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I see lots of people bashing the bailout plan...

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posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 01:49 AM
reply to post by mr. wildflowers

Well, the solution is actually very simple. Abolish the Federal Reserve, and perform targeted assassinations on the Illuminati controllers running the show. JFK attempted the former, and Ben Fulford suggested the latter.

What you have to realise is that Obama has zero power to do anything. America is totally at the mercy of the international bank(st)ers. If Obama truly was the saviour figure that people want him to be, he would do what JFK tried to do and abolish the Federal Reserve. Of course, JFK got a bullet for that. Obama will NEVER be a JFK for that solitary reason.

The moment he said during his election campaign that he would attempt to cure America's debt problems by getting America into more debt, I knew right away that he was not the guy people are looking to him to be. He's one of 'them'. Pure and simple.

posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 12:35 PM
reduce the corporate tax rate

reduce the tax on capital gains

Allow the fictious VAUES OF DEBT , still on the books of the major financial corporations (that act like bailout $ black holes) to be written down to levels which makes debt more servicable for consumers .....and stop the CLASS warface ..i.e transfer of wealth that is going on

ex. financial institutions made tons of risky loans to each other and thought they were off loading risk......the value of the debts they issued were marked to a model that was mental masturbation levels....they do not want to write the value of this toxic debt would cause them more losses so they want the gov't to convince people that we need to "save the banks" and thus purchase there over-valued debt at high prices and thus backstop any loss at taxpayer expense ..which will be the difference (between the high value the gov't or any private money buys this for and there real current value) and the kick is that this is for the economy's greater good

NO it is for the greater good of the investment class and the lobbyists they pay and those that knew they could act carelessly and get golden parachutes (at worst) or bailed out

This is a transfer of liability of bad DEBT's from banks balance sheets to the gov'ts / Tax payers is a SCAM......and apparently it is not acceptable for the creditors /financial institutions to write down the value of the debt on there books (which is part of a "healthy cleansing" of the system) like when bear sterns debt was being bought for .22 on the dollar last fall.......and the INVESTMENT class who wraps there tentacles around washington are calling the shots and transfering wealth to themselves and risk to taxpayers for the reckless lending that took place by getting gov't to back stop losses on the bottom less pit of over valued debt still on there books

and OSHAMEA and his handlers will call any JUST CRITICISM of the scam "political posturing or bi-partisan politics" and try to confuse the issue or push the fear or urgent buttons by saying we are losing millions of jobs and this needs to be done-----*AMERIKA and the POWERZ run the show-------when the credit bubble of 20 years deflates who do you think the investor/ establishment class want to take the losses .......themselves (thru reduced asset values) or the sheeple (thru increased debt)...!!!!

[edit on 9-2-2009 by cpdaman]

posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 12:48 PM
reply to post by mr. wildflowers

They should invest in building an infrastructure to support the people within each respective nation.

We all need to secure our own food production, farming, energy, finances etc...

Basically, we need to step away from globalization and become protectionist as nations in general.

The collapse is due to people buying needlessly on credit. And all of our countries are just pumping more money into a system that is already broken. They're trying to fix something using the very same things that caused the mess to begin with.

Without the bail outs, things will be hard. No doubt about it.
But with it, they're just sinking us further into the problem for decades to come. It will be a whole lot worse.

They've already shown that they're not capable of doing this job. What kind of government gives away billions and does it without legal framework for its use?
How on earth did they think banks would use the money? How did they "forget" to stipulate that a certain figure has to (by law) be issued in loans to small business? How did they "forget" to add stipulations on bonuses and restrictions on overseas investment?

That is the sole reason I believe that this was all manufactured. It was all planned to happen exactly the way it is.
Governments don't just give billions of $ to bankers and not make stipulations on how the money is used to boost an economy. This was a robbery.


And another thing!

"Too big to fail"... how exactly? In my reckoning, if a business has failed, they shouldn't be in business. That's the law of the jungle. You fail and your business sinks.

In what kind of sane world do we prop up businesses that cannot manage their own business? How is that EVER going to progress our society?

Personally, I'd be taking my money out of a bank that had failed to run their business properly and putting it into one that has managed through all of this relatively unscathed. How is it in our interest to keep our money within a business that has proven that they cannot do their business adequately?

[edit on 9-2-2009 by detachedindividual]

posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 07:29 PM
reply to post by Anonymous ATS

Big mistake the sub prime loans did not cause this crash. You need to learn what our currency is and no its not backed by gold.

Please don't patronize me. I guarantee that I understand the monetary system better than you do. I taught economics at college, and I ran a corporation and did all of the books, so please don't toss out meaningless statements. I never said that our monetary system is backed by gold. The rest of your post is rather meaningless drivel also.

posted on Feb, 10 2009 @ 07:36 PM
Fire Congress.

Elect new officials, one Senator per state, two House reps. Cut their pay to 75% of what it is now. Ban Lobbyists. Eliminate the Federal Reserve. Eliminate pork spending completely. Require that all members of congress serve four terms before being entitled to full retirement benefits.

The above alone will cut a huge amount of the yearly budget.

Beyond that, the federal government should have no business in the private sector. No bank bailouts, no corporation bailouts. Disband DoHS, and leave it in charge of the armed forces. Recruit more troops, active and reserves. Keep 25% of the armed forces in the US to protect our borders. Don't imprison border officials for shooting drug dealers as they cross the border. Employ a two shot warning system on all borders. (Two shots will be fired into the air, the third shot in the head.) Use ground penetrating radar to locate and seal any and all tunnels crossing the border. Do not give tax breaks to new citizens.

I could go on forever. But the best place to start is by showing the elected officials that we can remove them from their posts for dishonesty and greed. If there were a system in place where they could be fired, then maybe they would get their crap straight.

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 11:55 AM
reply to post by Walkswithfish

I see a problem with that approach. There really isn't 900 billion available.

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 01:54 PM
How do you prop up a planet designed to hold 1 billion people walking and riding bicycles when it has 7 billion plus people driving SUVs?

The economic crisis is not an economic crisis it is a breeding crisis.

Not one politician the world over wants to really utter the truth. We breed to much and need to stop. Civil liberties no blank-a-de-blank-politician is telling me I can't...

That's not why they don't want to utter the truth though.

The formula of space times population times emerging technologies is what has bred consumers like bunny rabbits to make the powers that be wealthy beyond imagination and powerful too.

No fix, fixes an over populated planet and the powers that be do not believe you or I can ever accept this or participate in the hard decisions that need to be made.

So instead we are manipulated towards the circumstances where hard decisions can be made.

There is only one real way to restore the world's health and prosperity.

Start drawing straws!

I volunteer to hold them!

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 07:54 PM
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Actually, I believe that it's recently been suggested that we begin to use abortion to control the overpopulation issue. Do you agree with that?

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 08:46 PM
reply to post by mr. wildflowers

Actually, I believe that it's recently been suggested that we begin to use abortion to control the overpopulation issue. Do you agree with that?

Only if it can be applied retro-actively! I am 44 when I was 14 there were not quite 3 billion people on the planet. Today there a 7 billion? Where would be in 30 years from now?

I am a big offender (6 kids) myself. The reality is that we as a population have to consider selective breeding or the powers that be will keep deciding when to turn on and off economies and when to start wars and when to unleash diseases to wean us down in much more unpleasant ways.

We need to decrease the population and abortion really isn't going to allow that to happen anywhere in the numbers needed.

It's a difficult and very touchy subject to a lot of people but the long and short of it is the masses will either have to learn to be responsible for our footprint on the planet or we have to continue to leave it up to the least scrupeless people to control the population.

When I was 14 is when Jimmy Carter commissioned Project 2000 to study the impact the population was having on the ecosystem and the world economy. 3 Billion was a tough number to sustain and they knew back then they were headed for trouble. Read Project 2000 published by the U.S. Government and see for yourself what they had to say back in 1978 on the subject. It's a very disturbing and frightening read and the economic situation plays hand in hand with it.

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 09:16 PM
What do I think should be done?

The government should be flushed...Fire everyone. We already had a bailout plan, what happened to the money? This will continue because our corrupt politicians are paying off corrupt corporations or likewise. We need a complete overhaul of our government...10+ Trillion in debt...We won't be alive to see that debt paid back. We aren't making life better, just less comfortable everyday. Nobody is happy about this plan...

but realistically...
If nothing's done, things will get worse. We don't have a choice but to accept the bailout. We cannot lose anymore jobs...As an American, you want to do everything you can to help your country...but theres nothing we can do if we don't have any money or homes...unless..........

Do I smell a revolution coming?

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 09:50 PM

Originally posted by Mekanic
Fire Congress.

Elect new officials, one Senator per state, two House reps. Cut their pay to 75% of what it is now. Ban Lobbyists. Eliminate the Federal Reserve. Eliminate pork spending completely. Require that all members of congress serve four terms before being entitled to full retirement benefits.

If there were a system in place where they could be fired, then maybe they would get their crap straight.

I believe we have something for that now!!

Recall of Legislators and the Removal of Members of Congress from Office

There are a few petitions already circulating but I don't think their catching notice. If this petition below works I would get it circulated to anyone and everyone that feels their being screwed by congress.

Petition for recalling congress

For more petitions I would just search on google or what ever site you like to search with using the keywords recall congress and maybe add in petition in their also.

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 10:59 PM
reply to post by AceOfAces

By "fire everyone," are you saying that anarchy is the solution, or that we need to start afresh with 100% new leadership? If you mean the latter, I entirely agree with you.

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 11:29 PM
Getting back to the original OP, the thing I despise most regarding the "Stimulus" Bill, is the fact that it was created behind closed doors, and the American public was not given sufficient opportunity to comment on the bill. The bill has now been reconciled by the joint Houses committee, and approved, and we still don't have a final bill for public consumption. (And please don't link me to the public posting, as another thread did, because that is NOT the final bill. It still had the $500 per worker tax cut in it, which has been cut to $400.)
What ever happened to the TRANSPARENCY that Obama and Congress claimed he would bring to the country? I hardly call it transparent, when the bill is voted on, BEFORE the public gets to see the final bill that has been approved.

In addition, this bill will do nothing but make matters worse. We are in a credit crunch, and this bill will attempt to provide people with more credit, which is what caused part of the problem in the first place. In addition, this bill, as well as the first bailout bill, will eventually cause hyperinflation, which will destroy the lives of those on fixed income. You can't keep printing money, without diminishing the value of the money already in existence.

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 11:40 PM
People. You have all got some great ideas, not that im one to judge, but have you wondered why all these people that are getting paid large salaries to figure out what you're all discussing, and no solution seem to pan out? I'm sure everything is happening the way people with the most amount of influence intended it to.

There must be thosands of ways to finance and build a civilization, what we are doing is a dead end and all the brightest minds know it. So why are we still playing these games? why are we still repeating the same cycles with a growing gap to any recourse?

The extremely wealthy (old wealth) are not effected in these times, they clean up. they are also the ones that have the most sway when it comes to making the decisions that got us into the current state of affairs. Is it any coincidence?

what would be their motive? it they are so powerfull and contol such major investments, why such an enormous swindle? sure a lot of it could be to keep mouths shut. to avoid being implicated, you implicate everyone.

Im trying to find a bridge to my next point and theory, but i cant think of one so ill just come out with it.

They are steeling our money to construct safe havens or space ships... i dunno, but something that is going to save them from the impending doom awaiting our planet. They took too long to find out and be convinced that there is no time or enough resources to save us all. so those in the know are going to do what they must to save themselves and i cant blame them.

wouldnt you?

good luck you bastards. If you got an extra room, i can be a good handyman, fix and leaks or relite your pilot. i am +2 so i'm going to need an extra bed if thats cool

posted on Feb, 11 2009 @ 11:44 PM
Let's say you (Government holding my tax money) are my personal investor. I say, 'Invest in future growth, invest in strong companies', then you take my money and invest in weak, failing companies, or overpay for worthless ('toxic') assets. Then I say, 'Hey, I'm running low on money', then you go on a spending spree.

The bailouts will fail. The stimulus will fail. The government is doing exactly the opposite of what they should be doing.

posted on Feb, 12 2009 @ 12:00 AM

I think we should also cut income tax, abolish the Fed Reserve and also tax heavily on companies that export work to foreign countries, this will help make up some lost illegal income tax.

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