Mind Blowing Quantum Physics

Originally posted by cancerian42
reply to post by Hellish-D

 

everything we know of is matter or energy. Those are 3d.

Yes, but they are also 2D, 4D, 8D and 10D, depending on how we look at them. We can only physically perceive 3D, so that's all we see.

A painting, you can say looks 2d, but it is still material 3d. What do we have to base the idea of there being a 2nd dimension on, if all we know is 3d? It is a concept that has no basis in reality. All matter has 3 dimensions...what could possibly have only 2?

Let me ask you this,

What if our world existed as if it were painted on a canvas of a material of a higher dimensional plane (4D)? An observer of that higher dimension would ask the exact same question, would he not?

People should know that Dr. Quantum is representing the New Agey people. He's exposed when he concludes from the double slit electron experiment that "observation" changes reality. This is absolute nonsense. Do your homework and you'll see that it's not passive observation, such as sight, but interference. The electron can only be detected from hitting it with a smaller particle, such as a photon. This affects the electron's charge, momentum, and velocity. It's common sense, but the flaky psychic folks won't explain that "observation" really means interference by way of physical contact!

[edit on 8-2-2009 by TheSingularity]

Great thread!

A couple of things:

-Maybe thought itself is the "real" 2D.

-Maybe our reality known as 3D is like a rainbow; you know it exists because you can see it but to get to where you think it's origin is is impossible because it changes for each one of our individual perspectives. Therefore it is an illusion.

Originally posted by cancerian42

Originally posted by badmedia
Well it's perspective. All that you see of these dimensions is what makes up your current perspective. They still existed in the 3rd dimension and beyond, it's just their perspective and perception of the universe which is in 2d. Just as ours is in 3d. When it shows them in 2d in the movie, it's just a representation of the 2d perspective.

How can something perceive 2d? I'll ask again what is there besides matter and energy? These things are 3d, we know nothing besides.

We know nothing else besides 3d? What do you call the measurement of time? That is a dimension as well... the 4th.

A Dimension is simply a way to measure something. I'm not sure why you think we are limited to 3.

Maybe he is saying we don't "know" 4D because he thinks we can't control it.

Or can we? These vids. seem to suggest we can.

there are no other freaking dimensions!!!

ther is just NOW becouse if there was another dimensiton we would be able to affect it.

please please understand What you think you know and what is "real" are 2 very different things

quatom phyics "ie teleportation" is just the understanding that one object "in space" is at the same point "in time" as another object "call it what you wish"...

point is humans are retarded.. myself inculded

let me point out one thing here in this thread

we can move matter without us knowing we moved it but look its there!! becouse we thought of it being there "preception"..,,

we can no affect qautom machanics becouse the rules state once you oberve it you have already altereted its state

do you understand that? I guess not!

i can think my self onto the moon.. does that mean i was there befor i thought about it?

it has paratamters but we dont understand it yet,, untill we go deeper into this "hole"..

i hate quautom phyisics becoue the people who tout it AINT GOT A CLUE how it works yet

reply to post by Anonymous ATS


No you miss understand my statement ¬_¬ i said there is NO 2d...

if you fly about in a 2d plane it AUTOMATICLY becomes 3D... why? Becouse ur INSIDE IT "a box"

if you view a circul and you INSIDE IT ie a so called 2d plane then it becomes 3d becouse you are inside it "so it gives rise to infinity"

some people need to get a clue and do more math!!!

or go read my posts on infinity symmerty

Originally posted by HunkaHunka

Originally posted by cancerian42

Originally posted by badmedia
Well it's perspective. All that you see of these dimensions is what makes up your current perspective. They still existed in the 3rd dimension and beyond, it's just their perspective and perception of the universe which is in 2d. Just as ours is in 3d. When it shows them in 2d in the movie, it's just a representation of the 2d perspective.

How can something perceive 2d? I'll ask again what is there besides matter and energy? These things are 3d, we know nothing besides.

We know nothing else besides 3d? What do you call the measurement of time? That is a dimension as well... the 4th.

A Dimension is simply a way to measure something. I'm not sure why you think we are limited to 3.

Actually the 4th is space. 5th is time.

Originally posted by theresult
reply to post by Anonymous ATS

 

No you miss understand my statement ¬_¬ i said there is NO 2d...

if you fly about in a 2d plane it AUTOMATICLY becomes 3D... why? Becouse ur INSIDE IT "a box"

if you view a circul and you INSIDE IT ie a so called 2d plane then it becomes 3d becouse you are inside it "so it gives rise to infinity"

some people need to get a clue and do more math!!!

or go read my posts on infinity symmerty

Problem with your idea is, if the plane is 2D and you sit inside it... Then it isn't really 2D at all. It's been 3D from the beginning.

A circuit can never be constructed as 2D either, so there's no way that can ever be considered less than 3D.

Mainly you're saying that 2D doesn't exist. Well, you are somewhat right... Because it's impossible to actually construct something in only 2-dimensions in our own universe. Even Paper is 3D, but just has a very small height. Come to think of it, we have no 2D constructions in our world... So no, 2D does not exist... You are right about that.

However, the math proves there is such a thing as 2D. Thus, it does exist. You leave yourself with a paradox.

It is proven to exist, but it can never be constructed and percieved. Sounds kinda like an atom on the subatomic scale.

Edit: It made me think. What if we've misunderstood the timeline of dimensions? What if we're supposed to go backwards and not forwards... Nevermind.

[edit on 9-2-2009 by Volatile]

[edit on 9-2-2009 by Volatile]

reply to post by Volatile


However, the math proves there is such a thing as 2D. Thus, it does exist. You leave yourself with a paradox.

Nope, wrong

2d = infinty no paradox, only understanding!!!

you see the reason it shows up in math is becouse you are alive thats all.

its not complex

Mind you it took me 20 years lol!!

math 4tw! "and i still think math is flawed" hehe

[edit on 9-2-2009 by theresult]

reply to post by theresult


Ah, I actually kind of get what you're saying.

It's like in maths. If A = 0 and B = 0, then B has 5 times more than A. And A has 5 times more than B. But neither of them have nothing.

That's the mathematical notion of zero... Indeed flawed, but works :

I'm just more of a physics guy than a mathematician. Nothing beats putting on the ipod with hard rock/metal and reading a good book about quantum mechanics.

[edit on 9-2-2009 by Volatile]

Man, I'm gone for half a day and this thread has jumped back into philosophy and complete misunderstanding of physical concepts.

The idea of the 4th spacial dimension as time is not really accepted. People are confusing it with the concept of spacetime, in which time isn't a spacial dimension at all, but rather a mathematical model in which time is added for 'flava' as it were.

I didn't watch the films, but if what TheSingularity is saying about Dr. Quantum's claims of the double slit experiment are true, then we can pretty much toss the rest of the stuff out the window right now, since wave cancellation is a very *very* basic concept in physics. Hell, if you have a pair of noise canceling headphones you're basically using the exact same concept, since both light and sound have the properties of a wave. (for more info, go to the sony store and look at the back of the package of a pair of noise canceling headphones.)

'This part is directed at theresult: We do change the states of other dimension, and other dimensions do change our state. One of the more popular theories on gravitation, for example, states that the reason that gravity is so much weaker that the other 3 quantum forces is that its effects are dispersed throughout the remaining dimensions, causing it to be diluted from our perspective. Therefore, our existence as simple massive bodies (each with our own gravitational pull) is an example of 'us' effecting other dimensions.

Science ftw.

reply to post by Hellish-D


I have agreed with alot of your posts i was just trying to show there is no "phyical" 2d space...

The only reason we see 2d in mathmatics is becouse you are alive

I do understand the concept you are getting across in you valid statement, but you fail to make the case for the reason why we see infinity and symmerty in nature and why the world is infact round ; )

math loops thats the problem and we are its yang

you can not have infitiny without being alive they are both part and parcel of the exsitence of the known universe..

happy to debate science vs math anytime

reply to post by theresult


Well, there's the fish in the pond analogy, but I'm on my way to class so I can't get into it now.

Latres.

Originally posted by Volatile
reply to post by theresult

 

Ah, I actually kind of get what you're saying.

It's like in maths. If A = 0 and B = 0, then B has 5 times more than A. And A has 5 times more than B. But neither of them have nothing.

That's the mathematical notion of zero... Indeed flawed, but works :

I'm just more of a physics guy than a mathematician. Nothing beats putting on the ipod with hard rock/metal and reading a good book about quantum mechanics.

[edit on 9-2-2009 by Volatile]

That's the mathematical notion of zero... Indeed flawed, but works :

zero is real its has a value and that value = infinity and the only reason we have zero is becouse we are alive.. WE are the zero ect

reply to post by Volatile


Well thats the reason we have quatom phyisics

becouse 0 has value!!! its not just a zero its saying in very real mathmatical terms that SOMETHING makes up the zero in the first place

order from chaos ect

But then the other funny part is quatom physics is still logical once you get past the qautom level

once we do that then we will kick the universes ass in a big way infact when we do get past the quatom level

we become gods in our own right becouse we have passed a level of understand of math or atleast its underlying properties ect

math obeserve
quontom math obeserve
ecsotic math obsever = < this level affects the basic math we understand

btw my fav subjects are math and quatom physics hehe

All I know is, zero is a value in itself. But if you take it from the perspective that 2 guys have both zero, then one guy will always have x value more than the other guy. But the other guy will also have y value more than the first guy.

So yeah, I imagine you could percieve zero as infinity.

But what I don't get is when you say we have 2D because we are alive. If you mean we have 2D because we just found out about it, then I could understand it.

But a physically being alive because of 2D, I cannot understand.

reply to post by Volatile


ok ill try again, its hard putting into words when i can see it in my mind/..

Im kinda like the telsa of math LOL!! here goes

2d is not a real thing in a respect of a phyical object

But its real in an equation becouse its us being alive and going down the loop

ok think of the paper thing we talked about befor.. that little thing on the vid the 2d object

in ITS mind its 3d becouse thats all it knows!! BUT the 2d aspect is its BEING THERE? kinda get wat im saying??

2d is only real becouse its the result of being alive

2d is looking down the tunnle of your very life.. now thats not a real anolgy or the best i can come up with lol

i should infact do a picture it would make more sens if you could view it..

infinity is just us being alive its a by product of life.. you dont get one without the other.. and thats were 2d comes into play.

if im still not getting my point across ill try again

[edit on 9-2-2009 by theresult]

So basicly you're saying the 2nd dimension = life?

reply to post by Volatile


hmm not its life but its the by product of being alive

its like if you put a rock into a lake it ripples... forever!! becouse you affected the lake

we are the rock the lake is the universe..

kinda get wat im saying?