Someone Please Explain To Me - The Theory that Jupiter Ignited - while behind the Sun right now

I like this thread, not for it's Scientific content, but for once again showing me that some of us have very short memories, and just how full of themselves some members are, ego boosting self confidence is never in short supply, to be honest I expect some very short notice vacations going to happen if it goes on much more, (several will understand that)

Anyhow back on topic, S&F for the OP, for bringing some long lost and missing discussion back to our forum, and a huge thumbs up to those who did not allow the degradation of this cool thread from becoming too severe.

There are so many things we do not understand about even our small tiny part of Space, even the Worlds best struggle most of the time, yet we obviously are looking in the wrong place, seems we have the Worlds best right here, or so they like to make us believe.

I agree with those who say that Sir Arthur C Clarke was a great man with a vision so rarely seen, after all we do owe the fact of the Geostationary Satellite to the man, among so many others, his stories are to be enjoyed as well as looked at in AWE, if you cant recognise the greatness of this man, then really you have no right making a comment, because obviously a simple and small amount of research into his achievements speaks for itself.

Show me one single person who can justly and Honestly say he wasn't a Genius, and I will show you a liar of the highest calibre.

As for Jupiter having ignited, all I can say is I bloody hope not, the end of March is when all my plans for a fantastic year begin, Holidays, Camping, and Adventure, I cant go camping with constant daylight, it just wouldn't be the same.

Sir Arthur C Clarkes shortest story was 10 words long, Written for Wired Magazine, this is the story ... ("God said, 'Cancel Program GENESIS.' The universe ceased to exist.")

Here is a link to the WIKI page about his third Space Odyssey instalment, 2061 2061 Odessey Three

I would much rather read Sci Fi, but I was hoping to see this made for the big screen, seems a shame to do two, and leave out the third, maybe one day.

Wiki link to everything about Sir Authur C Clarke

Is there another way to get eyes on Jupiter? from a different Satellite? but I don't think it has changed any, simply because illumination of other solar objects would have severely changed, especially the Asteroid belt, however saying that, I do think something is up in the heavens (pardon the pun) I see Venus every night so bright, I have never in 42 years seen that, if it is Venus that is, also wouldn't we see a similar effect to what we see in Nebula? different coloured gases and the like? they wouldn't be obscured by the Sun, and would be expanding.

You get a lot for 2 cents these days


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[edit on Mon Feb 16 2009 by Jbird]

reply to post by PH43DRUS


Now that is INTERESTING - the dates....

Okay, so when I kept reading this "igniting" stuff on other sites, there was no conversation about it.... it was "stated" it happened...

So in saying that - I want to THANK everyone who has now being having a good discussion about it, as the others who attacked - have not been attacking any more.

I have been learning a lot from the posts!! SO THANKS AGAIN EVERYONE!!!

I as I stated, thought that Jupiter was a "mass" of dirt (per se) - did not know that it was even capable of having "gases" to be able to ignite.

So, I will be going back to the link, I provided earlier, to look for that "escaping" thing a magiy LOL.

This is very interesting to me, and I am really glad we can go back and forth. I don't mind dissenting voices - when I don't know something... but to get down to name calling and put downs, over trying to learn.... should not happen. None of us, know EVERYTHING.... and the fact I didn't "know" about Jupiter.... does not make me "stupid", it just shows I am not informed on that subject.

Question: is there anyway to see Jupiter right now, off a govt. site, or do we just have to wait until it comes back around?

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[edit on Mon Feb 16 2009 by Jbird]

You know what???
from this site: stereo-ssc.nascom.nasa.gov...
(instructions are on previous page, to see, sequence)

I watched the sequence again, wow, Jupiter "really" did have some "major" explosions!

I watched how the radiation field from it, just kept going and going.

Very interesting.....

Has this ever happened before with Jupiter (the explosions, like that)?

[edit on 15-2-2009 by questioningall]

Plans to ignite Saturn

Jupiter is too close, but Saturn is a safe distance. I came across the plans that they plan to ignite Saturn. So if Saturn can be ignited, in theory so can Jupiter. You will see that they plan to use nuclear generators.

reply to post by rachel07


right from that same link.....
The reality: Now that the Cassini mission has been extended by two years, we can expect this conspiracy theory to become more and more vocal in the coming months. But like the Galileo/Jupiter/second sun theory, this one is just as inaccurate, once again using bad science to scare people (much like Planet X then)…

Originally posted by questioningall
You know what???
from this site: stereo-ssc.nascom.nasa.gov...
(instructions are on previous page, to see, sequence)

I watched the sequence again, wow, Jupiter "really" did have some "major" explosions!

I watched how the radiation field from it, just kept going and going.

Very interesting.....

Has this ever happened before with Jupiter (the explosions, like that)?

[edit on 15-2-2009 by questioningall]

One more time. That’s not Jupiter.
This is the same video with the explanation.
Read what’s at the SOHO vid. Please.
sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov...

To see Jupiter--wait till Tuesday
www.earthsky.org...

Tuesday, February 17, 2009.

It'll be possible to spot all five visible planets tonight.

You'll need to look outside just after sunset to see Venus, by far the brightest of these five worlds. If you do look shortly after the sun goes down, Venus is easily seen in the west. An hour or two after sunset, Saturn will shine in the east. Saturn is no where near as bright as Venus, but it shines as brilliantly as a bright star, with a steadier light than the stars.

The other three planets - Mercury, Mars and Jupiter - won't climb into the sky until the wee hours before sunrise. You'll have to be up at or before dawn to catch these morning planets. Throughout February, these wandering worlds will move with repect to each other in the eastern predawn sky. Tomorrow, Jupiter and Mars will pair up. A week from now, Jupiter will be closer to Mercury. By the month's end, Mercury will pair up with Mars.

How soon you see this trio of planets before sunrise will depend on where you live worldwide. In the southern hemisphere, Mercury, Mars and Jupiter will climb above the horizon when it's still dark - before morning twilight starts to color the sky. In the northern hemisphere, this planetary threesome will be somewhat obscured in the glow of dawn.

More:
www.earthsky.org...

Jupiter will be the brightest of these three planets, and it will be the easiest of the three planets to pick out against the twilight background. After Jupiter, Mercury will be the second-easiest planet to spot. Will faint Mars be visible? It's possible, but you might need binoculars to spot it.

If it’s on fire, everybody will notice. Oh, and there’s no plans to “ignite” Saturn either.

Originally posted by questioningall
I watched the sequence again, wow, Jupiter "really" did have some "major" explosions!

That was the Sun, not Jupiter (assuming you're talking about these videos )

And I don't know if it's been said already, but Jupiter is not behind the Sun yet. If it had ignited (which it can't) we'd be seeing a second Sun next to our Sun right now.

Originally posted by rachel07
I came across the plans that they plan to ignite Saturn. So if Saturn can be ignited, in theory so can Jupiter. You will see that they plan to use nuclear generators.

There are no plans to ignite Saturn. It can't be ignited and RTG's aren't going to go off like a nuclear bomb.

From your link:

There's no chance Saturn could sustain nuclear fusion?

Sorry, no. Saturn is simply too small.

Implying that a nuclear (fission) bomb detonating inside Saturn could create the conditions for a nuclear fusion chain reaction (like the proton-proton chain) is, again, in the realms of science fiction. Even the larger gas giant Jupiter is far too puny to sustain fusion.

reply to post by jra


I am talking about the sequence I watched from the site I provided, with the instructions now where to go.

How can you tell me that is the sun?

The sun is on the left side, not the right.

The explosions came from the right side of the slides, from my understanding, that was Jupiter that was on the right side.

So, the explosions came from Jupiter...... please don't say they came from the sun, the sun is on the left...

So now my question was.... does Jupiter "normally" have explosions as I saw?

I know what I saw, and it WAS explosions from the right, on the left you can see the sun's radiations etc.

I am not saying I "believe" this theory at all.

But now I can understand why I have seen this comment elsewhere on the internet, from the sequences of what looks like big explosions

I was provided a link to information about Jupiter via u2u

www.nasa.gov...

So I am inserting it here.

Now, I have a hypotetical question......

Lets say......... what if - Jupiter ever "ignites" what would be the effect on the Earth from that?

Anybody - any ideas?

Ok let me say I don't think Jupiter "ignited" but I certainly can't prove it.

Lets just say it did.

What would that do? Would we even notice it, or would it heat us up beyond any normal standard, causing real estate in Northern Canada, and Siberia to dramatically rise, as people roasted to death in the tropics?

It is pretty darn small compared to the Sun, and a lot farther away.

I have another question, someone could hopefully answer....................


there have been all kinds of reports out of Kentucky, Texas, etc. about explosions in the sky and falling debris...............

It is being claimed the explosions and orange lights etc... are from the sats debris that collided. They are also causing these "sonic booms".... so is that possible, or IF there is any possiblity "something" did happen to Jupiter - could that cause what is being reported?

Thanks

reply to post by questioningall



We are all looking at the same thing.

Several instruments on STEREO (Behind) observed the progress of a good-sized coronal mass ejection (CME) as it blasted out from the sun and into space (Jan. 21-25, 2009).

The burst of particles was first spotted late on Jan. 21 by the COR2 coronagraph as a bulbous cloud with a bright core, which expanded to the right. With its broad field of view to the right of the sun the HI1 instrument picked up the cloud early on Jan. 22 and watched it expand even further over the next two days. (The very bright object to the right of the middle is Venus.) Lastly, the HI2 imager (see video) tracked the much fainter CME cloud as it crossed millions of miles of space and continued to expand further through Jan. 25. The CME did not appear to generate any effects here on Earth, but the CME was detected by the other STEREO spacecraft (Ahead) as it passed by.

The sun is the left side. CME's can go in any direction. This one went to the right.

Try this-sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov...
See the red ball? See the black disc in the middle of the red ball? The disc covers the sun so as to not blind the camera. See the puff come off? That’s the CME. Off the sun. Now look at one of the HI’s. Shows the same puff moving across space. From the sun.


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[edit on Mon Feb 16 2009 by Jbird]

If this has been said time and again, sorry. My A.D.D. won't let me read 4 pages of posts. Whether the ignition of Jupiter is possible or not, it makes me a little nervous when "experts" tell me something CAN'T happen. It's impossible. Then they throw in a little scorn and possibly even a hidden sneer. So let me write this down: No black hole from the Swiss collider, no Planet X, and now no Jupiter ignition. Thanks, I'm going to sleep good tonight. Cheers.

Originally posted by YouAreDreaming

Originally posted by InfaRedMan
It hasn't happened. It's complete bunk and nothing more! Jupiter does not have enough mass to ignite and become a second sun. Nor would we be able to ignite it with our current technology. If for arguments sake we could ignite Jupiter, it wouldn't burn for very long as it simply doesn't have the fuel. It's more likely we'd destroy the planet and in doing so, destroy ourselves.

Anyone who suggests otherwise is either a fantasy prone personality with both feet firmly out of reality, gullible - or off their medication.

IRM

Theoretically, Jupiter is the garbage collector of our solar system, and does aquire mass over time from consuming comets and asteroids.

The question then arises, what if it consumes enough matter, or the right kind of matter to trigger it's ignition?

Could it hit a critical mass, not saying it would happen for billions of years, but with the consumption of space matter, it has to be growing over time and potentially getting hotter at its core.

what if the ignition of jupiter was to attract planet x and consume it before it causes damage to us... and creates an even brighter sun.. thus making a binary star system?

seeing as Sol.. our sun is a RARE anomaly for the type of sun it is..
it's type of sun is almost ALWAYS a type that's in a binary (2 star) system...
UFO lore says the "first" zeta encounter from a gray was with betty and barney hill and they said that they came from "zeta reticuli ) which is a binary star system..

what if all intelligent civilizations that transcend into the galactic community all are in binary systems..

BECAUSE they've "achieved it" . or "earned it"...

meaning.. that the one "test " of an intelligent species.. is to defeat a foreign object that would otherwise cause a complete calamity.. destruction.. and the only way to defeat that "dark star" .. is to ignite a gas giant.. and consume the coming planet.. to end up in a binary star system.. thus .. "growing up" and being a binary system like all the other out there?

maybe this "godhood" doesn't really mean something as proposterous as what christians think it heretically sounds like... what if this "godhood" is just doing the seemingly impossible.. and solving the decisive "problem" or adversary that separates the capable from the incapable..

if our esoteric societies havent' used all religious symbology.. all ancient inscriptions.. all wisdom.. and deciphered it to it's true meaning.. harnessed science in order to accomplish what's predicted to occur.. then we're not worthy to ascend to the stars and be among the "gods" .. or "creators" .. or "galactic citizens"....

just a thought.



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reply to post by Now_Then


Ya' know, I should have listened. It is incredibly boring!


Sorry about off topic post.

Originally posted by azzllin
I like this thread, not for it's Scientific content, but for once again showing me that some of us have very short memories, and just how full of themselves some members are, ego boosting self confidence is never in short supply, to be honest I expect some very short notice vacations going to happen if it goes on much more, (several will understand that)

.

By 'several' I assume you mean anyone on this thread who does not support the fallacy that Jupiter has ignited or will ignite into a second sun? Each individual that does not confer with this belief is exactly that - an individual. No one is teaming up against those that 'believe' or entertain the idea. No one is in cahoots! Therefore, do not paint us with the same brush.

It appears some members get a bitter taste in their mouths if someone tries to inject some rationality into the thread. Personally, I have not attacked anyone in this thread but I have let my thoughts be known on the highly questionable data, and data sources.

It's also amusing to note that some members will immediately accuse those of contrary opinion that they are part of some cover-up. The very thought is as ridiculous to me as the possibility of Jupiter igniting. Surely I am allowed an opinion (as you are) - and that is mine.

However, you do not see me calling for the heads of those with differing opinions. That's simply bad sportsmanship. Nor have I called for the heads of those who have thrown innuendo directly in my direction such as "full of myself". I tend to simply ignore the cheap shots and see them for what they are... Frustration at a lack of supporting data to back their claims and nothing more. Hey what's new!

I have not, nor will ever claim that I am a scientist, or that I know it all. The people who have suggested as much are taking their defensiveness to the extreme and trying to put words in peoples mouths that were never spoken.

There are so many things we do not understand about even our small tiny part of Space, even the Worlds best struggle most of the time, yet we obviously are looking in the wrong place, seems we have the Worlds best right here, or so they like to make us believe.

I agree that there are many things we do not know, but there are also many things we do, however there was no need for another cheap shot. No matter how many times you try to put words in peoples mouths, it does not change what is said. I'm not trying to make people believe anything, nor have I insinuated that I am one of the "Worlds Best", but I am allowed an opinion in this thread and I have given my opinion on the data. It's complete bunk!

Look, I'll happily come back into this thread if Jupiter has ignited into a sun once it's visible from Earth again and eat humble pie. I will gladly say, I was completely wrong, the science of how stars are created and what fuels they burn are completely wrong! However, I doubt I would see such an honest and genuine offer from many here who support the theory of an ignited Jupiter. Prove me wrong!

As history has shown on this board, people tend to simply move onto the next conspiracy forgetting everything they have previously stated or fought tooth and nail for.

I'm a person of my word! I will show great integrity if I'm wrong. I will not make up a single excuse in my defense! Will the rest of you?

IRM

i mean it's spoken of in all the archetypical myths of the past and present..

david killed the "giant" goliath . he refused to use armor or sword.. and instead used his sling.. and 5 stones.. (5 chances?).. he hit the giant in the head.. and the giant fell. then with the giants OWN sword.. he beheaded him.. and the giants body was fed to the animals and plants and people of david's land.

could the sling be representative of 5 methods or attempts at sending a "sling" . .a probe.. into the "giant" jovian jupiter?
could the sword used to decapitate him.. be representative of the giant's own mass.. that collapses upon himself?.. could the body fed to david's land.. be the body of jupiter. .used in ignition.. being the body turned into light.. and fed to nourish the planet earth as a beneficial means?



we have Achilles who is defeated by Paris, where he finds the one soft spot the one weak point. and defeats him through that one specific target point.. and hits Achilles in that soft spot .. his heel.. with an arrow.. guided by none other than "Apollo"...

we have luke skywalker firing his torpedos directly into the one weak spot in the "death star"...
lukes previous novel name was luke "starkiller"... written by george "Lucas" .. as in "luci" .. as in "light" .. or instead of luci-fer" "ferry " being carrier.. luc-as" being light caster.. as in caster of light or knowledge or wisdom..
thus destroying the planet size object preventing it from destroying their planet.

we have tolkein's "the hobbit" where "bard the guardsman" shoots his "black arrow" into the one open space in the belly of the giant dragon Smaug's armor.. thus bringing down the beast.. instead of allowing the beast to burn his land with fire..


whether you find ancient mythology paralleling mankind's possible "Greatest" challenge" .. or that these popular myths to be paralleled by complete coincidence.. doesn't really matter here..

my point is .. that it COULD be that jupiter's GIANT RED SPOT could be a "soft spot" that is already so full of kinetic energy.. that a nuclear chain reaction might have a better chance of growing to a critical point if ignited with 72 lbs of plutonium in that specific "soft spot"..


in order to grow a star..


or we're just testing it.. and if planet x is the amount of mass needed to combine with jupiter to form the new lucifer sun.. a method is needed to combine the two.. to cause one to bring the oother nearer to the one.. and then ignite.. merging the two.. and saving us .. before planet x brings a "firey death" to us on earth...

justlike in all these myths.. smaug.. death star... the giant goliath.. and the seemingly invulnerable achilles.. except his "soft spot...



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Good thread! Many interesting viewpoints.

The mythology and ancient lore of Jupiter is really fascinating. I would not be surprised at all if Jupiter started to grow brighter and brighter in the night sky as 2012 approaches.

Source: en.wikipedia.org...
The planet Jupiter has been known since ancient times. It is visible to the naked eye in the night sky and can occasionally be seen in the daytime when the sun is low.[98] To the Babylonians, this object represented their god Marduk. They used the roughly 12-year orbit of this planet along the ecliptic to define the constellations of their zodiac.[19][99]

The Chinese, Korean, Japanese, and Vietnamese referred to the planet as the wood star, 木星,[102] based on the Chinese Five Elements. The Greeks called it Φαέθων, Phaethon, "blazing". In Vedic Astrology, Hindu astrologers named the planet after Brihaspati, the religious teacher of the gods, and often called it "Guru," which literally means the "Heavy One".[103] In the English language Thursday is rendered as Thor's day, with Thor being associated with the planet Jupiter in Germanic mythology.[104]

Source: en.wikipedia.org...
Marduk (Sumerian spelling in Akkadian: AMAR.UTU 𒀫𒌓 "solar calf"; perhaps from MERI.DUG; Biblical Hebrew מְרֹדַךְ Merodach; Greek Μαρδοχαῖος[1], Mardochaios) was the Babylonian name of a late-generation god from ancient Mesopotamia and patron deity of the city of Babylon, who, when Babylon permanently became the political center of the Euphrates valley in the time of Hammurabi (18th century BC), started to slowly rise to the position of the head of the Babylonian pantheon, a position he fully acquired by the second half of the second millennium BC.

Nibiru, to the Babylonians, was the celestial body or region sometimes associated with the god Marduk.

Marduk was depicted as a human, often with his symbol the snake-dragon which he had taken over from the god Tishpak. Another symbol that stood for Marduk was the spade.

To the Babylonians, Nibiru was the celestial body or region sometimes associated with the god Marduk. The word is Akkadian and the meaning is uncertain. Because of this, the hypothetical planet Nibiru is sometimes also referred to as Marduk.

It's also said that the "Star of Bethlehem" that heralded the birth of Christ was the "regal" star. Today it's known as Jupiter. Read more about it here.

I've been looking into this more, and it seems that this story started with Richard C. Hoagland. Here's a link to it: Did NASA Accidentally Nuke Jupiter?

[edit on 16-2-2009 by Aleilius]

The model of how a sun forms is only a "THEORY", there is hardly any hard evidence to say that our sun is a large nuclear, it's not we can study the atoms at core, therefore it is still theory. With that we can also say "Gravity" is still just a theory just like many other things, we just don't know for sure. How do we know for sure that Jupiter might not be a second sun, do we know what is at the core of it? There are many possibilities, we just have such little understanding that we should presume anything when it comes to something like this. Although this may seem unlikely, there is a chance, nothing is proven, we don't even know for sure how and when the human race started, but people on this forum have become such things that aren't nearly as important such as this topic.

May I make a small point.

We don't know everything. We don't even know 1% of everything.

We think it cannot possibly ignite.

That thought is based on what we know.

What about the other 99%+ that we don't know?

Isn't it fun on ATS to speculate, sometimes to speculate the impossible?

Heck, isn't that why some are here?

ATS opens the sinuses of the brain.......yea!