SURPRISE! Dems Break Promise: Stimulus Bill to Floor Friday

reply to post by redhatty




None of that is even relevant to my statement. I am well aware of who's controlled the House and Senate for the past 20 years, without looking it up.

I guess I might ask you, what is your point in relevance to our discussion?

reply to post by Irish M1ck


That was actually a good post IM... You have to admit it..

And it exemplifies exactly what I have been talking about..

The true power is in the House and Senate and while being "One Man" makes it easy to blame President Bush, the facts are BOTH parties have had ample time and opportunity to "Fix" this and have done nothing..

Partisan politics is the real problem

Sorry did you not say

Originally posted by Irish M1ck
Well that's not really fair. The democrats did not have control the past two years. If anything, Congress was about 50/50 and republicans had executive control also.

I simply posted the facts. We all make mistakes, and you, like me, are quick to point out factual errors in posts.

Just posted the facts, what you do with them is your business

reply to post by semperfortis


Sorry, I replied to the wrong person. Didn't mean to click your name. No, I agree with you about that. I think republicans did have a chance to get stuff done from '00-'06, but the crisis wasn't really upon us.

Many were warning but no one was paying attention, and no one did anything. It just burns me that Obama inherited this, and now he'll spend all of his energy trying to fix it (and probably to no avail), and it will be his downfall.


[edit on 2/15/2009 by Irish M1ck]

reply to post by redhatty


Again, I've clearly showed that it wasn't an error. The democrats didn't not have a majority that allowed them to really get anything done if the republicans could all agree to block it (and they always do).

That's all I was saying, hence why I said it was "almost 50/50".

(It was 51/49 and 54/46).

If you'd read the post for what it says, instead of trying to dissect it and find fault, you'd have realized that already.

[edit on 2/15/2009 by Irish M1ck]

reply to post by Irish M1ck


Regardless.. My point still stands and is still substantiated..

You can spend all the time you want making excuses, it will not change the facts..

"They" could have done something, and chose instead to do nothing..

The Mortgage loan debacle that can be traced back to Clinton, that the Republicans did little to nothing about.

President Obama just carrying on with more of the usual and recreating the Clinton Administration..

We can play this blame game all day, stick to our individual ideologies and never accomplish anything, or we can admit they are all corrupt and only out for themselves and "WE" have to make the difference..

It really is our choice

Semper

reply to post by Irish M1ck


This is easily enough solved..

Show us where the Democrats initiated any actions to "Solve" anything that the Republicans blocked between 06 and 08..

Semper

reply to post by semperfortis


Yeah, that post wasn't meant for you. I clicked the wrong name. I edited it and responded to yours.

reply to post by Irish M1ck


You do realize that only Constitutional Amendments, Budget and Reconciliation legislation requires a super-majority in either house, right?

Having the majority is usually enough. The last filibuster occurred in 7/2007, and surprisingly, it was a Democrat led filibuster - when they had the majority.

So 51 is still the majority, and should not have created problems for the passing of much legislation at all.

As to your quote: "Bush continuously said there was no economic crisis, that the economy was fine"

Bush tried to get reforms on Fannie and Freddie 34 times since 2001. SEVENTEEN TIMES in 2008 ALONE

Here's a listing

Even after the accounting scandals of 2003, the Legislative branch of our government REFUSED to reform Frannie and Freddie (and GSE's in general).

Bush at least TRIED, even though he failed.

And yes, the meltdown really began with Frannie and Freddie, from the sub-prime mortgages and the Congressional pressure to issue them, then the quotas (targets) Congress called for. In 1996, HUD directed the GSE that at least 42% of the mortgages they purchased should have been issued to borrowers whose household income was below the median in their area. This target was increased to 50% in 2000 and 52% in 2005.

And Frannie and Freddie bought the majority of them. Fannie and Freddie became the largest buyers of what are known as subprime and alt-A mortgages (the mortgages at the root of this mess) between 2004 and 2007. In 2003, subprime mortgages made up less than eight per cent of all mortgages. By 2006, that had risen to more than 20 per cent. In the third quarter of 2007, subprime ARMs making up only 6.8% of USA mortgages outstanding also accounted for 43% of the foreclosures which began during that quarter.

This "crisis" has been building for OVER 30 YEARS, since the Carter Administration and the Community Reinvestment Act.

And the really wonderful thing... The "stimulus" does nothing to tackle the CAUSE of the Problem.

In fact, the talking heads in Washington are trying to find a way to RE-INFLATE the Housing Market!!!

If I decide to posts Facts in my thread (I am the OP), deal with it. If my facts are incorrect, feel free to correct me, and I will return the favor.

reply to post by semperfortis


Nothing as far as the economy goes. Nobody did anything until it was late. Bush did use EVERY ONE of his vetoes between 2006-2008 though.

(Which also is in response to redhatty's comment about how having 51% is enough).

reply to post by Irish M1ck


Could you show where President Bush vetoed ANY legislation that could have helped the economy?

I can't seem to find any

reply to post by Irish M1ck


Nothing???

According to the National Bureau of Economic Research, the economy suffered from a recession that lasted from March 2001 to November 2001. During the Bush Administration, Real GDP has grown at an average annual rate of 2.5%.

Inflation under Bush has remained near historic lows at about 2-3% per year. The recession and a drop in some prices led to concern about deflation from mid-2001 to late-2003.

Tax cuts: the Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001, the Job Creation and Worker Assistance Act of 2002 and the Jobs and Growth Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2003. These acts decreased all tax rates, reduced the capital gains tax, increased the child tax credit and eliminated the so-called "marriage penalty", and are set to expire in 2011. These taxes are credit for ending the dot come bubble recession but also turned the budget surplus into a budget deficit.

The US had nearly six years of uninterrupted growth and the strongest economy of any developed country during the Bush Administration.

Vetos??? Bush was the first president in 176 years to continue an entire term without vetoing any legislation.

Economic regulation expanded rapidly during the Bush administration. President Bush is quoted as the biggest regulator since President Nixon. Bush administration increased the number of new pages in the Federal Registry, a proxy for economic regulation, from 64,438 new pages in 2001 to 78,090 in new pages in 2007, a record amount of regulation.

Our current economic crisis only came to light in the last two quarters between October 2007 and March 2008.

In 2003, the Bush Administration attempted to create an agency to oversee Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. The bill never made progress in Congress, facing sharp opposition by Democrats. Maybe if it had passed we wouldn't be here now.

Get your facts straight M1ck, you can do better than this

reply to post by semperfortis


No like I said, nothing as far as the economy goes. And I have no idea what redhatty is talking about.

I don't know of any action taken to help the economy besides the stimulus packages.

reply to post by Irish M1ck


The thing is that neither party did anything. Some will blame the Bush administration, others will blame Clinton. Still others can trace this all the way back to Carter.

Does the blame game really matter now? Will blaming anyone fix this now?

We are in a helluva mess, and both parties got us here.

reply to post by Irish M1ck


Exactly!!!

So you agree that nothing was done by the Democratically controlled House and Senate, while they had power.. The veto issue is moot if nothing was presented to be vetoed..

And I have no idea what redhatty is talking about.

It is clear to me..

But again it is partisan and that is not helping..

The simple fact is the Stimulus is nothing but special interest pork and will not help the economy in anyway

Just more of the same from Washington, just with Obama's name on it being the only difference.

Semper

reply to post by semperfortis


No intent to be partisan. I do consider myself a Constitutionalist though.

Just presenting the facts.

I dislike Republicans and Democrats equally

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
reply to post by redhatty

 

Pelosi and Reid are TRUE CRIMINALS who should be tried for TREASON. They have broken the trust of the American people, and they spit on the constitution with every act that they commit.
I think it's time to RECALL these criminals!

Absolutely. These NEOCONS are poison; their allegiance is NOT to the American people but to foreign lobbies, e.g., AIPAC.

I called both Alabama Senators and both said that the real bill is over 1.2 trillion and its being sold to the public as the 790 billion bailout. The girl that answers the phone even said she would help protest if we came to D.C.

It is of no surprise to me. Of course nobody saw it...... if people see it, they won't vote for it.

QUESTION .. if this was so dang hot and just HAD to be signed on Friday by the guys on the hill ... before they got to read it ... before we all got to read it for FIVE DAYS LIKE OBAMA PROMISED .... if it was sooooooo important and it was so vital to get it pushed through like that ..... then WHY did Obama fly his family out to Chicago on Air Force One (at a cost of $68,000) for a three day weekend vacation this weekend and why is he waiting until today (Tuesday) to sign it?



WAKE THE HELL UP AMERICA

[edit on 2/17/2009 by FlyersFan]