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Lets Talk About The Market

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posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 05:28 PM
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Originally posted by cpdaman
2. the fed's could always step in and buy futures, especially along support levels (08 lows) ... ( I tulip thinks they will, and says japan already has) i don't have a strong belief either way.

[edit on 12-2-2009 by cpdaman]


ok my belief is strengthening that they do........

I know they float rumors to clobber the shorts (short squeeze) near support levels MID afternoon....but i think they are doing some buying because the OBAMA mortgage news didn't sound that impressive or large in scope....unless some INvestment firms like GS ....JP..etc, *just got the details on the real bank plan to come* it's almost a toss up IMO

[edit on 12-2-2009 by cpdaman]




posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 06:42 PM
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Originally posted by cpdaman

Originally posted by cpdaman
2. the fed's could always step in and buy futures, especially along support levels (08 lows) ... ( I tulip thinks they will, and says japan already has) i don't have a strong belief either way.

[edit on 12-2-2009 by cpdaman]


ok my belief is strengthening that they do........

I know they float rumors to clobber the shorts (short squeeze) near support levels MID afternoon....but i think they are doing some buying because the OBAMA mortgage news didn't sound that impressive or large in scope....unless some INvestment firms like GS ....JP..etc, *just got the details on the real bank plan to come* it's almost a toss up IMO

[edit on 12-2-2009 by cpdaman]


The next few days will be telling but look at this daily




We tried braking below that lower pennant line and we could not do it. If we closed lower than there I would be 100% positive we were gonna do some tanking. Now that it didnt Im near sure we will be a rising.....



posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 06:51 PM
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over at tickerforum.org a poster pointed out how there appeared to be about $501 MILLION bought into the SPY. Even posted some of the screen caps





posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 07:13 PM
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reply to post by tjeffersonsghost
 


I've seen that triangle posted pretty prominently in lots of TA oriented discussions, a break to the downside of it has a target so low, I'm scared to speak it even on ATS.

Though I'm not actively trading, I've been looking at today's action since I've got home. That's a massive move in the last 30 minutes, haven't seen too much like that in a while now but it was happening all the time in late '07 and early '08. Looks like the pump is on at least short term.



posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 07:25 PM
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At the end of the day the problem as I see it is cash flow; too many borrowers can’t make their payments so they default. If the payment terms, not the principal amount, could be modified sufficiently to where payments become affordable, defaults should decline substantially. With troubled assets performing, although at lowered levels, the uncertainty will dissipate and price discovery will begin to emerge. At that point equity injections and backstop guarantees could provide the necessary capital for renewed
lending and the system will begin to heal.



posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 07:35 PM
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reply to post by Bejing
 


As I posted in this thread

Real economists and people within the Mortgage industry realize that Obama's plan will absolutely slaughter the banks and Security holders.

The AAA and super seniors would take a hit and be written down, rating action would likely take it down to A, in some instances to Equity/Non Rated.

50% of the AAA home-eq/Alt-A out there has the provision that a loan modification involving reduction in balance will be charged PRO-RATA, regardless of seniority, to the loan structures.

when there is a loss, the bonds will take a hit from equity up to subordinate then super seniors.

When there is a loss DUE to modification, the entire structure will take the fair share per balance remaining of the hit. Also think about how big the AAA right now considering much of the default has flown through the support over the years. This will also spill over into the ABS Card and autos.

When you jump the seniority in the capital structure, you put at risk the entire structure. People will no longer loan large sums of money at low interest rates, because they will be afraid of assuming the risk of the more subordinate levels of debt, while assuming the ROI on the more senior.

IOW, it is a lose-lose for the most prudent money in the capital structure.

What Obama is trying to do will cause a Glacial Freeze of the global money supply.



posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 07:36 PM
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The market today (Th, 12 Feb) "felt" like it was being bought in the 811 area scale down; ergo, not going to make it < 800 as it "should" have.
(I actually bought it in the 810 handle and take a little bit of heat before we had the "Fire in the hole!" rally...exiting a tad early at 833+). This tells me that the "market manipulators" were in there and that since they had their way with the market so easily that this market is "dry tender". Remember, the fundamentals are always worst at the bottom (not that this is "The Bottom"...just a tradeable one)! This market will go over 1000 before June SPs expire with a big impulse in March (as it was 6 yrs ago).
This will mostly be short covering but we should get some "good news" as we get over 950 into the 1000 area. Look to start shorting over 1000 into mid to late May (16-22~). Good luck and dont forget to "flip the card."



posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 07:38 PM
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Originally posted by redhatty
over at tickerforum.org a poster pointed out how there appeared to be about $501 MILLION bought into the SPY. Even posted some of the screen caps




wow that is powerful stuff. I would give my left nut to know who did that. That HAD to be the government.



posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 07:40 PM
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reply to post by tjeffersonsghost
 


Meh, who else but Ben would have that kind of capital just laying around???

Of course it was the .gov

Market Manipulation at it's ugliest



posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 10:48 PM
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Thought some of you might enjoy this World Market Index. Everything from major indices to commodities, currency pairs to the MSCI Emerging Markets Index....one stop. Just click on the item of interest to view current chart.

Hi TJG. Click the S&P. You'll see today's White Hammer...bullish reversal pattern, but with a low level of certainty. Could mark an interim bottom...but needs further confirmation tomorrow, e.g. - a long white body, prefferably on heavy volume.

Day traders are required to close their positions by EOD. This accounts for some of the increase in activity we generally see heading into the close. Bears got quite a surprise today.

GL



posted on Feb, 13 2009 @ 02:29 AM
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Originally posted by tjeffersonsghost

Originally posted by stevegmu
I mostly trade in commodities, but have been on stock buying spree of late. I bought a good number of GE shares last Friday at $11.11. Now, GE normally wouldn't interest me, however, after I heard J. Immelt was named to Obama's Economic Recovery Board. I imagine they will be benefitting greatly from the 'stimulus' bill.


Your a brave soul to be buying right now. Im personally shorting till the dow hits 6k and the S&P around 600. That just my personal opinion. You can always cost average down.


I am long on Ammo, Seeds, USP resublimated iodine, and snare wire.

LOL



posted on Feb, 13 2009 @ 10:00 AM
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Trading Day 2/13/09



Ok well to not to many peoples surprise we are up so far today. After that big turn around in the last hour of trading last night I dont know who would have the balls to sell into that but hey...Ive seen stranger. Not really much in the way of news just some consumer sentiment numbers. I guess I still remain a little optimistic after that turn around yesterday. Once again I dont see to many people selling into that. We'll see what happens....



posted on Feb, 13 2009 @ 01:27 PM
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GS has been the primary execution arm of the PPT since the days of Bob Rubin at Treasury (Clinton adm). The govt and FRB has long been overtly involved in the bond ("cpn passes") and FX mkts for some time...and after the Crash of 1987 the President's Working Cmte on Financial Markets (aka Plunge Protection Team that reported to A. Greenspan) was created to prevent another collapse. The fact that SP futures settled at cash and not requiring a physical delivery of a basket of stocks facilitated this. They could buy and buy and then let the contracts expire without having to sell them or roll them over as a spread. In reality it did prevent another crash but also created a bubble in equities to the upside (flip side of that coin).



posted on Feb, 13 2009 @ 04:13 PM
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reply to post by tjeffersonsghost
 


Very volatile session today .. huge swings, nothing compared to some of the swings of last November, but volatile none the less.

What are your thoughts on next week?



posted on Feb, 13 2009 @ 04:31 PM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 


After hours is dropping as well.

I would expect next week to be slow, possibly with modest gains on Tuesday. After that it's going to depend on the housing starts & industrial production reports on Wed. and the jobless data, CPI, and PPI reports later in the week. The initial unemployment claims are going to have to spike ridiculously here soon as we're starting to get into some of those huge layoffs the past couple of months becoming eligible for aid. As for the CPI & PPI, I honestly can't imagine those looking anything but bad.

Of course, it seems like logic has abandoned the market long ago so maybe the worse these figures look, the better the market will do.



posted on Feb, 13 2009 @ 05:26 PM
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Ok here we go and yes burd you are right the futures are tanking after hours....grrr why couldnt this happen this week...anyways here is the weekly SPX chart....




we are going to move big this coming up week. Its a 4 day week so keep this in mind. We are at the end of the pennant so whatever way we move up or down we are going to move hard. I tend to lead bearish because this is the week Obama signs the stimulus bill which will not be received well by the market. (Im sure the banking bailouts however will be received nice by the market *cough*) Today seemed volatile for sure for there is plenty of bearish sentiment but not to many people want to sell and get trapped like on Thursday. So my prediction is we test 7500 next week dow and 775 for the spx. If we break below get ready....



posted on Feb, 13 2009 @ 05:51 PM
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Ok short post late, and so busy.

Will add reasons on weekend.

S&P at 300 and DOW around 3-4K 6 weeks from now within a fortnight either way.

Have fun.

Look at commodities prices now, and production, and compare to 30's precedents, we are where we are now as the financial "Tulips" have bottomed, now ish maybe about 25% max left in them for some type of stability, that was a fake product though like the "tulip" depression, the trend now is to see how the old fashioned gears of the basis will take us.

The Gears that drive the whole car along, the basics, are NOW important, the fuel (liquidity) and fake brand/Me/I/Panosonic/Toys/Gadgets etc can be stripped from the car, the label, sound system, air con, the car will slow down and stop, but put more fuel in (bailouts Fiat Printing) and it will drive forward again. but , but when the Gears fail, or worse the tyres burst it Crashes proper.

Look at Copper (inflation taken in for real price now, and the inflation or deflation of these BASIC/tyres commodities etc), Iron, Food, Tin, Zinc Etc.
Compare with the 1930's 3yrs before.

Notice some very very scary trends and movements in these areas that make the 30's look like the dot com bubble.

Ignore MSM and most saying that 1930's this and that, they have been comparing until about 3-4 weeks ago with the wrong time, the "Financial/Housing/Brand/Gadget etc" drop collapse we have seen is better related to the Dutch Tulip depression in the 1800's, it is about 2 weeks before April end of financial year that the real figures, spending plans etc will be seen, and the only Now when the commodities are the real basis of the economies information can we start to compare it.

If you do as I have, and mention above it is worse than anything then.

Good Luck,

Kind Regards,

Elf



posted on Feb, 13 2009 @ 06:12 PM
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the real deal is to clean out bad assets on the banks books. they also have to stop "mark to market" if these two things are done, you pretty much avoid a meltdown. there is 12 trillion sitting on the sidelines making less then 1%, that money sooner or later will have to go to work, china is in full stimulus mode and that might be the best place to park some money for a few months of swing trading. GE dividend as of this morning paying out a little over 10% in dividends. why GE? big middle eastern money going into GE and it's products. however, i have bought about 5k in silver dimes and quarters, because if dollar hyperinflates, it will be the "street money". if you can afford it, physical gold will be good for larger purchases. and if it comes to that, you might want to pick up a S&W 40 cal. for those shopping excursions. the amount of thieves will also be hyperinflating.



posted on Feb, 13 2009 @ 11:22 PM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 
"I have noticed, when ever the markets get to close to the 7,600 or lower mark, something, someone saves it.."

I think it is the plunge protection team.

I think the government is artificially injecting money into the market
to keep it afloat.



posted on Feb, 16 2009 @ 08:06 PM
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Anyone watching the currencies charts???

WTH is happening in ASIA to cause this kind of action? Or anywhere else for that matter???

Futures are feeling it now too

Anyone know what's happening?

Here's a link to some charts


[edit on 2/16/09 by redhatty]



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