We're saved . . . we get money just like the banks do!!!

It is even worse than you imagine. This $400 credit is a reduction in the payment of your social security taxes. Originally, it was the be a rebate on the social security tax you pay(6.2%) on your first $8,100 in income, which worked out to $500. They've lowered the base now, probably to about $6,500. What that does is further UNDERFUND the social security system, so the result will be that social security will now go in the RED earlier than the original anticipated date of 2017. They know that, and this will now give them reason to either raise the social security age again, or lower the benefits for those that have not retired yet.
ALWAYS be wary, when the government claims that they are giving you ANYTHING with one hand. They are usually taking it away with the other hand.
BTW, only people with earned income are getting this money. Seniors or other retired people that are living on pensions, WHICH THEY ARE PAYING FEDERAL INCOME TAX ON, DO NOT GET ONE CENT IN REBATES.
Thus, you have the situation where approximately 40 million seniors that pay federal income tax will get nothing if they are not working, but working people who pay NO federal income tax, after exemptions, deductions and earned income credits, will still get $400 per person. In effect, this entire giveaway is being funded by the people who can afford it least, the senior citizens of the US.

$13 a week, oh wow, I can now sign up for netflix, or bigfish, or realarcade, or hmmm what else can one really do with only $13 a week? Let's see 13*4=52. Hmmm, maybe I'll be able to pay a small bill.

If he really wanted to create a long term stimulus package that would actually help the American people, I rather see him ditch all stimulus packages to the big banks and those who are failing because they dug themselves too deep in debt, and dragged us along with their schemes to get us deeply into debt whether we were actually aware of it or not.

1) Kill social security and welfare including food stamps. Get rid of them. Keep medicade and medicare - which do need reformed. Don't scream yet....

2) Everyone who is retired automatically gets $2,000 a month. I'm pretty sure that is way more than what most get now on social security.

3) Everyone who is working, volunteering part time, or a stay home parent gets $1000 a month. With incomes up to $25,000 for an individual, or $50,000 for a family. For those who recently lost their jobs, they can volunteer anywhere that needs volunteers, or even by helping their neighbors with written proof.

If a family makes $25,000 a year, the extra $1000 a month for each working family member could easily bring their income up to $50,000 a year or near if only two are working, or one working, and the other staying home to raise the kids.

These should help people be able to make ends meet without having to get deeper in debt by paying a bill with a credit card. Hopefully, it should also pump some spending money and possible investment money into the economy after people are able to pay their bills.

It won't help as much for those who made a lot more. It is better than $600 a year, and may help some keep out of poverty.

If you really want to, you could keep the food stamps. An extra $12,000 a year (if the person still has their low paying job) would more than likely put them over the income threshold to be able to get them. $1000 a month would be more than what the family gets in food stamps anyhow.

4) Create incentives and agencies that will help average people make it easy to be able to open and start their own businesses. Make it easy for the average person to find out about and take advantage of them also.

5) Create policies that will bring factories back to the US through tariffs or what have you. Make it more economically viable for them to be over here. That will help bring factory jobs back here.

6) Make bills that would make it a criminal offense for credit card companies to offer credit with little credit, and most of the credit used in various fees. My husband fell for one. $300 limit with a $275 bill that were all in fees. I'm sure we have late fees now along with over the limit, and the monthly fees. That should be illegal, period.

7) Put caps on credit cards as to how much they can charge in fees, especially over the limit fees. Once a card reaches the max allowed, they will no longer be allowed to add any fees, or charge the monthly amount to the card.

8) Either get rid of adjustable rate loans, or put caps on them. Put caps on how much a loan can balloon out of control if the person can't pay on it.

Some of the major problems will be with the IMF and the interest we owe them whether it is illegal or not. It would be best to get rid of them. Also, all the debt we owe foreign countries in the form of treasury bills and such.

There is much more that would need to be done.

Edited to add: It would basically be an overhaul of the economic system and how making money is seen. It puts a core value and monetary value on human life. The government already makes money out of nothing. If they can make money out of nothing, I'm sure if the system gets way too much money in it, that they can make it disappear just as easily to keep everything in control.

Really what is worth more, gold or human labor? What should be worth more? Isn't a mom staying at home caring for her kids have as much worth or more than someone at McDonald's taking your order?

[edit on 12-2-2009 by Mystery_Lady]

you could buy several gallons of TIKI torch fuel for $13, or maybe a pitchfork.

Woah! Woah! This may actually work out in my favor!

I can buy 2 cases of ramen noodles a week now, where previously I couldn't afford it. Now my family will be surely be grateful while crunching those noodles dry because we can't afford our water bill as it is!

reply to post by Jacob08

Originally posted by Jacob08They should just take as little as possible from anyone who is producing wealth.

I like that idea, but also strongly believe that everyone needs to pay their own way.

It's a complicated issue, and I'm not sure what to think about it yet, but it got my mind thinking. That's a star for you, just for that one comment.

Does anyone know where to find the population of the United States that has to pay taxes?

I guess they did not see how bad many Americans are at managing money?

All this will do is buy an extra Star bucks each week.

The point that just about every poster has made is that this "Stimulus" Bill is NOT a stimulus at all. $13 a week for 31 weeks this year, and then $8 per week for 52 weeks next year won't do SQUAT to STIMULATE the economy. However, this bill WILL cost each taxpayer $7,000 out of their pockets.
They give SOME taxpayers $400 a year for 2 years, but they are going to get $7,000 from you and your children for this bill.
That's the math. Very simple:
$820,000,000,000 divided by 115,000,000 taxpayers = $7,130 per taxpayer!

If I asked you if you would give me $7,130, and I will give you $800, who in their right mind would do it? Yet, THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE ALL DOING, without your approval of course.

No point whining, people.

Everybody print money like govts and banks do.

Collapse the money system.

Activate The Venus Project.

Every single one of these Fing Scum Bags Need to eat a single .45 round.... They must really think we are not capable of spilling blood. They are going to pay for this TREASON with their lives.....

Let the Tea Party Commence.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by RFBurns
Obama needs to either put himself in the shoes of the common folk, or resign.

The Republicans are the ones who insisted on so much of the bill going for tax cuts. So, we can thank the forced bipartisanship for this $13 a week. I would have rather seen the $282 Billion (a whopping 35% of the bill!) go to infrastructure and jobs (yes, spending!) than these measly tax cuts. It's a total waste of 1/3 of the bill.

And we'll all have plenty of time to decide how to spend it (hmmm... jets or diamonds?) because we won't see it until June.

I'm not a Republican per se (I'm a Ron Paul guy), but what you said is a bit daft. If the Republicans are the ones who pushed for such measures, then how come no Republicans voted for it in the House at all (at least the first draft)? And from the first post, the amount of the tax cut was "cut from Obama's original proposal of $1,000." So Obama wanted MORE of the "measly tax cuts", which either way don't amount to a hill of beans. But I find it rather insulting that you're playing the blame game without rational thought. I think both parties are pretty horrible, but for a party that typically eschews partisanship (or so they claim), Democrats are still as quick or quicker to blame, even though they are the party in power. But go ahead if you feel the need...it can't make the situation much worse.

/\/\

reply to post by aleon1018


I just had to comment about the 'earned income tax credit', I prepared taxes and supported tax software for years, I really hated that the bulk of refunds every year, the ones that get several thousand dollars 'back' every year, are people who don't work. Yep. Illegal aliens who have had children in the US can file and get themselves several thousand a year, even if they didn't pay any taxes. People come in in droves that have only worked a month or two of the year, and lived in public housing eating off food stamps, and get thousands. But you let a person who has worked and made between 12 to 25 thousand dollars and has no children, they don't get anything back they pay in, at the most a few hundred dollars. It is so backwards. I don't think people should get money from the government every year just because they have kids, it should be because of their work effort and taxes paid. The system is messed up. Too many of these deadbeats came back year after year, same story, new kids, and walk away with wonderful checks to go blow, while I would see the same hard working seniors and singles every year come in to find out how much they would have to pay this time. Sad.

And to show just how important this 'bailout' or 'revitalization' or 'shut the hell up' piece of legislation really is . . .

HURRY, FELLAS, LET'S VOTE, I AM OFF TO ROME

Rep. John Culberson, TX claims the "stimulus" bill must be urgently voted on today -- because Speaker Nancy Pelosi is leaving at 6:00 PM for an 8 day trip to Europe!

Pelosi schmelosi

The Australian Senate has just passed our second financial bailout. Everyone who earns under 100k per year is getting paid a lump sum, most around $900 with $1000 more for each child
In our first bailout everyone on pensions or welfare got a similar amount of money... and then gambling revenues in pubs and clubs (mainly pokies) were substantially higher than normal for the month of January!
I Wonder where this next round of cash is going to end up....

This is like them saying "Ok.. pay me 1000 dollars please." And after you hand them a stack of 20s equaling 1000 bucks, they hand back 100 of it and say "Ok.. see! This stimulus package is working great!"

This makes no sense. The money continues to be poured into businesses that do not deserve it, and then are doing nothing to help bail out America out of the mess they were a major part of creating.

You see, people don't see the whole picture. It is actually more money that we will be paying. They are going to take away, completely, the Bush tax cuts. So once they do that and then pay $600.00 they will be saving money. Plus, keep in mind a lot of the money, "return of income" will be going to people that don't pay any taxes at all. Why don't they take that money, that those people don't deserve because they don't pay taxes, and give it to the people that do. Then we will be getting much more!

And I didn't even get kissed...

Wow blaming Republicans on Democratic legislature than virtually no Republicans voted for. Seriously it's no wonder we are in the mess we're in when people like that are out in the world.

Why in God's sake would the Dems "cave" to any Republican demands on the bill when they knew full when Republicans wouldn't vote for it and have said so publicly! Dems to Repubs: Don't bother reading the bill you won't vote for it anyhow.

The Dems screwed America royal but unfortunately the majority of us deserve it for voting based on the media reporting and some campaign promise rhetoric.

98% of us are honest hard working Americans...it's the other 2% that make us look bad....then again, we did elect them!