What is with all the "Christianity-Debunking" attempt threads?

reply to post by SumnerKagan


It's all about Jesus.

There are the anti-christ out there fulfilling the bible prophecy even though they pretend to not believe the bible.

It's the non-believer bringing about the fulfillment of the prophecy, not the Christians.

But the Christians are not correct either. They tout how they love Jesus, yet practice very few if any of his teaching. Donating to charity and going to church doesn't count. Following Jesus is about how you treat people in everyday life. And wether one loves money more than God.

And as a friendly request. Would you Aethiest consider capitalizing Gods name. It is just showing some respect to those of us who believe in Him.

Moving thread. Get's my vote.

I've noticed it too. You'll notice the same people are usually out defending Islam or downplaying terrorist actions. I think these people feel a need to attack anything they see as "white", while defending anything tat seems "non-white" to them. This is a consequence of political correctness and liberal indoctrination.

These people basically beleive that being bigoted towards whites/white religions, actually makes them more worldly and diverse people. Its twisted logic, but its what they are taught in school and from the media.

reply to post by daersoulkeeper


Keep the Faith. Wipe the dust off your feet. These mockers will regret for eternity.

reply to post by YeshuaWarrior


You are a long time dead.

Originally posted by AshleyD

As a Christian myself, it is a little irritating but I do understand it goes along with the territory of being a conspiracy site. Just look at it as a way: It gives you the opportunity to correct their accusation and refute them with the facts*....

...Karma** does have a way of kicking the trolls in the teeth*** around here- I promise you. Even if it is not immediate.

* The Facts: There are no facts, it's a belief system. Just because you believe in it doesn't make it fact.

** Karma: is a word that does not appear in the bible.

*** Kicking the trolls in the teeth: Isn't that rather violent imagery for a pacifistic Christian to be using?

You are a prime example of why some of us non-religious types get so infuriated - you come across as arrogant, smug and condescending.

Originally posted by Stormdancer777

And i still believe above all Christians are the most persecuted, these days.

Maybe in some countries where Christianity is not the main religion, yes, they are. The posters on here who don't like having their beliefs questioned are hardly persecuted, sitting in their nice homes at their nice expensive computers. There's a big difference between criticism and persecution.

Originally posted by daersoulkeeper

It is to be expected that the one true religion would be attacked more so then the others. This statement alone read by many will rise up anger in them to defend and to attack.

Well, what do you expect when you make outrageous statements like that! There can't be "one true religion" as long as none of them can physically prove their God is real. I know I said above that AshleyD was a prime example of why we get infuriated but I forgot about you daersoulkeeper. You take the biscuit sometimes!

Originally posted by gate13

...people want to see hardcore evidence and just cant beleive thats how scripture was given from the word of god and it has been passed down through the years.

I love this whole "word of God" thing! He seemed to speak to people a lot in those days. Why was it accepted then? If someone walked up to you nowadays and said "God is speaking to me and telling me to slaughter lambs in his name" you'd likely phone the police, wouldn't you? And yes we want to see hardcore evidence because the word of some guy in a church reading from a book just doesn't cut it! Why do you think that is so wrong? You may cite the example of 'doubting Thomas', but it could be argued that Thomas was added to the bible later as a tool to help convince people that to deny Jesus was wrong. I don't know, I have no proof, yet neither do you. Why should I be chastised for saying so?

Originally posted by topsecretombomb

All these threads claiming to be debunking Chrisitianity seem to be backing up the fact that there are people sent here to put out so much disinfo!

Those of us who don't believe could claim the same thing about Christian propaganda being disinfo.



There is nothing wrong with debating this subject. I will admit some people take it too personally sometimes (myself included) and say rash things. I'm sure if many of the Christians (or any other religious types) here would refrain from professing their beliefs in such an obnoxious way, there would be less of the attacking posts by non-believers. I think most of us are happy to live and let live as long as we aren't having any religious propaganda shoved down our throats. Believe in what you will, but realise that I don't need to believe in it too.


(all emphasis in quotes added by me)

reply to post by sotp

And you are a primpe example of why I rarely participate in this forum anymore. I could come in and say 'Good post!' and someone would still use the 'But You're A Christian!' card.

Yes, it is a belief system and it is faith. But there are also 'facts' regarding the religion. I could point some out to you but this feels silly to explain the obvious. There are doctrinal 'facts.' There are scriptural 'facts.' There are apologetic 'facts.' There are textual 'facts.' There are historical 'facts.' Even belief systems have 'facts.' Sorry you miss the obvious and label it 'smugness.' But I am very used to the word twisting and judgmental tone so have fun.

You also come across as smug by assuming I don't know 'karma' doesn't appear in the Bible and you come across as very judgmental by claiming my wording is so un-Christian so shame on your little Christian girl! You should have handed us out hugs and kisses instead of giving us your honest observation about an occurrence you have seen on ATS.

Spare me.

I came to bring words of comfort to the OP and to help him understand that our faith will be the primary source of conspiracies around here and we should understand it's the way it goes and to also explain how the rule about hate speech is new. However, you are the one taking things out of context and giving off an air of smugness and judgment. Funny how that works.

Christianity need not any debunkers, it has enough flaws in it's own pages. Any book written by man is faulable even if it's about a deity.

reply to post by SumnerKagan

You seem to be throwing debunking and bashing into the same category. Why is it okay? The same reason it's okay to question anything else.

"But, on the other hand, few have done as much good as Christianity."
Get over yourself. If you lived elsewhere you'd see what the majority religion does for people.

Why are there more "anti-Christians" than anti-anything else? Because ITS AN AMERICAN SITE. Are muslims in the majority? No. Jews? No. Pagans? No. Atheists? No. When any of the above take over your country then they will be the ones most questioned.
I also have to say all the Muslim bashing on the first page of posts is pretty ironic. Coming from the people complaining about their religion being bashed.


Show of hands: how many people starred and flagged this thread just because of their common religion? Hmm? That says more to me than anything else.

reply to post by Cio88


Since when is christianity a "white" religion????????????? I'd like you to point out where in the bible or any other statistical data that christianity is a WHITE religion. You my friend are the bigot here and clearly not the most swift thinking, to turn this into a racial matter and to refer to your own religon as an Aryan type of state. Absolutely rediculous your post has also been brought to the attention of the MOD's.

I will also add that I was a confirmed Catholic and am also of Causcasion decendency. I turned away from the Bible at a very young age because I could see the problems with segregation then. Funny how I was so young but was still able to see what the numerous sheeple of the world cannot. Religion will always segregate, there will never be peace with religion, only fear, only war.

Also anyone else Wishing to help get this Racist nonsense off this page please go up to Cio's post and press ALERT to call this post to a MOD's attention. I have already done this but with a few more complaints it will be removed for sure.



[edit on 8-2-2009 by TNT13]

reply to post by AshleyD



Perhaps your are right, it was rather smug of me to point that out about Karma, and I am big enough to admit it. And yes, I suppose I should have thought a bit more before I typed that there were no facts as it was a pretty broad statement, and I apologise. Of course there are historical facts, all I meant was the way that many Christians believe the existence of God and Jesus to be fact when there is no proof. I wasn't however being judgemental about your 'kick in the teeth' statement, I was merely making an observation. I applaud your effort to bring comfort to the OP, but to use such violent imagery seems contradictory to your faith, that's all. Having the word pacifist in your avatar whilst also showing a sword seems contradictory too. Just saying. not trying to be smug...




[edit on 8/2/09 by sotp]

reply to post by Ridhya


Absolutely spot on, the problem with any type of infantile personality is trying to keep grips on what is "YOURS". Even though Christians preach peace, there is no other right religion in their eyes, so how would that harbor peace? Christianity constantly oppress' and forces it's beliefs on every type of populus especially third world. So I absolutely agree why else be so mad at a single religion other then the fact of trying to change the laws and rights you've lived by your entire life. The majority of the Christians here seem to be blindly RACIST toward other religions and as you stated are simply doing the same sort of bashing toward other religions that they are complaining about in the first place. The word Christian can easily be substituted with the word Hypocrit.

reply to post by sotp


No worries, Hon. But you seemed to have missed the word 'Fighter.' It's all contrast and duality.

Take care. No harm, no foul.

[edit on 2/8/2009 by AshleyD]

Wow. So much hate. And, I'm sorry to say, I see some hate from the "believers" as well. Statements like the following, are not helping the situation much:

Keep the Faith. Wipe the dust off your feet. These mockers will regret for eternity.

Although I understand the message, I also understand how this can cause feelings of alienation and defensiveness in non-believers. But, to be fair, I have to state that this message is NOT specific to Christianity. The concept of "Hell" for the non-believer is almost universal in religions throughout history. And the act of terrifying non-believers with this message is not only used by Christians.

Originally posted by Ridhya You seem to be throwing debunking and bashing into the same category. Why is it okay? The same reason it's okay to question anything else.

I'm not concerned with the act of questioning Christianity. I am concerned with the unusually high frequency of this type of post, and the pure venom that seems to be allowed to accompany them when it comes to negative posts directed at Christianity. At some point, this type of action leaves the domain of "debate", and enters the realm of a "mission".

Originally posted by Ridhya
"But, on the other hand, few have done as much good as Christianity." Get over yourself. If you lived elsewhere you'd see what the majority religion does for people.

I have seen, first hand, what this religion has done for people. First to pop into my head, is my best friend, who has been building an orphanage in Kenya, brick by brick, through his church, for the last 5 years. Why? Because he felt that God wanted him to do this. Now, that was an example that is very personal to me. But, there are countless other examples of Christianity doing good out there. Usually, the people that have seen the most of that good, are people that have really had hard times, and hit rock bottom in one way or another. Then, after looking around for help when it seems hopeless, they sometimes stumble across some type of Christian-based charity, outreach, fellowship, etc. Yes, it really happens.

Originally posted by RidhyaShow of hands: how many people starred and flagged this thread just because of their common religion? Hmm? That says more to me than anything else.

Maybe they starred and flagged the thread because they had been feeling a bit persecuted, and felt strongly about somebody voicing what they had been feeling.

[edit on 8-2-2009 by SumnerKagan]

I had this referred to me by another member and I thought it might be somewhat educational as far as this topic goes.

African-Americans are the most religiously devout racial group in the nation when it comes to attending services, praying and believing that God exists, according to a recent profile.

The center's U.S. Religious Landscape Survey, conducted in 2007 on more than 35,000 people, found that 79 percent of African-Americans say religion is very important in their lives while 56 percent of all U.S. adults said the same. Even among African-Americans who are unaffiliated with any particular faith, 45 percent of them say religion is very important compared to 16 percent of the religiously unaffiliated population overall.

Among the various racial and ethnic groups, African-Americans are the most likely to say they belong to a formal religious affiliation. An overwhelming 87 percent of African-Americans identify with a religious group, according to the U.S. Religious Landscape Survey by the Pew Research Center’s Forum on Religion & Public Life.

Following close behind are Latinos, with 85 percent of its population associating with a religion. In comparison, 83 percent of the overall U.S. population report affiliation with a religion.

Source

Semper

reply to post by AshleyD


Although I was not involved in the conversation between youself and sotp but I have a simple question. What I don't understand about Christianity is this amazing double standard of infaulability and responsibility. The Bible says not to harm another living soul, our last president kills millions; no apology, no explanation except for the word Terrorist. Now since he is a Christian and clearly so are you yourself, my question to you is how can you have the word Savant while you have the word scholar and also why can you have the word pacifist while you have the word fighter next to your name????? This is that amazing double standard I'm talking about, if one is a pacifist they will never be a fighter, doesn't matter the type of context the word FIGHT is not in the pacifist dictionary. Two how can one be a Savant and also be a Scholar, a Savant is one who has knowledge without need for education, therefor a savant will never be a scholar in the definition of the word. So clearly you suffer from the same hypocritical issues that the religion of Christianity suffers from in a whole.

[edit on 8-2-2009 by TNT13]

Originally posted by TNT13
So clearly you suffer from the same hypocritical issues that the religion of Christianity suffers from in a whole.

Oh dear. The judgment, the judgment. Really, this is funny. The 'writer-fighter-scholar' means that I participate in the Collaborative Writing, Debate, and the Research forums. Feel free to join- they're tons of fun. Then the 'Reader-Pacifist-Savant.' is a play-off spin of those special forum titles meant as humor but also very true.

Thank you, thank you. No more questions from the press. Let's get this thread back on track and stop with the personal interviews.

reply to post by TNT13


Fighter
Writer
Scholar

Are all Titles awarded by ATS for different efforts on the board and have nothing to do with the personality or religion of the member.

A Fighter engages in the "Debate Forum"
A Writer has engaged in "Writing Short Stories or Poetry"
A Scholar has engaged in the "Research Forum"

Semper

reply to post by AshleyD


Either way still hypocritical on all fronts, regardless of why it's there. What would be your explanation for the SWORD in your picture as well. Defintion of the symbolism of the sword:
The sword is said to be the emblem of military honor and should incite the bearer to a just and generous pursuit of honor and virtue. It is symbolic of liberty and strength. In the Middle Ages, the sword was often used as a symbol of the word of God. The sword (especially borne with flames) is also a symbol of purification. When borne with a cross in the same field, the sword signifies the defense of the Christian faith. The usual form is a long straight blade with a cross handle, though the blade may also be waved or embrued. There are also specific types of swords that may be described such as the falchion or seax, which is a broad bladed, slightly curved sword with a semi-circular notch at the back of the blade. Others include a scimitar, cutlass or sabre. A sword is often depicted piercing an animal or a human heart. Two swords crossed in saltire is an emblem of St. Paul.

So now another question, why is it that an item that KILLS people; is also an item that symbolizes CHRISTIANITY a supposade PEACEFUL RELIGION. This is not off topic in any sense, I would just like to know why there are so many hypocritical things in the lines of Christianity. This is right on topic and I'm sorry your my point of discussion at this time but in my eyes you are personifying the Hypocrit-Christian mentallity. Also I know your going to say this is a very ancient meaning for sword, so there in why would a person of christian faith who can clearly understand the REAL symbolism of a sword as being a weapon of destruction (I wouldn't exactly use it to cook) still use it to describe ones self.

[edit on 8-2-2009 by TNT13]

reply to post by semperfortis


It understand those are all factors of an ATS membership, I think they should change what words they use because these are taken greatly out of context. Especially when the subject matter I'm talking about involves so many hypocrits.

Interesting thread, definitely given me something to think about. I'm not religious at all, but hopefully haven't been guilty of any of the Christian bashing talked about on this thread. If I have been at all, then I apologise.

I tend to stay away from most of the religious threads altogether, apart from some of the Islamic ones that crop up every now and again, and that's only to try and counter the belief some posters have on here about everything Muslim being evil. So, with respect to the OP, I'd say that it's not just a Christian bashing issue on ATS, there seems to be a religion bashing mentality here in general. It just seems to be that some people are so set in their belief system, whether it be Christian, atheist, Jewish or whatever, that anything that doesn't fit into it must be debunked, or ridiculed.

Funny though, this reminds me of something I've heard several people say in my area. They've complained that it seems to be ok to attack Christianity in the media, or just talking about it, but if they did the same to any other religion there'd be outrage. So maybe the sentiment on here is just a reflection of the one out in society in general, where it sometimes feels like it's fine to attack the majority (in whatever sense, religious, racial, etc) but leave the minority alone, they're protected.

And if none of this makes sense, then sorry, too many cold meds

Edit: Gotta say though, in my opinion, if you don't agree with someone's religious beliefs, fine, that's your perogative. But don't try to destroy what someone believes, or what gives them comfort in times of trouble. It doesn't gain you anything, just takes away from someone else.

[edit on 8-2-2009 by DarkPassenger]