Why would anyone say ‘religion’ is here…to ‘control’ people?

Originally posted by TheMythLives
reply to post by OldThinker

 

I personally do not think that religion or faith is here to control the masses. Religions, such as christianity, christianity allows you to make up your own mind...

OK, why are there SO MANY posts that think Christianity is here to CONTROL them...they far outweigh the positive posts as yours...

OT

Originally posted by lernmore
While I decline to participate in your survey...

Why?

OT would love to hear your opinion...please notice I don't bite

You are more than welcome....

OT

reply to post by OldThinker


I suppose the one thing that separates the Word of God from any other book in the world, it is the only book which, when you are reading it, you come to discover, it is reading you .

Originally posted by jdposey
reply to post by OldThinker

 

I suppose the one thing that separates the Word of God from any other book in the world, it is the only book which, when you are reading it, you come to discover, it is reading you .

That statement ought-ta give the skeptic something to think about...


JD, you have a nice way of saying things...!!

reply to post by OldThinker


"Religion" can control people.
People can control people.
"If you don't go to my church, you cannot be saved" type theology!
One of the only times the term religion, is mentioned in the Bible is in

James 1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, [and] to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Unspotted in Greek is aspilos

1) spotless
2) metaph.
a) free from censure, irreproachable
b) free from vice, unsullied

IT DOESN'T MEAN 'keep yourself holed up in an enclave with rituals, and only 'chosen ones''!
It doesn't mean, "Keep your beliefs to yourself, lest you upset an atheist", either!

Jesus has kept me from stupid manipulation and cults for over 15 years!
I may visit a church, synagogue or cathedral, but, I WILL NOT bow down to the building or THE LEADERSHIP in it!

reply to post by Clearskies


CS,

Me either....

Its not about leadership...or some kingdom on earth...

Its about a relationship with the good Lord...

OT

PS: Glad you posted here...its been an interesting thread for sure...99.9% have been appropriate and provided much insight...hope all is well!

reply to post by OldThinker

The Catholic church is selling indulgences again to help people escape purgatory faster and people are waiting for alien disclosure!
2012, NWO.
I am seriously tired of all the manipulation!
I can tell you, if Jesus hadn't saved me and began a relationship with me, I would be crazy worrying about the things I know are going on!

But, I know the worst that will happen during the Tribulation will only last 7 years!
The Evil ones think they will have a millennium, how surprised they will be!

reply to post by Clearskies



Millenuim?

Are you 'pre-trib'? Understand that term?

I am...can't wait to MISS IT ALL!!!!

reply to post by OldThinker

Are we talking about Jesus the Christ OT? If I recall the Christ spirit came upon him during his baptisim with John. In the words and teachings of Jesus I am to think those came not from the man Jesus but the Christ spirit that descended on him.

Since Christ means annointed one who is to say there haven't been other annointed ones in other cultures? Which if sent from God would surely be of the same spirit or type spirit would you not agree? So taking that into consideration you are dealing with a God sent spirit not the man Jesus yes that would be correct that all annointed teachers would be the only way to achieve perfection of spirit.

You have to watch those newer bibles also they have a tendency to change words in them..try this example..

Whatsoever ye shall ask the Farther in my name, he will give it to you. Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask and ye shall receive, that your joy may be full

the original retranslated Aramaic version is:

All things that you ask straightly, directly...from inside my name, you will be given. So far you hve not done this. Ask w ithout hidden motive and that your gladness be full.

Is there a difference even slight there?

Notice is says from inside my name...how can you be inside the name of Jesus? Yet you can be inside the Christ by being of like type spirit couldn't you?

I've often wondered why people pray to the body of Jesus and forget to pray and thank the annointed spirit sent by God. Kind of like the trojan horse isn't ..its what was inside that horse that counted most.

reply to post by napayshni57


Nice work with the ORIGINAL language with the NT testament scriptures...


I've found...

When Christ ascends, He sends the Holy Spirit in his place (John 16:7-8, 20:22; also Acts 1:5,8; Peter's own words in Acts 2:33; 1 Peter 1:12).

For some details on how the Spirit is sent by Christ to continue Christ's work, see John 14-16. Especially see John 3:34; 7:39; 14:26; 15:26; 16:7. The Spirit shows us what we can't otherwise know about Christ.

The Spirit is at work, showing us what Christ has done, and how that makes a difference in what's going on around us. The Spirit's witness to Christ doesn't function like a hypertext link. One doesn't click one's mouse on the Spirit's doings and get taken to the front page of Jesus' Cybersalvation Web Site. First of all, your mouse-clicking takes more initiative than you can take in restoring your relationship with God (or, in church-talk, it's God's grace in Christ's work on the cross that saves you, not anything you do). Second, the Spirit leads us into Christ's presence and Christ's character, two things that don't pop up on a screen and say 'I'm here'. Then, the Spirit works to get our own Web Site to take on the character that others would recognize as Christ's, for instance, by removing the annoying banner ads for the causes and ideas we're stuck on, or the irritating pop-up windows with our excuses, or the sneaky spy cookies that gather the information we might want to use against others. The Spirit is trying to push this Body of the Scared past their fears into full contact with the rest of reality, especially with other people who are not aware of Christ, or who hear the Name and yawn.

link here with exhaustive work on the SPIRIT: www.spirithome.com...

Thoughts?

Thanks for joining the topic!

OT

reply to post by OldThinker


Yes, I'm 'Pre-Trib'.
Noah was taken out first(Before judgement) so was Lot.

reply to post by Clearskies


Yeah, me too...

Did you see that Jesus is a homo thread...?

I started to respond and then said, don't waste your time....don't know if I'm more angry or just sad?

OT

Pre-trib, I've got a very wise friend, low key guy...who says 2018,9 is the year...he's a 'mid-trib' proponent...brilliant fellow, i dunno?



[edit on 12-2-2009 by OldThinker]

reply to post by OldThinker

Thanks for the compliment OT but I have to give credit to my mother she was a minister in her younger days.

First off before I give my thoughts let me make a statement. I do not believe there is any one totally right religious faith or any one totally wrong religious faith. I also believe you find lots of simlarities in the different religious beliefs even the new age beliefs. We change names, switch the words used but yet keep the same meanings so they can claim they are different. I'm talking about whats the real importance in religion not the things that really don't matter in long run.

The holy spirit I have heard called by many names. For this thread we'll call it the holy spirit. Yes I do believe it will lead you and guide you. If you let it. If you have faith. I don't mean the lip service faith either. I believe we have to show our faith and the more we show our faith the more the spirit will lead us and guide us. The more it will teach us and show us.

I also believe what we are (the condition of our spirit) on the inside does manifest itself on the outside (our physical body and our brain). The mind and the brain are two different things to me.

I also believe there are wonders and marvels that most people never get to see that the spirit helps bring into our lives or shows us. To many times I've heard the days of miracles and signs and wonders are over. The days of the prophets are gone. This I don't agree with. When you are close to the spirit things will happen in your life you can't believe. You see the work of the spirit in those around you. And yes the spirit does talk to you. If you only learn to be still long enough to listen and believe what it says to you.

I noticed in the article the person talks of Paul saying if you pray. Well thats a problem. People have forgotten how to pray. Oh I don't mean they just forget to pray. For many of those that do pray have forgotten how to pray. We pay to much lip service in pray. We schedule it at certain times for certain deeds. We think about what we are going to say in that prayer. We memorize and use the same prayers over and over. We forget one thing we forget the prayer should come from the heart. It should be filled with our emotions happy, sad, thankful, even angry..at least you are putting some feeling from the heart in that prayer.

The art of prayer has been lost so many can't see the works of the spirit in their lives because their prayers aren't heart felt prayers. The spirit will give them the same effort they put out for it. Have you ever noticed that when a child really really wants something to happen for them they pray with so much emotion. Ever notice those prayers are usually answered in some way. The holy spirit is trying to teach us something from those childrens prayers. Thats one reason I say if you want to know something about God ask a small child they seem to understand how this all works better than us adults.

I do agree with help from the spirit anything is possible door will open in life. Whats inside you becomes even better. But I also think that because many don't see the work of spirit in their lives and their lives getting better they give up. If they were taught how to pray not when or what words they might find what they feel they lack the closer they would then feel to God.

Oh gee not sure if I got side tracked here..sometimes I just start rattling.

One question..does it really matter if there is a rapture or not? I mean if your in the right place in life won't God take care of you?

I love to read those rapture no rapture debates. I figured I'm covered either way thats what counts.

Originally posted by napayshni57
.....Oh gee not sure if I got side tracked here..sometimes I just start rattling.

One question..does it really matter if there is a rapture or not? I mean if your in the right place in life won't God take care of you?

I love to read those rapture no rapture debates.

I figured I'm covered either way thats what counts.

Glad you read the external post earlier, there is much to learn on that site/link....I would encourage you spend more time there and learn more, good stuff, i think...?

You have a good heart and the spirit, (its a HE btw, not an 'it'), is in you, alive and well!!!

Glad you are spending time on ATS, fun huh?

God bless, OT out!


Edit: PS: the rapture is inevitable...whenever..........I'm not too worried about...got work (love) to do...



[edit on 12-2-2009 by OldThinker]

reply to post by OldThinker


Thanks OT. yes very interesting site. BTW I used it to not offend anyone that might think other wise. I'm trying to be politically correct which truely isn't really easy for me

Hi OT,

I'm curious about something, I know it's off topic but its as relevant here as any other thread that you've responded to.

I noticed in a another thread you started that you again rolled out the "Jesus was either the Lord or a complete idiot and a liar" line.

I know when you replied like this to me I didn't take to it very well as it appears to me to be a very extreme view, and I'm not very fond of extreme p.o.v's. I'd really like for you to tell me why you take this view without rolling out any scripture or external links, I'd like it to just be written by yourself.

Th reason I ask is because I don't really like picking people's beliefs apart because if it works for them personally and I feel that we left things on the wrong note as I have nothing against what you believe in.
In turn you can question me as much as you like about my beliefs.

Originally posted by CloudySkye
Hi OT,

I'm curious about something, I know it's off topic but its as relevant here as any other thread that you've responded to.

I noticed in a another thread you started that you again rolled out the "Jesus was either the Lord or a complete idiot and a liar" line.

I know when you replied like this to me I didn't take to it very well as it appears to me to be a very extreme view, and I'm not very fond of extreme p.o.v's. I'd really like for you to tell me why you take this view without rolling out any scripture or external links, I'd like it to just be written by yourself.

Th reason I ask is because I don't really like picking people's beliefs apart because if it works for them personally and I feel that we left things on the wrong note as I have nothing against what you believe in.
In turn you can question me as much as you like about my beliefs.

ok...

assumptions: i believe the Bible...

If he inferred he said he was god, and said he was the son of god, his followers said he said this, his enemies said he said this, even in extra-biblical sources....


He can't be something of a good nature less than that...he could have been lying, knowing he wasn't telling the truth...or delusional, not knowing...making him a lunatic...


Here's the biggie...for all religions to have him on their religious hall of fame list, BUT NOT GOD...is illogical and OT thinks from the pit of hell.....

1) Do you think faith/religion is here to control the masses? yes
2) Why? Because it says that you have to follow it and you are not allowed to question it or bad things would happen
3) Your evidence? the governments based on religion to day and in the past
4) Did you once believe? before I realized that it was all fake
5) Did you change? yes
6) Why are you an atheist? because religion has gotten in the way of logic, knowledge, and human progression
7) Why are you an agnostic? see aove
8) Why you are a christian? I would never be that
9) What ‘SHOULD‘ God look like/act like/be like? f there is to be one, not in the form of man, not like religions describe it, and not against science that religions have proven him to be.