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Pepper Spray / CS Gas Shelf Life?

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posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 04:01 AM
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Is there a hard and fast rule as to when a canisters contents 'go-off' or become non-irritant?
I notice some canisters have a 'use by' date but consider this to be a marketing ploy to buy more canisters.
I believe they'd last for decades but what do you folks think/know?




posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 04:16 AM
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Originally posted by WatchRider
Is there a hard and fast rule as to when a canisters contents 'go-off' or become non-irritant?
I notice some canisters have a 'use by' date but consider this to be a marketing ploy to buy more canisters.
I believe they'd last for decades but what do you folks think/know?


I believe the contents are good for many long years, but its the propelant that fails, similar thing with fire extinguishers , over time the propelant be it CO2 canister or Propane the pressure slowly bleeds off leaving with with a useless tool.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 09:41 AM
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Cheers for the answers on that, especially that quirky one CS



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 10:22 AM
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Met Police CS spray is re-issue after use and every 2 yrs if not used. And always give it a shake before going on duty to aggitate the CS crysals....

Voice from experience, ex Met Plod

Rgds



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 11:19 AM
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Good thread.
What is the current law on using CS gas or pepper spray here in the UK.

As it is a self defense piece of kit, I would naturally expect it to be illegal.


If it is legal then I would be looking to invest a few pennies.

Edit.

After a little research ( I know I should have done so before posting the question ) I have found it to be illegal.

Really I should have know anyway I suppose.

[edit on 8-2-2009 by colec156]



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 11:56 AM
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Treated as a firearm here in the UK and therefore not legal I'm afraid

Rgds



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 01:03 PM
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So, as usual we have to resort to harsh language.

Just as well they've banned blades otherwise I'd cut my own balls off before they do that as well.

*looks*

Oh, looks like legislation has taken care of that as well.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 01:23 PM
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I had a very interesting argument with a very senior Police Officer a while back. He had been mouthing off on TV about knife and gun crime.
He said something like

" If you go out armed with a knife or gun the chances are overwhelming that your own weapon will be used against you by your attacker, carrying a knife, stun gun, baton or other weapon simply means you will end up being attacked with your own weapon".

I asked him " In that case why do our police routinely go around with batons, stun guns, sprays etc, by your own system of logic that means your officers will also be more likely attacked with their own weapons"

He did not like that.

He followed up with "Police are equipped because they may have to deal with violent criminals and need them for self defence".

I responded with so you are saying its OK for cops to protect themselves with the best tools available, but not the public.

He did not like that

He carried on saying " There are thousands of violent crimes every year in the UK and the police need to be equipped to deal with them"

I asked him to give me figures on exactly how many criminals set out each year to rob, mug, rape, steal from, or attacker police officers, AND COMPARE THOSE FIGURES WITH How many criminals set out each year to rob, mug rape, steal from etc
District nurses, Security Guards, Store detectives, Shop assisants, paramedics, doctors, elderly people living alone, people living in isolated farm houses, female students walking home after dark etc.

He did not like that at all

He continued to repeat the mantra that the public have no legitimate need to carry weapons for self defence, but he could not explain why.

I pointed out that people like him and the Home Secretary, The ACPO and the Police federation would prefer to find the body of a young lady raped and murdered in some dark alleyway, rather than find her having to explain how her attacker got shot, stunned, sprayed or tazered.

He refused to talk after that.

The absolute undeniable fact is the British Police Services offical attitude to self defences puts more honest decent law abidding people in danger from attack. Thanks to the police and the Ban It brigade Gun crime, Violent Crime, Knife crime and sexual crimes have all risen ( many by over 100%) since 1996.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 01:27 PM
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Originally posted by Nirgal
So, as usual we have to resort to harsh language.

Just as well they've banned blades otherwise I'd cut my own balls off before they do that as well.

*looks*

Oh, looks like legislation has taken care of that as well.


I am afraid I have a lovely wife and a beautiful young son to care for, So I choose the best option for me if having to confront a criminal is that I prefer to be tried by twelve of my peers, rather than be carried by six of them.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 01:31 PM
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Im in 100% agreement but the fault does not lay with PC Plod, it lays with the Home Secretary. CS Spray does not work on everyone, even heavy smokers can be partially immune to it. Deffo doesnt work on dogs, and Id rather "stick" someone than find out my spray isnt effective on a drunk or drugged up yob.....

Our laws are crap with regards to self defence BUT if you understand your rights under common law and follow them then you CAN legally fight back.

Mind you Id always rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6 or 15 if your from far, far up North


Sorry NR you beat me to it


Rgds

[edit on 8/2/09 by Dark Vengeance]



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 01:39 PM
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Originally posted by Dark Vengeance
Im in 100% agreement but the fault does not lay with PC Plod, it lays with the Home Secretary. CS Spray does not work on everyone, even heavy smokers can be partially immune to it. Deffo doesnt work on dogs, and Id rather "stick" someone than find out my spray isnt effective on a drunk or drugged up yob.....

Our laws are crap with regards to self defence BUT if you understand your rights under common law and follow them then you CAN legally fight back.

Mind you Id always rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6 or 15 if your from far, far up North


Rgds


Lets go through your post one bit at a time.
1 The average cop with any time on the streets know the real hard truth, while the fast track graduate inspectors do not have a clue and put political correctness, ethnic awareness and elf n safety before real common sense policing.
2 Its not just the home sec, its the ACPO and fed as well as they have become politicised in the last 25 years to be a simple extention of the govt of the day, the plod on the street is a fruistrated and the rest of us.
3 yes legally you can defend yourself, but you cant have the tools or equipment purposly designed and best suited to the task, and you have to consider the human rights of the criminal attacking you when you fight back.
4 Some laws are wrong, some laws unjust, some laws are stupid, and some serve a nefarious purpose, PACE and the self Defence Laws are all four .



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 01:56 PM
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reply to post by Northern Raider
 
A simple answer to your guys' dumbass laws limiting your ability to protect yourselves is a standard cane. They make very effective weapons. Just make sure you use the kind with a hooked handle, not a t handle. The hooks can be used to grab an opponents limbs and use their own momentum or weight against them.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 01:59 PM
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NR, maybe I have not understood your post properly or vice versa. I do actually agree with you.
I am only saying do not blame pc plod for the laws of the country.

H&S at work was, if my memory serves me, not introduced to the police service until the year 2000.

Most legislation with regards to PACE 1984 and ammendments etc was introduced to make things fairer and to try and prevent miscarriages of justice.

At common law every english citizen can use force and a pre-empted stike is permitted:
"If you have an HONEST and GENUINE held belief, that YOU or ANOTHER, are in IMMINENT DANGER, than you can USE such FORCE as is REASONABLE and NECCESSARY to overt that DANGER"

CS spray is classed as a SECT5 Firearm even though it isnt a firearm.... Thanks Home Secretary!

The political correctness of this country is its own downfall and many, many sheeple are scared that the rights of the criminals come first. This is not true, every englishman and woman has the right to stand tall.

We all know that the current government are always re-inventing the wheel, just like the mobile phone & driving, now a specific offence but you could have always got nicked for driving without due care and attention...

The average pc plod has his/her hands tied and thats one reason why I got out.

WR sorry for highjacking your thread

Rgds



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 02:12 PM
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Originally posted by Dark Vengeance
NR, maybe I have not understood your post properly or vice versa. I do actually agree with you.
I am only saying do not blame pc plod for the laws of the country.

The average pc plod has his/her hands tied and thats one reason why I got out.

WR sorry for highjacking your thread

Rgds



No probs you did not hijack the thread you made a good positive contribution to it, I dont blaim the average plod either, but I do their professional bodies, Its quite suprising just how many people are getting very disalussioned with the force.
Respects NR



posted on Feb, 10 2009 @ 09:59 AM
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reply to post by WatchRider
 


As a wholesaler for OC sprays I recommend the smaller units, key chain 3/4 oz. be replaced every 12 months. CO2 can "leak" in these units and will render the spay useless. Larger 1 and 2 lb canisters have a much more reliable and regulated valve and can be expected to last 2 to 4 years if not used.

Think of a fire extinguisher... most states mandate annual inspection and service/replacement.



posted on Feb, 10 2009 @ 11:15 AM
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Hmm, thanks for that folks.

The illegal status of pepper/cs spray is pure hypocrisy! I know all over Europe it's pretty much legit to carry them.

I'm not so sure on the smokers having partial immunity though. I went through the cs gas chamber in the forces and all the smokers were coughing and spluttering like hell along with the non-smokers


My CS gas I got on the continent is about 10 years old! The pepper spray (Asia) is about 3 years old.
It still has a fair amount left in it.

Good wordings from NR and his foil the vengence dealer!



posted on Feb, 10 2009 @ 01:35 PM
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When I went through the chamber in the mid 80's (British Army) we had to eat, drink and change a cannister in a CS rich environment. We used S6 respirators, I remember one POC (potential officer candidate) lifting his mask and instead of gulping his water he held it in his mouth, pulled the mask back down and blew out hard PMSL ie as if he was eating. Needless to say he almost drowned!!

The partial immunity to CS effects by smokers was explained to us when I was being CS Spray trainned in the 90's with the MPS. If you are using CS Spray, aim at the chest then move the spray upto the face of the suspect. That way the crystals are on his clothing and helps you gauge distance and aim. Never just aim for the face unless you are at point blank range. Chest, face then side step as the suspect may still lunge at your last known position. And if you are going to give commands make sure you SHOUT everything 3 times. And remember CS spray DOES NOT work on everyone!!

Rgds



posted on Feb, 10 2009 @ 09:57 PM
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LOL!

Yeah the chambers can be a blast can't they!
I used to hate the decontamination drills using the S10 respirator, always stung and irritated my face the CS.

Thanks for the comments on the spraying lore too, that's handy.



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