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American States Declaring Sovereignty

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posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 12:07 AM
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For those who say Civil war is the last thing we need now, when is it a good time? When the economy is good, and jobs are plentiful? When congressmen and the office of the president ignore the will of the people, and are violating the constitution, that's when it comes, and that is when it needs to come.

However, remember how India was conquered. Britain leveraged groups to fight against each other until they were too weak to resist British rule to 'save' them. Beware the hidden hand.

[edit on 9-2-2009 by Dbriefed]




posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 12:08 AM
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reply to post by Spectre0o0
 


Oh yeah...been over on those threads pickin' their brains to see if any have info...



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 12:10 AM
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Originally posted by Iamonlyhuman

Originally posted by METACOMET
As far as I've seen, state senates are not passing these bills. Can someone please show if any of these bills have passed both house and senate and become law?

Texas vs White



Texas v. White, 74 U.S. 700 (1869) was a significant case argued before the United States Supreme Court in 1869. The Court held in a 5–3 decision that Texas had remained a state of the United States ever since it first joined the Union, despite its joining the Confederate States of America and its being under military rule at the time of the decision in the case. It further held that the Constitution did not permit states to secede from the United States, and that the ordinances of secession, and all the acts of the legislatures within seceding states intended to give effect to such ordinances, were "absolutely null".


[edit on 8-2-2009 by METACOMET]


These states are not passing bills (laws). They are passing resolutions. Resolutions are used for stating the intentions of the state government IF certain things happen. It is a way of warning the federal government SHOULD they do certain things, what that particular state will do about it.



Exactly... they are doing this now, because they'd be called terrorists if they did it under the Bush Cheney Regime.... I hate to dig up old politics, and I'm not trying to, but the last 8 years saw the Fed Gov completely disregard states rights.

Now, with the new Admins, these states feel comfortable enough doing so without the strong fear of reprisal from the current admin.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 12:15 AM
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yeah sure.. Americans are so fit and trim and our police forces and hunters would really do some bang up job against the most powerful government on earth.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 12:23 AM
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In Michigan it's called House Resolution no. 6
they started it in late Jan. last I knew it hadn't come up for even discussion...I'll have to look...
www.legislature.mi.gov...(S(21rmjiv1sl0wvw55yxurwl55))/documents/2009-2010/Journal/House/pdf/2009-HJ-01-22-002.pdf

States to Congress: Send money fast
Governors and mayors nationwide are hungry for billions from the economic rescue plan to create jobs and fill budget gaps.
money.cnn.com...

Now here's MSM at its finest...notice it doesn't mention the $40 Bln inflow for State Fiscial Assistance that was cut or what it means to passage of the bill...

Stimulus: What's next
Here's how the Senate bill differs from the House version -- and a preview of where the debate could heat up.
money.cnn.com...

BTW: DOW down 124 now...

[edit on 2/9/2009 by Hx3_1963]



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 12:31 AM
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Originally posted by lordtyp0
I just don't get it. Why didn't they do this when martial law was an actual threat? Under the bushies.

They are scaling back the patriot act and similar laws.

Why now?

And heres an unrelated random link for the sake of doing it.. link


It never once appeared that Bush had particular designs over the autonomy of the states. He is a Republican after all. Martial law might have been more permissible after the consternation, which would have ensued after a large scale terrorist attack. The federal government would be the best equipped player to sort out such a mess. On the other hand, under Obama, we are presently witnessing several near violations of state autonomy, to the point where the states are rallying against him and the legislature he has brought forward. Obama is a federalist. He is the Alexander Hamilton of our time.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 12:37 AM
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Originally posted by Odessy

Originally posted by TheOracle
Big government has just grown too big and does not respect the Constitution and sooner or later people will rise and it is not going to be pretty.


"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember it or overthrow it."
-Abraham Lincoln


Thats a great quote from good ol' Abe.

Theres alot of people, that draw similarities between Abe and Obama, including Obama. But do you think you'll ever hear wise words like this coming from our newest President?

Thats a resounding "NO!"

As far as the states and their sovereignty goes, this is my take....

You'll probably never see a real change for the good of the people coming from this. If US citizens were standing up and demanding their own sovereignty, then we'd be getting somewhere. Washington seems to like to forget, and to help us forget, where 'we the people' stand in this whole situation. WE THE PEOPLE HAVE THE POWER!

Americans have slowly been pacified over the years, to the point where we all sit back and wait for the government to tell us whats going to happen to our Nation. Instead, rather, we should be telling them whats going to happen.

I wish I had a time machine, so I could go back to the founding of this country and bring back the good men who fought for the peoples right to their own sovereignty, so that they could counsel and help us in this time. Believe you me, brothers, those men are rolling over in their graves right now.

So what do I think of states declairing their sovereignty??? Great, go for it. But dont expect things to get better until the citizens stand up and declair their own.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 02:43 AM
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didnt the President take control of each states Guard units ? If a Govenor has no militia how would they defend the state from fed takeover



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 03:46 AM
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reply to post by lordtyp0
 


I think you have it so wrong, there is so much uneasy feeling now that Obama is in president. I have friends that voted for him that are now reconsidering what they did. They are worried as we all should be. Bush kept all states safe, Bush did not hold talks with rogue nations such as Iran, Bush did not negotiate with terroist and even though some americans didnt like it, he kept terrorist locked up and didnt let them go to harm more americans. I was hopeful with Obama but now I am extremly worried. He has to suck up so much that he put his career in her hands and what did she do, she screwed him. Now he has George Sorros on national tv telling everyone what Obama should do next, that to me is a shot over the bow by George to Obama as to what he should do next. Who really is running our country, no wonder why states want to prepare for a breakup. Obama might be your saviour, but socialism is not what this country is about and if forced it will come apart at the seams to protect capitalism.

Its also scary how Obama wants to allign himself with Abe Lincoln, well during his admin we were in a civil war. Does Obama want to go that far?

[edit on 9-2-2009 by alienj]



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 04:47 AM
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I have to admit that I was hopeful when Obama took office.
But now, not so.

I did, however, point out that people should wait until he has acted as president before judging him, and now I feel I am able to judge him at least temporarily, and I now actually fear that he's just another scumbag puppet of a hidden regime.

My view might change, if he gets back on track and doesn't decide to follow the current method of robbing the people to pay the rich.
Unfortunately I don't hold out much hope. Every day I'm seeing more and more evidence of something incredibly dark and sinister in all our leaders.

Is that the NWO? I don't know, there's too much BS surrounding it for me to accept it right now.

Back on topic...

I don't know if the states rebelling will help or hinder, but I echo the sentiment of "when is a good time...?"
It's never a convenient time to have to struggle. But we're all going to struggle anyway, so maybe it would be better if you nip it in the bud and struggle on your terms, rather than wait for a long and drawn-out battle ahead, on their terms?

If the counties in the UK decided to break away from central government, I'd support mine all the way.
Use the laws of the nation to fight them, and only if that fails is there a reason to take up arms.

As your nation was founded on the idea that government should be removed when they become an enemy of the people, you should have removed them eight years ago for failing to adequately investigate the worst terrorist attack in history.

For a people so proud of their history and freedom, you sure gave it all up and ignored these specific instructions extremely easily. At least now your states are catching on.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 05:27 AM
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I think there is a real possibility to see riots at very least and people in the know are getting ready for this. Complete economic collapse could be imminent and they want to prepare those bills.
All the signs are there, I stopped counting threads about military exercises, FEMA and other strange federal activities all hinting to population control.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 06:04 AM
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If they are citing the 10th amendment, then I think it's good. Let me explain why.

The 10th amendment says that any jobs not specifically given to the federal government are by default passed down to the states, and then on to the individual communities and the individuals themselves.

This amendment is part of our bill of rights, and is the amendment which determines if the constitution is read as a document of limited rights, or as a document of limited government. These are pushes for limited government.

When the founding fathers were creating the constitution, there were 2 sides to the bill of rights argument. 1 side didn't want to list any rights at all. They feared that if you listed certain rights, we would one day be limited to only those rights. The other side of the argument was that if they did not list the most important rights, these most basic rights might be trampled on. Both sides obviously have valid points, especially since we are today limited to only those rights, and we wouldn't have those if they weren't listed.

The compromise and solution to this problem is the 9th and 10th amendments. The 9th says you can't add an amendment that takes away from a previously guaranteed right, and the 10th amendment I mentioned above. This was considered a lock on the bill of rights and government.

The federal government has created a loop hole in what is called the general welfare clause. They have made it so that anything they spin as "for the good of the people" is ok and "constitutional". However, the general welfare is mentioned 2 times in the constitution.

The first time is in the preamble. Which lays out the purpose of the constitution. In the preamble is states that part of the constitution is to "promote the general welfare". These would be the amendments, which are allowed to be added to. Article 1, sect 8(general welfare clause) give congress the permission to "provide the general welfare". This clause is NOT giving them permission to do whatever they want, this article is in fact the part of the constitution which gives the federal government permission to uphold the amendments, as per the requirement of the 10th amendment.

This was followed for the most part until the great depression. Yes there are many examples where it was ignored, and of course the Civil War was about the 10th amendment. But even when they outlawed alcohol, they had to add an amendment, because they still followed that. They added an amendment to repeal it as well. Today you do not see such amendments, they just do it all under the general welfare clause.

So if a state is citing the 10th amendment, they are correct, and if the fed denies it, then it is the fed who is not following the constitution. The State is standing up for the bill of rights as it should.

The only legitimate job of the federal government when it comes to domestic issues to insure that the states are not infringing on the basic rights listed. This is the only valid function, and they do not do it, they do the opposite. Rather than being the ones who infringe on these rights, they are supposed to be the one to protect them. The states are supposed to handle the majority of issues, with oversight from the fed. I could go on about the obvious benefits if asked, but I guess I'll let people chew on the above for a bit first.

The states are not succeeding or anything like that. They are simply asking for a proper government. If war is to break out it won't be the fault of the states.

Decentralization of Power is exactly what is needed. Of course, I'm not holding my breathe that these states will actually do anything if push comes to shove.



[edit on 9-2-2009 by badmedia]



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 06:59 AM
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Re-reading what I wrote, I realize I somewhat misspoke. When I said that upholding the amendments were the only legitimate job of the federal government, that isn't exactly true. They still have other roles when it comes to currency, and things between states etc, but these are things which are specifically listed. When I mentioned that I was referring and thinking about all the things the fed does which isn't listed. So a bit of a correction to that part.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 07:03 AM
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Originally posted by lordtyp0
I just don't get it. Why didn't they do this when martial law was an actual threat? Under the bushies.

They are scaling back the patriot act and similar laws.

Why now?

And heres an unrelated random link for the sake of doing it.. link


Its pretty funny that yo got so many stars for this post. Obama is actually getting more powers under the patriot act. Here I'll even use Obama's personal propaganda network to show you.


www.msnbc.msn.com...

Obama's NSC will get sweeping new powers
Result of directive expands security body's role far beyond traditional range

President Obama plans to order a sweeping overhaul of the National Security Council, expanding its membership and increasing its authority to set strategy across a wide spectrum of international and domestic iss



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 07:32 AM
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About damn time. Hopefully secession will be the next step and Georgia will be an occupied territory no longer. The government of the Confederate States of America NEVER surrendered, only the Army of Virginia. It is good to see states taking back their sovereignty, albeit a lukewarm response to federal tyranny. United States is a term that has not been applicable for a very long time.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 08:33 AM
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reply to post by Tentickles
 



I don't believe a breakup of the U.S. would result in civil war. I think it would just be each state looking after it's own, not fighting its neighbors.


Debt to the Federal Reserve system would also be repudiated by this action, since the entity which owes the debt (the United States) would no longer exist.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 08:57 AM
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reply to post by Annee
 


Where do you get this "crazy" idea about a state declaring its own sovereignty? The government is corrupt and broken. They are not acting on the will of the people and they are spending us into economic collapse. AZ is doing the right thing, I wanna move THERE.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 09:08 AM
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reply to post by lordtyp0
 


President Bush never would have called for marshall law, he has more respect for the office and this country than obama will ever have.

Barry is the one to watch for, he pals around with commies, terrorists and traitors to this country, he doesnt care about you or anyone else, he hates this country and wants to change it into something it should never be, a communist state.



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 09:47 AM
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ENOUGH!!!!

Our current form of government is destined for failure, it has to.

The United States of America is now, and has been for some time, a wholly owned subsiderary of corporate entities.

Nearly every single congressperson and senate member has and continue to sell their seats to the highest bidder of whatever special interest group walks into their office with a check and an agenda.

We are the only industrialized western nation without National health care. People go bankrupt because they're sick,and this is supposed to be the richest, most enlightened nation on earth?????

No, nearly every State and National political office holder has disregarded what is truly best for the citizens for their own benefit.

We should all be ashamed of ourselves for being so damn lazy and worthless that we allowed it to happen to te point that the only way to stop it and really begin the business of taking care of our citizens, is to completely overthrow this government.

When I hear someone on here or some other blog speaking about the "evils of socialism" I want to kick them in the head. Don't be stupid!

Which is worse, a government in place to care for te people, or a government in place, such as now, where the only people cared for are the rich and influential? Socialism may not be the answer, but it's a damn sight better than what we "enjoy" now.

Lock and load folks, it's the only way.

-Watch your six



posted on Feb, 9 2009 @ 10:01 AM
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Iamonlyhuman:

These states are not passing bills (laws). They are passing resolutions. Resolutions are used for stating the intentions of the state government IF certain things happen. It is a way of warning the federal government SHOULD they do certain things, what that particular state will do about it.


This is correct. A Resolution states intention, and from my reading a lot of States are doing this, including the Lacoda Indians and the Kingdom of Hawaii. It is the corporation that is in trouble here, not the people. If credit card debt were abolished and the credit card banks put out of business, and America went back to a gold based montary system, all would be better IMHO.
Lakota Indians Secede From the Union
www.elephantbiz.com...

bpg131313:

I must admit that I don't see what's coming as a Civil War, equitable to what happen during Version 1.0. In that war several States chose to cede from the Union and form their own Union. In THIS case, we're walking into a whole new game where the Union has collapsed from under all 50 States at the same time, leaving the States to pick up their own collective pieces. This isn't even in the same ballpark as Version 1.0. Should the US go down, there are a LOT of very serious issues to deal with and they won't be dealt with prettily.


The Dollar has already fallen, even the big time drug dealers demand Euros instead. I don't think we will have a Civil War 2, what I do think will happen is all, or most of the States will pull back from Corp. UNITED STATES and become sovereign once again, electing a new government after a period of martial law by local Guards and police. Order must be kept, no doubt of that, people are too greedy to be totally free.

The Laws of the Land must be restored, and according to the Constitution and Articles of Confederation the Federal Territory and authority extends to 100 feet outside Washington D.C. proper, so Federal agents must have permission from the State to operate inside of that State,also, the Military, according to Law, cannot operate inside U.S. territory, period.

The NWO wants us to fight each other, and they want another internal war action so many of us can die to please them. their plan is to merge America with Canada and Mexico, via NAFTA, and shut out small towns and communities, thus driving all to the cities, or the camps built for our entertainment. A peaceful secession is the only real solution here, we just fire the Corporation heads, and elect a new government, by the People and for the People. These "Public Servants" work for us, people, not the other way around. All we need do is stand together in unity, and state what we want done, and where our tax dollars will be spent, and where we will send troops, and who will coin our money. (Only the Treasury Dept. can do this by Law)

I see these resolutions as a giant first step toward State Sovereignty, and I hope the State involved keep a cool head here. For some of us, the First Civil War was never won or lost, the North just occupied several states, and Martial Law was never rescinded.

The Facts:

In 1863, Lincoln instituted martial law. He ordered that the States (people) either conscribe troops and provide money in support of the North, or be recognized as an enemy of the nation. This martial law Act of Congress is still in effect today - what it means is that the President has dictatorial authority to do anything that can be done by the government in accord with the Constitution of the United States of America. This is the foundation of Presidential Executive Orders.

The District of Columbia Organic Act of 1871 created a private corporation (hereinafter "Corp. U.S.") owned and operated by the actual government for the purpose of carrying out the business needs of the government under martial law. This was done under the constitutional authority for Congress to pass any law within the ten mile square of Washington, District of Columbia.

In said Act, Corp. U.S. adopted their own constitution (United States Constitution), which was identical to the national Constitution (Constitution of the United States of America) except that it was missing the national constitution's 13th Amendment. The national constitution's 13th, 14th and 15th amendments are respectively numbered 14th, 15th and 16th amendments in their constitution.

The corporation began to generate debts via bonds etc., which came due in 1912, but they could not pay their debts so the 7 families that bought up the bonds demanded payment and Corp. U.S. could not pay. Said families settled the debt for the payments of all of Corp. U.S.' assets and for all of the assets of the Treasury of the United States of America.

Congress passed and entered the 17th amendment as ratified, even though the states had no opportunity to ratify the same. This amendment is not only not ratified, it is not constitutional; the Constitution forbids Congress from even discussing the matter of where Senators are elected.

In 1933, the Trading with the Enemies Act is adjusted to recognize the people of the United States of America as enemies of Corp. U.S.

In 1944, under the Bretton Woods Agreement, Corp. U.S. is quit claimed to the International Monetary Fund, and becomes a foreign controlled private corporation.

By 1971, every State government in the union of States had formed such private corporations (Corp. State), in accord with the IMF admonition, and the people ceased to seat original jurisdiction government officials in their State government seats.

In short, a corporation(s) own and run everything there is to run, even the city you live in is a corporation. Why do you think your city sign says, "Incorporated in 19**?"
We the People have to abolish these corporations for once and for all time, business is business, and sovereignty is sovereignty. The States can take back their power anytime they wish.

Sovereignty is the exclusive right to have control over an area of governance, people, or oneself. A sovereign is the supreme lawmaking authority.

The Bottom Line: when you speak about these private foreign corporations, remember that is what they are and stop calling them government.

Further, it is very important that we cease to attempt to fix them. It is far more important that we learn how to re-seat our original jurisdiction government and spread the word about the truth. By re-seating our State and national governments in their original jurisdiction nature, we gain the capacity to hold these private foreign corporations accountable. They owe us a lot of money, in fact they owe us more money than there is available in the world. The fact is that it is impossible for them to pay and that gives us the leverage we need to take back our nation and put things right. The process is a simple one. The difficulty is in getting our people to wake up to the truth. That's why we ask you to prove the truth for yourself and contact us with the evidence you discover.

That means that you must stop acting and communicating like you are anything other than the sovereign that God created you to be. And, stop referring to Corp. U.S. or the STATE OF 'X' as anything other than the private foreign corporations that they are. And, finally, stop listening to the Bigfoot Patriot mythology that is espoused by those that only give these facts lip service.

"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine."
Thomas Jefferson

"A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor and bread it has earned - this is the sum of good government."
Thomas Jefferson

"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent."
Thomas Jefferson

"Educate and inform the whole mass of the people... They are the only sure reliance for the preservation of our liberty."
Thomas Jefferson

"Enlighten the people generally, and tyranny and oppressions of body and mind will vanish like evil spirits at the dawn of day."
Thomas Jefferson

"Every citizen should be a soldier. This was the case with the Greeks and Romans, and must be that of every free state."
Thomas Jefferson

"Every generation needs a new revolution."
Thomas Jefferson

"Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny."
Thomas Jefferson

"Conformity is the jailer of freedom and the enemy of growth."
John F. Kennedy

Make no mistake; our freedom is very much under attack. And regardless of whether or not you’re an American, your freedom, too, is at risk. It’s the age-old fight of good vs. evil.

Articles of Confederation : March 1, 1781
avalon.law.yale.edu...

These Rights Make Us Strong
www.ranknfile-ue.org...

America's Corrupt Legal System
www.globalresearch.ca...

United States Presidents
and The Illuminati / Masonic Power Structure.
www.theforbiddenknowledge.com...

The Democracy Doctrine under fire
www.usatoday.com...

State of Oklahoma v. State of Texas
www.altlaw.org...

Chickasaw Nation of Oklahoma
www.oklahoma-tribes.com...

Hawaiian Constitutional Convention
hawaii-nation.org...

State sovereignty and the protection of fundamental human rights
www.pugwash.org...

Idaho GOP Votes to Abolish Federal Reserve
www.dailypaul.com...

Executive Orders And Laws relating to National Emergencies Laws
United States Code TITLE 50 - WAR AND NATIONAL DEFENSE
CHAPTER 34 - NATIONAL EMERGENCIES
www.disastercenter.com...

Resolution: Abolish Federal Government
www.globaljusticemovement.net...

War of Southern Independence
www.geocities.com...

The Alaskan Independence Party
www.akip.org...

I think the Confederacy had the right idea...if not, why then the 14th Amendment? Why then the marriage license? Why then all the policy laws that have been thrust upon us, a once free people, who are now not much more than slaves to the government? Oh, we would like very much to take back America without bloodshed, but is that possible? Would Obama order troops to fire on us? Or would they turn tail and run off the their Mars base? Only one way to find out, isn't there? I hope I have made you think a little......
I will leave you with a little song that means a lot these days...

Press One For English



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