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F-22 Design Shows More Than Expected

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posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 05:30 PM
In addition to the lower RCS as discussed in a previous thread here on ATS, Lockheed has let go a few other details about the new F-22.... 9no doubt some fo this has to do with lobbying the Congress for more airframes. Also the issue of overseas sales may be reconsidered.

1) The F-22 will be going to the Paris airshow despite the usual Issue of France trying to steal secrets etc. (Lets have another Tu-144 episode eh?

2) Supercruise tops out at mach 1.78 not at 1.5 as previously predicted (As noted in the disclosure, altitude was not given)

3) The AESA radar system has a 5% greater range than previously mentioned

4) Lockheed is projecting a 146 million flyaway cost which would if released for export make it quite compedative against the Typhoon

Lockheed Martin also makes an economic argument for continuing Raptor production. The F-22 unit cost in a USAF multiyear purchase is $142.6 million (average unit flyaway cost). Initial unit cost of the F-35 will be around $200 million and then start dropping as production continues. In Japan, the decision to indigenously build small numbers of F-15Js and F-2s (a larger F-16 design) drove their cost to roughly $100 million each. The Eurofighter Typhoon would likely cost even more in a small production run.

posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 07:19 PM
Very good!! I cant wait to hear how it performs.

posted on Feb, 14 2009 @ 02:59 AM
All good stuff Fred, and very interesting too. Except for one remark which looks a bit odd;

The Eurofighter Typhoon would likely cost even more in a small production run.

While that may b e true, what is the point of it? The fact is the Typhoon is not in a small production run, over 600 aircraft are due to be built just to the initial partners before any exports are factored in. The Saudi price is hard to gauge due to the nature of the deal but the Austrian aircraft have been quoted at 61 million each, half the cost mentioned for the F-22.

IF they were built in similar numbers the prices would be more closely matched, but the fact is they aren't so that seem a disingenuous thing to say.

posted on Feb, 14 2009 @ 04:19 AM
it is not surprised to me, it was reported 1.81 somewhere before L.M. claimed 1.78 here.

posted on Feb, 14 2009 @ 04:27 AM
You guys ever hear the engineering phrase "conservative on paper"?

Those numbers are most likely still below that plane's absolutes. And LM and the DOD are not going to just give out those absolutes becasue they want to make some overseas sales or appease the ohh ahh starving public.

Think about it for a second or two. Even the SR-71 still has a few tricks up its pitot that no one knows about.


posted on Feb, 14 2009 @ 07:14 AM

Originally posted by RFBurns
Think about it for a second or two. Even the SR-71 still has a few tricks up its pitot that no one knows about.

If no-one knows that the SR-71 has a few more "tricks", then you cannot state that it has because "no one knows".

I am sure all aircraft have capabilities that are not in the public domain but as an aircraft ages it's capabilities become more widely known.


posted on Feb, 14 2009 @ 02:27 PM
reply to post by waynos

I think that the Obama administration may be more inclined to export the F-22. Just a hunch and I have no concrete proof otherwise however. This may be the opening gambit in promoting export sales. Why? this may help offset defence cuts we all know are comming. Sort of a bone to throw thier way to make up for lost domestic programs. There is no way that there would be any offsets for this airframe if sold overseas. It would be a take it or leave it kind of deal IMHO

The Typhoon is the closest airframe to the F-22. An export version with downgraded avionics may even be closer in terms of capability minus the stealth. But if Lockheed can put forth a unit cost that is even close, it would make for a tough deal to walk away from IMHO.

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