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At Least One American Believed Killed by Freed Gitmo Prisoners

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posted on Feb, 7 2009 @ 08:00 PM
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On making someone a terrorist/freedom fighter:

Torture affects them, but they chose which people to hurt, good or bad.

As an example; in 1977 I was in the USN. I escaped from being a prisoner of North Korea. Before I left, I made sure those people would never hurt another person. The torture was much worse than gitmo. Even so, I never hurt another person from North Korea, only those that had hurt me.

Colby




posted on Feb, 7 2009 @ 08:28 PM
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Those that claim that Gitmo has created more terrorists make valid points, but the truth is there was no Gitmo, as we now know it, before 9-11.

No Gitmo before the Cole.
No Gitmo before the first World Trade Center bombing.
No Gitmo before all the other terrorists attacks that have occured before the Waldorff Astoria we now know of as Gitmo

Face it, these people hate us not because of Gitmo, but because of our decadent society and idealogies that are being promoted by the very people that are saying they have rights under our laws, yes the Lefties.
How ironic is that?

There is no " which came first, the Islamo terrorist or Gitmo " debate here because the answer is obvious.

Bush released this animal because the whiny left claim terrorists have feelings too.
Give me a break.

On a positve note, if Obama closes Gitmo, then these animals will now have to be killed on the battlefield.

[edit on 7-2-2009 by Alxandro]



posted on Feb, 7 2009 @ 08:35 PM
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reply to post by Alxandro
 


Funny how you refer to them as animals, when we are ALL animals. They may be terrorists, but it doesn't make them any less human that you are my friend.

People enjoy labeling others as this and that, what they don't realize is most of the information we are fed about groups of people is largely biased and created to fit a certain agenda of another particular group.

If you ever talk to a terrorist, ask him why he does it, the answer my surprise you.

To tell you the truth, these people are the closest thing to freedom fighters that exist today. Mind you they're ideals are a little off and they're tactics are condemning, they are still making a point that we do not.

We love to sit around and complain about our governments and about how our lives are crap with this system, yet we don't do anything to change it do we?

Now I in NO WAY condone killing anybody to get your message accross,especially not in the brutal manner these people have done it in.

But it's to be said...At the very least, they're taking action.

~Keeper



posted on Feb, 7 2009 @ 08:38 PM
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i dont understand why an 18 year old could even be at at a us embassy



posted on Feb, 7 2009 @ 08:39 PM
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Originally posted by semperfortis

As for a President Authorizing Water boarding.

I did a lot of things in the military and never once did I get a letter of authorization from the President.

As far as I am concerned, the jury is still out as to Water boarding being any form of torture at all.


That's a pretty poor response, especially for someone that was in the military. I won't elaborate on chain of command since you are obviously aware of how that works. Here is my source for Bush authorizing torture at Gitmo: Bush Authorizes Torture

If you read the article, it mentions both Bush authorizing these "techniques" personally... and then it also cites a government e-mail where they do indeed in call it torture.

I also posted a link in my previous post where Eric Holder, our new Attorney General, stating emphatically that waterboarding is torture. Here it is again for your reference: New Attorney General defines waterboarding as torture

Also, I saw you make a point in some of your later posts saying they are prisoners of war, so they are not entitled to rights the same as Americans. For the sake of finding holes in your argument, I'll just accept that and mention the Geneva Convention, which the United States signed, which would make what we did there a War Crime.

The bottom line is that The Bush Administration created a poster child for terrorists world wide. If they didn't have a reason to hate America before, they did after the horror stories of Gitmo got out.



posted on Feb, 7 2009 @ 10:52 PM
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Originally posted by tothetenthpower

Funny how you refer to them as animals, when we are ALL animals.


I always like to throw this video in when people say things like this!

Please watch it, you might not agree with it, but there is something in it that makes you think a little bit about us humans as animals.



Kind of off topic but, ...

[edit on 2/7/2009 by Keyhole]



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 12:08 AM
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Originally posted by tothetenthpower

Funny how you refer to them as animals, when we are ALL animals. They may be terrorists, but it doesn't make them any less human that you are my friend.
...
To tell you the truth, these people are the closest thing to freedom fighters that exist today. Mind you they're ideals are a little off and they're tactics are condemning, they are still making a point that we do not.
...
But it's to be said...At the very least, they're taking action.


No, I'm sorry, they are animals because they don't care about their own children. If they are willing to sacrifice their own flesh and blood for the sake of killing any infidel, then they cannot be called human.

Freedom fighters my arse!
They know nothing about the meaning of the word FREEDOM.
What freedom do their women have when they walk around cvered from head to toe? What freedom do their homosexuals have?
Sorry, but your point is extremely weak.

Yes they are taking action but the action they take is totally destructive and promitive in nature.
What have they done, what are they doing to be productive members of society?

Answer me this, if they are willing to die for their cause, why not give them what they want by accommodating them?
They get what they want and so do we.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 12:20 AM
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Have they actually convicted anyone that is imprisoned in Gitmo? I heard that terrorists don't go there but normal people do. If terrorists were going there they would have them convicted before they go...

So, if someone gets out of Gitmo and does something like this then maybe after being tortured by terrorists they have justification?

Try looking at it like a human... none of these people have been convicted of anything. They are sent there BEFORE a trail in most if not all cases... and no one hears about them going...

Is this wrong? How many people have terrorists killed? I don't know, ask bush how many he killed and whether obama is going to follow.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 01:32 AM
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posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 02:18 AM
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What have we been telling them all along?


Torture doesn't force a true confession... the innocent confess for the sake of returning home to their families, and the guilty often look innocent having been used to harsh circumstances in the first place.



Let me repeat that...

Torture does NOT work!



Exactly as we have been warning, guilty parties are being assumed as innocent, and set free... meanwhile the innocent are being tortured, because they have no information to give.

THAT is why the guilty return to continue fighting.



Now, I haven't had enough time to make a decision on Obama's policies yet, but no, his stated intentions are not to release them. His intentions thus far is to put them on trial.

Not freedom... justice.



It's worked for us free nations so far for over a hundred years now.
It will continue to work.
Do you remember that system? Or is it too long ago for the wannabe fascists? The JUSTICE SYSTEM.



What has torture bought you?

Really... anything?

I'll tell you what torture has gotten you... a load of innocent people tortured, the guilty set free cause they're used to it... and the majority of the world desiring nothing more than to see the western world crumble.


With most of the world wanting you to crash... do you really think it's any coincidence that the western worlds economies are collapsing?


I'd like to say I feel sorry for you...
... or sorry for us all...
... but I'd be lying.


There's a lesson in all of this...
... but we're not done learning it yet.

[edit on 8-2-2009 by johnsky]



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 06:09 AM
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"Believed?" As in with no certainty? And while I'm at it, why is it only killing Americans that counts? What about that woman's non-American husband?


[edit on 8/2/2009 by moniker]



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 06:54 AM
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So only one of the released detainees have been accused of commiting a crime against someone who serves with the US foreign service in a country where they are clearly not wanted? And these were supposedly fundamentalist pscyho's who wanted to kill Americans at every turn?

Isn't it funny that no one has so far remarked on how forgiving a bunch of torture victims these people have then been?

I suppose i can now expect some to say that the torture and detention must have worked but perhaps i can point out that it doesn't make much sense to expect to have scared a fundamentalist psycho out of wanting to kill you?

But perhaps it's too much too ask to expect the fundamentalist who bombs other countries, from intercontinental bomber aircraft, and tortures people at near random to have anything approaching the facts that could make them seem less fanatically dangerous.

Stellar



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 03:57 PM
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reply to post by johnsky
 


I would venture to say you are partly correct because of course everyone is different, including Islamo terrorists, and what may work on one animal may not work on another..
Torture is no different, it may work on one but not the other. Judging by the fact that this country has not been attacked since 9-11, I think it's safe to assume torture works more often than not.
We think we know what goes on in Gitmo but we really don't.
Do you honestly believe all prisoners get tortured?

I'm sure they have exceptionally trained Psychologists, Psychiatrists that evalute these animals to determine who can and can not handle the torture process.
These are the unsung heroes in my book.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 04:08 PM
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reply to post by Alxandro
 


Making these people seem less human, is what got us in this mess in the first place. EVERYBODY is human, doesn't matter what they've done, what they've said. They're HUMAN and deserve the same rights that you do and deserve to be punished under whatever statutes and laws they have broken.

According to the law, is the main key word here.

Now my previous post was simply to play devil's advocate to see if anybody would agree and was able to see things from another's point of view. Apparently objective thinking died a long time ago. I'm sorry I tried.

And i'm sorry but you've done nothing, and neither has ANY human being in the history of our species done anything to prove that we are not animals.

All we've ever done is create things to kill eachother with, and then made those things better to further that cause. I'm sorry but we are ANIMALS, we are violent, nostalgic, hypocrits.

We preach equality and peace yet we try to force those measures on other people through violence. We starve countries and refuse aid to the ones that require it the most.

ANIMALS..is what we are...it's what we will continue to be until we actually become civilized and start appreciating what we have and loving eachother for who we are.

And as I had stated, I do not agree with their methods or Ideology, but they are taking action, whatever form that may be. Which is more than can be said for half or more of people who complain about what goes on in the world.

America has had this idea for the last 8 years that it needed to be Respected not well liked. Well look how that turned out.

~Keeper



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 04:09 PM
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Originally posted by AlxandroTorture is no different, it may work on one but not the other. Judging by the fact that this country has not been attacked since 9-11, I think it's safe to assume torture works more often than not.



I love this style of logic.


"I can beat my kids to keep from having a car wreak; Well, I haven't had a car wreak so beating my kids must work"


This el Rushbo "with talent on loan from Gooooddd" Limbaugh type of logic most likely won't serve you to well in the real world.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 04:13 PM
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Originally posted by Alxandro
reply to post by johnsky
 


Torture is no different, it may work on one but not the other. Judging by the fact that this country has not been attacked since 9-11, I think it's safe to assume torture works more often than not.

I'm sure they have exceptionally trained Psychologists, Psychiatrists that evalute these animals to determine who can and can not handle the torture process. These are the unsung heroes in my book.


Wow i have seen some statements here...but wow...You actually think that torture is OK????? So long as it suits the needs of the torturer huh? You'd probably change your mind if they were torturing you for information you probably didn't have.

bigotry is alive and well friends...alive and well.



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 04:58 PM
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reply to post by Alxandro
 


Torture doesn't work. Also, who are they torturing? Convicts? For them to be convicts they have to have been convicted of a crime. Apparently none of these convicts have been convicted.... which means they are prisoners who are being illegally tortured. Tortured against their human rights.

Who exactly labeled these innocent people as animals? Surely you haven't the right to call them animals knowing that everyone is innocent until proven guilty. Why did it take seven years for them to convince the 911 suspects they had in gitmo to finally confess? Don't you think that if they knew OBL was taking credit for the attacks then they could admit to it? Torture does not work.

I really don't believe the story that an american was killed by a released prisoner. I see this as only propaganda so they can again make some type of restriction to prevent this and other rights from happening.

This is kind of the sub-routine of the 9/11 programmed script that is being played in the media to help gain your loss of rights and freedoms.

Your following the scenario quite closely I see and enjoying the show....

Rgds



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 05:02 PM
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Torture doesn't work for what?



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 05:25 PM
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Originally posted by SuperViking
Torture doesn't work for what?


Torture doesn't work for getting reliable information. Anyone will tell you anything they think you want to hear to make the pain stop.

Schools out, now go play....



posted on Feb, 8 2009 @ 05:41 PM
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It's been pretty well shown that torture DOES NOT WORK!!!!

Besides, that IS NOT what our Country was founded upon!!!!

The Bush/Cheney regime is over.

Those idiots allowed a PWB to get by....the one in August, 2001.....Titled "Osama Bin Laden determined to attack" in America.

The clues were all there....the al Quaida cells in the USA...all of it. IT WAS WELL researched by the previous Administration. But, of course, the buffoons who were newly in charge wished to ignore ANYTHING that was collected by the Clinton Administration.

HMMMMM.....and they have the GALL to BLAME the Clintons for the 9/11 attacks?!?!???

The 'Bushies' were so arrogant, they ignored ALL that he Clintons had done, for the previous eight years.....SO, the 9/11 is entirely in their lap!!!!



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