while it was on the other side of sun, and we were not able to witness this impact? Would it not be possible for the atmosphere to ignite for a brief period of time say for a few months or so increasing the luminosity of our Moon and neighboring planets for a short period of time? This could help explain the increased brightness of Venus and our own Moon in recent months. But then I haven't really been following any of this that much and so have no evidence or facts pertaining to this possibility. This is nothing more than a thought to be chewed upon.

And one other thing, if Jupiter did light up for this short period of time there would've been no increase in gravitational pull from the planet due to the fact that there would be no real significant change in the mass of Jupiter. And due to the current distance that Jupiter is from us anything occurring on the surface of Jupiter would have minimal if no impact to us here on Earth. The only thing we would notice in my opinion would be an increase in brightness of the planet itself and of our neighboring planets and maybe an increase in aurora borealis activity at the poles.

Just something else to think about.

Originally posted by Lonewolf032
Would it not be possible for the atmosphere to ignite for a brief period of time say for a few months or so increasing the luminosity of our Moon and neighboring planets for a short period of time? This could help explain the increased brightness of Venus and our own Moon in recent months.

Shoemaker-levy 9 was about a 2km wide comet that impacted jupiter in 94.

As you can see, the explosion's plume quickly died down. Afterwards, it left temporary dark marks on jupiter's clouds, but jupiter's brightness did not significantly change. Venus is getting brighter because it's getting closer to earth in its orbit right now. Think about this, if Venus was getting brighter due to additional light from jupiter, we'd be getting a lot brighter due to light from jupiter as well. Jupiter would have to be shining so brightly in the daytime that its position near the sun would be immediately obvious to everyone.