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NewsWeek: We Are All Socialists Now!

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posted on Feb, 22 2009 @ 03:13 PM
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Well for the time being on collectives, you would still have individual productivity issues, people taking advantage of the situation. A collective factory could not escape realities associated with higher skilled workers, price setting, market driven factors, time on the job and so on. Thus they would be a collection of little capitalist, worker capitalists.

Its still a business. You gona let somebody walk right off the street knowing nothing about the job or possessing no skill and make as much of the profit share as a journeyman thats been there for 20 years?

A collective really couldn't let the less skilled and unlearned in the trade, whatever it is, make any decisions about production or marketing or the company could be driven into the ground.

Basically this type of collective scenario is what so many small businesses are anyway. The new guy wold have to work there awhile until he could buy in and then get paid accordingly. If its a family owned collective the worker could probably never buy in. Are the workers going to tell a family owned collective what to do with their collective enterprise?

What if its a collection of guys that all tossed in an equal share of capital years ago and now the thing is off the ground and running. Are a collection of laborers going to hold them up and tell them what to do with whats theirs? If companies what to sell or give shares to the labor then thats there business. Make labor share holders yet not giving up controlling interest. Why should they? Why should anyone give up control of whats theirs for the sake of a collective higher calling? You want to make them do it?




posted on Feb, 24 2009 @ 02:40 AM
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Bottom line of the discussion is that more socialist economies like France are being the least hit by the financial crisis, while strongly liberalized economies like the USA are having the worst time. It's time now for all capitalists to aknowledge the victory of socialism over their hateful feudal system.



posted on Feb, 24 2009 @ 12:26 PM
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reply to post by Logarock
 


Hmmmm that is simply not true.

There are many many collectives operating right now very successfully.

Take this one for example...

www.geocities.com...

In business since 1972 with annual sales of $1 million.

Coops are no less, or more, successful than any other type of business. But regardless running a coop in a truly liberated society, not based on private wealth, will be a lot different than trying to run one under capitalism.

Everything you argue against socialism is actually caused by capitalism in reality.

There is a solution for everything...If only the power to act wasn't in the hands of the few fortunate enough to be wealthy and in power.



posted on Apr, 17 2009 @ 10:56 AM
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Here's a better spoof
We're all Conspiracy Theorists Now



posted on Apr, 17 2009 @ 02:48 PM
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I think people have the idealistic view of socialism. Socialism treats humans like machines that all desire the same thing. The fact is humans are more complex and if you try to force people to accept the same standards of living you get Cuba and people risking their lives to get to the Ubited States.

The best system is a small government that does oversight and Capitalism.

Capitalism is not perfect but at least it allows people to dream and go for it. I have been a Real Estate Investor and I have been in the music business for over 5 years. I couldn't do this in a socialist structure because I might offend the person that didn't make it in music or real estate.

There's things that I have tried and failed and I moved on.

The problem with Obama and the democrats is they want a nanny state where nobody has to hurt or fail. Sometimes failure brings the best ideas. There's nothing in the Constitution that says you have a right not to be offended or a right not to fail. You have a right to pursue happiness and some will succeed and some will fail.

A strong middle class is also the key.

The problem occurs when government gets to big. It's interest can then mix with the interest of Corporations and then you have Fascism. The American people are to blame because they let these crooked politicians control the candy store(our money) without supervision and everyone is waking up sick.

The politicians keep their seats in Washington based on how much money they raise and not the vote. So they do what the money wants them to do. They control trillions of dollars of wealth that hasn't even been created yet and this gives them power.

So, the best system is Capitalism with a touch of socialism. I think this is the way it has been for years.

We should have demanded things like term limits so politicians can't become institutions in Washington.

Public financing of campaigns so Mitch McConell or Diane Feinstein would get the same amount of money to run for office as John or Jane Doe and they would win based on the best ideas for the American people and not how much money they raise.

A limit on lobbying from Corporations and a sunshine policy where these things are closely monitered.

And a debt ceiling that can't be passed without 95% of the Senate and the House.

We are headed for a fascist/socialist state under Obama. Bush dug the hole and Obama will bury us.

We can't pay for all the spending that Obama is doing in a global economy with cheap labor. I don't think Obama's goal is to fix the economy. His goal is to use the crisis to put in place a socialist structure that he has always believed in.

I think these ideas also come from a lack of belief in God. The founders of this country got it right. What some people are looking for is a utopia on earth with humans who are not perfect. This is impossible unless there's a dictator or an oppressive form of government dictating how you should live.

If our rights come from our Creator then no man or government can take those God Given rights away. These people make it complicated because they want to control the souls of men. They want to tell you how to live because they have replaced God with government.

The smaller the government the more freedom and liberty their is for the individual.



posted on Apr, 17 2009 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by Dermo
Bout time too..

Politics is cyclical... we'll all be fascist is 50 years, communist in a hundred, democratic again in 150 and in the same boat as we are now in 200 years time.


About time?... Not really, we shouldn't be allowing a dictatorship to form and for the rights which we were given by the forefathers of this nation to be taken away by Socialists/Communists who have been working hard at changing this nation...



posted on Apr, 18 2009 @ 08:54 AM
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Newsflash: I am not a socialist.

Because I dont lie, steal, cheat or demand. I let live. I elet myself live.

Others who are socialist make it difficult to drive a car without paying my entire income to it, or talk on phones or live without stealing 2/3 of my income, then blaming me joe citizen for needing to survive the best he/she was shown how growing up, meaning that a generation of a class of people have been deceived. And the SOcialist ROGUES are using this as an opportunity to smear and diminish their middle class and upper class opposition to this new loser control freak society they want with there you know whats in there mouths.



posted on Apr, 18 2009 @ 01:39 PM
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Originally posted by mastermind77
Newsflash: I am not a socialist.

Because I dont lie, steal, cheat or demand. I let live. I elet myself live.


All things the vast majority of the worlds population associate with capitalism, not socialism. Would you mind to explain why it's normally the few capitalist who are immoral enough to step on whoever they have to 'to make it' that things capitalism works so very well?


Others who are socialist make it difficult to drive a car without paying my entire income to it,


How is GM run by socialist? Why would socialist want to charge you more than it cost to produce the car given how the aim is suddenly no longer to make as much profit as the market will allow?


or talk on phones or live without stealing 2/3 of my income,


How does exploitative telecom companies serve as proof that socialism is bad? Where in the world is basic taxes 66% of your monthly income?


then blaming me joe citizen for needing to survive the best he/she was shown how growing up, meaning that a generation of a class of people have been deceived.


Sure they have been decieved but not by socialist who control or operate part of US industry or the government. Why not rather blame the capitalist who are in fact in control of the US industry and state?


And the SOcialist ROGUES are using this as an opportunity to smear and diminish their middle class and upper class opposition to this new loser control freak society they want with there you know whats in there mouths.


Which socialist rogues are we talking about? The capitalist US governments that goes 'socialist' only when the capitalist system fails to hand over the wealth of the people to the capitalist owning class?

How is the socialism you describe anything but what the capitalist tells us socialism is?

Stellar



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