Sea Shepherd Protesters Ram Japanese Whalers in Intense Clash

Originally posted by surfer_soul
What are you talking about? The fact is they nearly were wiped out!! Why do you think the legislation was introduced to protect whales and also other fish stocks around the world in the first place?? To put people out of work, to make them go hungry? No, to protect the species from over fishing, to help stocks make a recovery! Do think its not possible for people to make a species extict or something? Go do your research, take a look at the Dodo for example among others!

Of course humans can cause extintions. Show me anywhere i claim otherwise.
Agreed that they WERE hunted to near extinction but IT WAS THE WHALERS THAT NOTED THE DECLINE AND SET UP THE IWC mainly to ensure the future of whaling.
The dodo was wiped out due to the introduction of RATS that ate the eggs of future generations. Humans may of hunted them but the FACT remains that it was the RATS, and YES i know the rats were introduced by humans but the rats caused the extinction
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A few people seem to want to drag the bible into it. Reread your bibles, especially Genesis and also note all the sacrifices of animals to your so called God and if man is made in his image then he must be a very violent individual
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"Sentient assumes that the subject feels pleasure and pain - whales are therefore sentient." Its been proven that PLANTS react to both pleasure and pain. Are they sentient? of course there not
Sentient involves a hell of a lot more than reacting to pleasure and pain. Do some actual research on the subject
"In a civilised, non-poverty stricken society, there is absolutely no need to kill to eat. " Hope your a vegetarian or vegan otherwise your a HYPOCRITE. Same applies to anyone using that as an argument.
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Comments like "Whales die out" and all those that claim whale numbers are in DECLINE, well as so many asked of me FACTS PLEASE. Produce the numbers. IWC figures, on which Australia agrees with, show the number of whales INCREASING
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killing a whale or two is NOTHING in the long run, but pouring tons of toxic waste into the oceans will eventually kill them all

at least pick your protests correctly people.
Hey dont introduce this fact into the argument, you will only confuse the already befuddled masses its seems they dont like FACTS just emotional arguments
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"Fortunately there are some of us here that have evolved to the next stage - the stage that accepts that murdering other living beings for food is wrong and totally unnecessary."
Hey dont forget we would still be swinging in trees with all the other monkeys if we didnt evolve to be omnivores
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How about some FACTS people and not emotional language?

opps double post

[edit on 6/2/09 by Kalrana]

Well quite frankly, anyone that doesnt see a real big flippin' problem with hunting endangered species ought to be forced to watch what happens when a mother whale and her calf are harpooned then gutted and cut into pieces. And anyone who says screw the whales and screw PETA should have their head examined. I think its too bad that the Maru I and II werent sent to the bottom with their murdering crew.
Here in Idaho our own retard governor Clement Leroy Otter (not kidding), wants to be the first one to buy a tag to kill wolves, another endangered species, this republican moron should be the hunted one.

[edit on 6-2-2009 by spookjr]

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
Leto clearly does not know what sentient means, whales are definitely sentient beings. Let me educate you a little Leto:

sen⋅tient   /ˈsɛnʃənt/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [sen-shuhnt] Show IPA Pronunciation

–adjective 1. having the power of perception by the senses; conscious.
2. characterized by sensation and consciousness.
–noun 3. a person or thing that is sentient.
4. Archaic. the conscious mind.

I am all in favor of disabling these ships any way possible . The Japanese continue to lie to the world so deserve ZERO respect in my opinion. I would give them more credit if they just said " yes we love whale meat and will eat them until they are all gone" instead of cowardly hiding behind really bad excuses.

I believe the Sea Sheppard should create their own system of harpoon to shoot a cable into the propellers of the Japanese ships. It would harm no one and cause untold problems. If done properly it can even bend the shaft so would need towing back to Japan.

If you increase the cost of each expedition with repairs and towing it would become economically unviable to continue. In this way the recession can be used to great effect.

regardless of whether the japanese whaling is legal or not what the sea sheperds are doing IS illegal no matter how noble it may be. it's like their both kids and the sea sheperd is the bully chasing the japanese but when the japanese have enough and retaliate they go off whining like they were'nt actively chasing them down to destroy they're ship or sink it(which they seem to think they would be immune from prosecution or retaliation) . bottomline the sea sheperds are great at tugging at heartstrings of people to cover up there own illegal activities now matter how noble the cause.

Originally posted by spookjr
Well quite frankly, anyone that doesnt see a real big flippin' problem with hunting endangered species ought to be forced to watch what happens when a mother whale and her calf are harpooned then gutted and cut into pieces. And anyone who says screw the whales and screw PETA should have their head examined. I think its too bad that the Maru I and II werent sent to the bottom with their murdering crew.

More emotional rubbish. Seen plenty of videos on killing off whales. Have also shot and gutted quite a number of goats, pigs and deer. I see no different. Their all sources of food.
Yet another that ignores the FACT that whale numbers are INCREASING and that the current numbers harvested ARE SUSTAINABLE and the herds are getting larger and larger.
Those that equal the killing of another HUMAN (Murder) with killing another animal are the ones that need their heads read.
FACT (oh no not another one) Sharks kill more whales each year than humans harvest. Should the shark be charged with murder? Of course not. Its an animal killing another animal, a part of nature. Now it seems a lot of people forget that humans are ANIMALS. You may not like it but bad luck. WE ARE ANIMALS. Go learn biology, find out about the food chain. Look up Apex predator species or Alpha predators. Humans fall into this category

reply to post by Kalrana

More emotional rubbish. Seen plenty of videos on killing off whales. Have also shot and gutted quite a number of goats, pigs and deer. I see no different.

do you gut them while they're still alive?

I can argue for hunting and eating meat being natural - it is natural - has been since the dawn of time

if we change how we view this - that seems only natural for mankind - we're always reexamining how we've handled things in the past - rethinking how we will handle them in the future

I'm going to avoid the whole how we manage our resources argument altogether

but, even when I do or can support hunting - can't support cruelty

I'll never support torture

The people I know personally that do hunt (and I've known quite a few) don't support it either

reply to post by Battleline


cool ty maybe we should hook up and kill us a few whales!!! they are quite tasty btw

reply to post by Kalrana


If the Japanese really feel it is Ok , why lie about the reason for doing it ?

Because they are ashamed of their own actions , proud hunters do not have to make lame excuses last time I checked.

A real hunter also ALWAYS does a fast kill . No wounding shoots are allowed and killing young mothers or pregnant pray is considered the lowest of the low . So even if you agree with the killing of the whales you must admit that the Japanese ..

(1) Are unskilled hunters
(2) Are not proud of what they do.
(3) Have no hunters code of ethics .

Kalrana....

For those reasons I do not believe you are a hunter , or you would know that and be against it. More likely you have played some paintball before and pretended it was real. Faker.

I havent read this whole threaf so forgive me if it has already been posted.
I am an avid boater and have been following this story for awhile on a boating website.
Australia, U.S., Japan a few other countries agreed to a treaty to allow the Japanese to catch a certain amount of whales. I think it is 1100. Correct me if I am wrong on that figure. They are not being caught as research but that is the way the treaty reads. The waters they are hunting is was agreed on in the treaty. That is why Australian Navy does not intervene. They have every legal right to be there hunting.
Now, The Sea Shepperd is another story, they have broken numerous laws, illegal boarding of a vessel, firing projectiles, and now if you watch the video they purposely rammed another commercial vessel. And if they sunk the vessel they rammed, they would have to rescue them by law. Ironic. I will bet the Capt. of the Sea Shepperd is brought up on criminal charges. His 2 crew members that boarded illegally were arrested by Australian Coast Guard. Sea Shepperd is being called Terrorists by several govt's. I feel bad for Steve Irwin's widow, The Red Hot Chili Peppers and Animal Planet for getting involved in what they initially believed a good cause. This guy has no regard for the safety of his crew. Did you notice when he was supposedly shot there was no bullet hole in his jacket but there was in his bullet proof vest. BTW he was the only one of his crew to have a BP vest. I for one will boycot Animal Planet until they stop airing this program.

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


i am a big hunter and WILL NOT tolerate cruelty to animals. not a peta guy- just believe you kill an animal and do it humanely and quickly. my friends who hunt believe the same. sometimes it doesn't work how we want but that is life. as for gutting an animal while still alive you are f###### nuts if you try. i'll watch but gaurantee i'll be at least 30' away

The video of the ramming is now on Yahoo, it's clear that the protesters rammed it on purpose. cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com...

reply to post by thedeadtruth


ty i could not have said it better- hunters are not torturers(real hunters anyway) we kill to eat meat and do it as as fast and efficient as possible. not torture animals. period. if the japs want to kill a whale as long as it is in legal waters so be it. read my post on page 1- why aren't the people of the steve irwin brought up on attempted murder charges?

reply to post by thedeadtruth

I would give them more credit if they just said " yes we love whale meat and will eat them until they are all gone" instead of cowardly hiding behind really bad excuses.

Take a look back to one of my previous posts. I don't know any Japanese who like whale meat, much less love it. They would much rather eat bluefin tuna and so would I. Tuna is very expensive and whale meat is very cheap.

Is this really happening in Australian waters? Wouldn't there be some military action if they were truly in Australian waters?

Paul Watson makes us all look bad.

" Paul Watson makes us all look bad.

" Paul Watson makes us all look bad.

" Paul Watson makes us all look bad.

I've watched the whale hunters program just to see their side of the story. The only problem is that they go above the law and into vigilante status.I can understand that these animals can't defend themselves and need someone to do that for them, but at the same time if everyone decided to do stuff like this, there would be some serious issues. All the effort that these groups that go out and chase ships will be in vain when they start attacking . Then they get added to the "list". Not saying its right but they aren't helping the cause, they are definately hindering it.

-Aza

Originally posted by Spiramirabilis
reply to
do you gut them while they're still alive?

I can argue for hunting and eating meat being natural - it is natural - has been since the dawn of time

if we change how we view this - that seems only natural for mankind - we're always reexamining how we've handled things in the past - rethinking how we will handle them in the future

I'm going to avoid the whole how we manage our resources argument altogether

but, even when I do or can support hunting - can't support cruelty

I'll never support torture

The people I know personally that do hunt (and I've known quite a few) don't support it either

Well considering my reply to an earlier question in regards to torture, i thought it would be clear that i dont support torture of any animal and that includes humans or cruelty, something i cant the same for is NATURE. It can be pretty cruel at times....

Now when a whale is harpooned it is dragged aboard the mothership BARELY alive. If the dont do this the whale starts to sink thus risking an animal being killed for no gain. Now should the japanese wait for anywhere up to an hour for the animal to die a slow and painful death or do you slit the gut to allow the blood to drain greatly decreasing the time it takes for the animal to die and relieving the pain quicker?
Think i would prefer that than being eaten to death while trying to escape a school of shark. Natures not all cute and fluffy you know.
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"A real hunter also ALWAYS does a fast kill . No wounding shoots are allowed and killing young mothers or pregnant pray is considered the lowest of the low."
You have obviously never been on a cull where all animals young and old are wiped out.
Ever heard of Quality Deer Management? If so you would realse that you statement is wrong on so many levels

(1) Are unskilled hunters Yes and no Never had the chance to kill a whale so i cant really comment it. It may be that they are a lot harder to kill than we realise and ID between the sexes is hard.
Scenerio to consider.... A whale has just surfaced and is shot. As its about to be retrieved. Unbeknown to the whalers its a female and its young surfaces.
Do you let the young die a slow painful death through starvation or do the humane thing and harvest it?

(2) Are not proud of what they do. Why just because the changed the wording to try to appease western nations? Agree they should just come out tell the world "We are going to hunt whales. These are the numbers and species we are taking and if you dont like it we will withdraw from the IWC taking all pro whaling nations with us and we will hunt ANY variety of whale we choose." Scientific research sounds a lot nicer doesnt it

3) Have no hunters code of ethics . Dont know that we have a right to force OUR codes to a totally different race of people. Remember they have a totally different outlook on things, different traditions, different ways of doing things

As for your final comment well ill treat that with the contempt it deserves and just ignore it.
Although if you ever down Melbourne way i will make you the offer of meeting me for a beer and if you want i'll be more than happy to take you on a deer or pig shoot or even down the range and for your own info im a muzzle stuffer, so i now exactly how important that first shot is.
Of course if you want to go shooting the beer comes out after all firearms are away.