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Why would anyone say ‘religion’ is here…to ‘control’ people?

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posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 12:24 PM
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1) Do you think faith/religion is here to control the masses? ~Yes
2) Why? ~Google FEMA preachers
3) Your evidence? ~common sense
4) Did you once believe? ~unfortunately
5) Did you change? ~yes
6) Why are you an atheist? ~im not
7) Why are you an agnostic? ~because i cannot understand the concept of infinity
8) Why you are a christian? ~im not
9) What ‘SHOULD‘ God look like/act like/be like? ~the chick from weird science, or Kelly Rowland




posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 12:28 PM
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Religion is perhaps more corrupt than government. It is here for mass control and nothing else.

Thanks.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 01:32 PM
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1) Do you think faith/religion is here to control the masses?

- The first problem is how your perception of "faith/religion" is! You do not need to believe in any religion to have faith. You can be Atheist/Gnostic and still have Faith. (or some call it spirituality)

2) Why?

Human as species always wanting to "belong" to a group, the problem with that is we're really trying to find our true selves (onenes) and so we're attracted to one another as living beings, we need one another to survive. So early in time, the elite planned a way to use our true essence (onenes) to break people apart in groups. Since it's our nature, to wanting to 'belong" in groups, it empowers us. Like they say, you can use hammer to build a house or to destroy one!

3) Your evidence?

look at the past, the msot death ever occoured in our civilization has been done in the name of a religion.

4) Did you once believe?

When i was not awoken by my true sence of being.. yes! once you see the beauty of our creation, then you realize you do not need to be a part of any Man made religion to be one with the creator(s).


5) Did you change?

yes

6) Why are you an atheist?

used to be!

7) Why are you an agnostic?

but then I belive that there must be something out there that created this universe, so there must be a higher power of some shape/form.

8) Why you are a christian?

I dont' follow any religions!

9) What ‘SHOULD‘ God look like/act like/be like?

As Alex Grey puts it, we're ALL living cells of god! The energy that feeds our life to our consciousness is God(s) itself.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 02:36 PM
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Originally posted by OldThinker

I have a few questions, if you may…please no flaming, ‘civility and decorum’ expected, right?

1) Do you think faith/religion is here to control the masses?
2) Why?
3) Your evidence?
4) Did you once believe?
5) Did you change?
6) Why are you an atheist?
7) Why are you an agnostic?
8) Why you are a christian?
9) What ‘SHOULD‘ God look like/act like/be like?



1. I think faith is something completely different than religion. I think some religion has been used to control the masses but not all. I think religion is also a distraction and means for those to find purpose in something external and fantasy based instead of their own reality that they are seeking to escape.

2. I have been part of multiple religions and seen the contradictions of all of them. Refer above.

3. My evidence is the war and disunity that is constantly created in the name of religion. It is the confusion people live through because of religion. It is the closed minds that accept only what does not go against their religious beliefs regardless of its truth. How many martyrs are there? How many people have died for religion? How many have lost families and destroyed relationships because of religion? There is someone always trying to slowly convert you to their faith or religion as they all see fit that their truth is your truth. It is a unity game while the masses think they know what is best, they fail to realize every mans journey is his own. If they want to be religious they need to keep it a personal viewpoint.

4. I tried to believe and could not rationalize my logic and the evidence and contradictions away. I could not induce a state of self denial to live a fantasy. Too many unbearing fruits for me to stay. People give credit to their religious beliefs for their personal development when they do not realize that it usually runs parallel to them looking inside their self. Any man can look inside and clean out the trash and replace it with rubies. But sometimes their idea of their God gives them a means to do it (which is good) but they can fly that route solo.

5. I changed in the sense that I realized what was truly happening and saw the truth for me.

6. I believe in God but do not believe in mans description of him or her as God is a foreign subject. How can I explain quantum physics when I know nothing about it? I should not even try. Such is religion.

7. I am not agnostic but their ancient writings come closer to my beliefs of finding the inner self than most others.

8. I am not christian but use to be. I have forsaken that belief system as I found too many opinion tweaked flaws in that also.

9. I have no idea as I do not know what God is and I will not attempt to explain something I do not understand as that will only give a personal opinion on the matter which is what is wrong with religion. I think of God as some type of creator and a better purpose and possibility for enlightenment.

My truth is my truth. I see my evidence. Once you are willing to question everything and deal with the painful answers will you find the "TRUTH". It will not be easy, it will not give you the sense of self fulfillment religion does but it will be the truth and maybe by knowing that we will not need religion anymore. Look inside yourself and ask the hard questions and you will begin to enlighten yourself. I know I sound arrogant but this is the conclusion I have came to and this is what works for me so wonderfully. Once we see from a broader perspective as a matured nation and world we can do away with things that create war such as opinion pushing and religion. We can all respect each other for each other.

OT what is the purpose of this thread. What are you trying to accomplish with this information? Are you truly interested? Do you really care about our opinions and if so why? What is your reasoning in this? I am interested.....




[edit on 6-2-2009 by N3krostatic]



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 02:43 PM
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1) Do you think faith/religion is here to control the masses?
2) Why?
3) Your evidence?
4) Did you once believe?
5) Did you change?
6) Why are you an atheist?
7) Why are you an agnostic?
8) Why you are a christian?
9) What ‘SHOULD‘ God look like/act like/be like?

1)
Faith and religion are completely different things, you can have faith in a person, a machine or indeed anything that has a function, Religion on the other hand is no different to any coorporation, government or military body. It is the organized structure by which information and knowledge are deliberately held back from people so that jsut enough is give to keep them enthralled and enough remains that control is maintained. This applies to all religions: pagan, animist, gnostic, polytheistic, monotheistic, buddhism and scientology.

2 & 3)
Avoiding any modern analogies we'll go back before Christianity and start with pagan cultures. Typically the priests were also the holders of all the scientific knowledge, this might be as simple as knowing when and where to sow the crop or as complicated as knowing how to survey land and plot navigational courses and heal the sick. For an example on this look at the Haitian witch doctor cultures that originate in Africa and Polynesia. These priests exert their control on society by telling people what is and is not acceptable to "the Gods" or what will bring them bad luck and some such things. Telling them who they can marry, making them perform rituals, elevating people above eachother for no good reason, for a good example of classes see Hinduism. In early Christianity St.Paul writes to the Corinthians to dictate to them what they should and should not be doing. The Qo'ran is full of rules as are all "religious" texts. The Egyptian Book of the Dead lists all the many things that an individual must do and not have done in order to live in hte afterlife and not have their soul eaten by some horrendous creature.
All the religions seak to instill some sense of fear in their followers that something bad will happen to them either in life, or after death, if they do not follow that religion's rules.

4)
Did I believe in what? Myself? Sometimes. People? I try. God? Always. Jesus Christ? No. Religion? No.

5)
I've always believed in God, regardless of my scientific background. I've never really felt the need to be a part of a religion.

6)
Certainly not.

7)
I don't consider myself to be agnostic, but technically I suppose I am.

8)
I'm not christian because I cannot accept that Jesus Christ was the son of God. I respect the teachings in the New Testament as well as those of the Torah and Qo'ran the Vedas and the Teachings of the Buddhas. All the religious Texts have aspects that make sense because they teach you to be a respectful, sociable, open-minded person if taken in the right light.

9)
God is always there for everyone, waiting to help. All that is asked of you is that you treat everyone as you would want your loved ones treated, because everyone is loved by God, and that you do your best to seek forgiveness, ideally from those that you have wronged. God is everything, people who do not believe in God are angry that he does not help them when they trip or when they see others fall, but they do not ask themselves what it is they tripped on.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 02:43 PM
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reply to post by OldThinker
 


1) Do you think faith/religion is here to control the masses? yes
2) Why? well all you who claim there would only be one religion for everyone is wrong, because not every person is the same. you have to have more than one religion to control more than one type of people.
3) Your evidence? history. most civilizations were united through a similar religion and belief. this unites the people in a single cause thus all the wars over religion
4) Did you once believe? uh, believe what?
5) Did you change? i guess not...
6) Why are you an atheist? no
7) Why are you an agnostic? no
8) Why you are a christian? no
9) What ‘SHOULD‘ God look like/act like/be like? everything and yet, nothing.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 02:51 PM
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Originally posted by OldThinker

Originally posted by The Bald Champion
isn't Earth just a test ?



yep!

It appears that way....

You passin?

OT


This is yet another part of the 'system' that I no longer hold faith in. Earth, and life on it, is not a test that will pass or fail. One where passing means eternal life on your hands and knees worshipping 'God' or where you fail that you are sent to eternal fire and brimstone.

You do not see the manipulation being thrown at people in that? Do you honestly think that the creator of all, the one that created each and every one of us out of LOVE would seriously have done so for us to WORSHIP it?

I'm sorry my friend. I realize you have your time on this earth and your experience to convince you that this is so but I cannot see it.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 02:56 PM
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Originally posted by dariousg
... Do you honestly think that the creator of all, the one that created each and every one of us out of LOVE would seriously have done so for us to WORSHIP it? ...


For some people this is easy to believe as if they had the money or power, the first thing they would do is make people do whatever they wanted. It's part of human nature, look at the ridiculous celebrity cults of people who practically worship celebrities, look at Jonny Depp for example. The question is, if you had the choice, would you really want billions of people to worship you and wait on your every word, or would you grow bored and realise that there is more to life than power and adulation.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 02:58 PM
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reply to post by CloudySkye
 


Very very very well done. Completely agreed!
God will not do for us what we won't do for ourselves!
There is a logical explanation to almost everything if we are willing to accept it.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 02:59 PM
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Originally posted by OldThinker

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
I do not believe for one minute that religion is a tool to control people. First of all, people are free(with the exception perhaps of a few countries) to choose to belong to a religion or not. Again, with a few exceptions(and I exclude cults like Jim Jones, etc) people can leave a religion, or choose not to adhere to all of its precepts.

Religion can be a very comforting aid to people, especially in times of need, and can set a moral compass for human beings.



This one is quite possibly the most concise, wise post to date....thoughts others?

OT


Well, I was going to reply to the post directly but then figured I had a lot of reading to catch up on. Well, since you ask, yes. My thoughts are as follows.

People are NOT FREE. When you are BORN into an extremely religious family, especially ones that are well off (experience from visiting with relatives and cousins) you will find that you have very little choice. It is forced on you. AND if, God forbid, you choose to go another route you are pressured in an extreme manner. When your parents come down hard on you and your relatives, there are only a very few limited choices. You either CONFORM or you run. Running means that you are now your own person but it also means you now have very little to do with your family.

So when people say that 'It's YOUR choice' and 'We live in a free country' (America) they are speaking with the typical blinders on. So, this statement was NOT concise and well done. It was written, as with many 'religious' people, with some very serious blinders on.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 03:01 PM
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reply to post by CloudySkye
 


Exactly. WORSHIP is a HUMAN thing not an almighty (almighty in the sense of 'GOD' not god) one.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 03:10 PM
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reply to post by dariousg
 


You couldn't have said it better and more true!
How can a child have decision when religious beliefs are pressed on them from the early molding age. They grow up thinking the way of their fathers because they were raised that way. As you said when you decide to veer from the chosen route you have little to do with your family as what you are is a letdown of their personal beliefs. Every child should be given choice without the fear of fire and brimstone. It takes tremendous courage to break away from a religiously built family but only then can you learn the truth and take off the blinders.

In order to attain the truth you can either cast yourself out or be cast out. I chose to cast myself from the sheep but now I know.........



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by OldThinker
...The father can not be in the presense of sin....and I certainly am not perfect....so I am screwed, so to speak...we all are....that's why Christ had to die....took our place and stuff...don't want to get too heavy...its early


You see, this is the mentality of the CHURCHES of this planet that are trying to CONTROL PEOPLE. Dude, I value your input and your heart. I value anyone who tries to treat people with respect. However, it's this point above that is the crux of why the churches are indeed controlling people. They are using fear. The fear of 'You're screwed because you are not perfect and YOU SIN!!"

Well, if that is why Jesus died then what happened after? Why is there still sin? Oh, I know, because we can still come to the lord through Jesus and let his blood (theoretically speaking) wash over us and rinse those sins away. But the sucky thing is that within a milisecond after this you are dirty again with sin because, according to the churches, we are impure beings that just happened to have been made in the image of God but HE CAN'T BE IMPURE! I mean, he's so powerful that he can't even be anywhere NEAR sin! HUH? Are you kidding me?

Seriously, please think about this people. THINK about the contradictions that are pushed on people.

I'll be honest, I know, like OT, THOUSANDS of religious people (indirectly of course through events and such). The vast majority are very nice people. But the one problem I have found with most of them is that they BUY THAT CRAP ABOVE!

THAT IS THE DEFINITION OF CONTROL!

Sorry for the caps. I'm trying to emphasise the points. It's important. I'm not attacking your faith. Just the illogic of some of the teachings. Because I fully believe that the message that Jesus brought is extremely important. It's just not quite what most are being taught today. Why? Because if his true message was indeed taught then people would realize there is NO NEED FOR CHURCH! Poof, there goes the income stream. Also, I have only come across a VERY FEW pastors, preachers (whatever you want to call them) that are not well off. Is it Gods will that they live in the nicest homes in their neighborhood, drive the latest and greatest luxury cars and on and on? Just asking because that is what I have experienced with the many churches (and religions) that I have attended and experienced.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 03:33 PM
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reply to post by dariousg
 


The worst part of it is when "religious leaders" try to justify something in the name of religion that goes completely against all the conventional teachings of that religion.
St Augustines concept of a "just war" that was consequently twisted by Popes Gregory and Urban which led to the Crusades to 'reclaim' Jerusalem from the Muslims.
Just take a look at some contemporary accounts of what Pope Urban said when he called the crusade at Clermont.

This from a religion that has "love thy neighbour" and "the good Samaritan" as one of its main teachings.

Of course, in the process of the crusade, the church made TONNES of money in the form of land bequethed to them by people who died on the crusades, land sold to them below market value so that people could afford the supplies needed to go on crusade and (more likely than not) a surge of money and goods from people who paid for indulgences as penitance for not going on the crusade (or indeed, not completing it for those who returned 'early')



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 03:47 PM
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WOW! Nice job guys. Hey, I just flew in, my hope is to respond to each of you t is weekend. Got my treo, lost stylus and using a blue plastic drink-stirer



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 03:51 PM
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1) Do you think faith/religion is here to control the masses?
2) Why?
3) Your evidence?
4) Did you once believe?
5) Did you change?
6) Why are you an atheist?
7) Why are you an agnostic?
8) Why you are a christian?
9) What ‘SHOULD‘ God look like/act like/be like?


[edit on 4-2-2009 by OldThinker]


1) yes
2)I believe that faith/religion is a darn helpfull tool to control society; on micro and macro scale.
-It bounds people it makes them feel connected with a group.
-They want to

I don't believe that evryone in religious positions has the intention to do evil, to control. It's the schizophrenia that leads to confusion.

Well first of all i think that religion should be a choice not something that has tought u since kindergarden. Kids, todlers take those stuff for thrue and don't have to minde to put religion in perspective.
Its easier to follow than to lead (herd instinct) as in the bible jezus is your sheppard and the believers are his sheeps (feels comfortable doens't it).


Religion

3)
- The wealth of churches somehow they know how to make expensive buildings on a christian message of "live austure".
The Roman church has big wealth.
-The christening of Clovis (europe), sources tell us that we was anything but a believer but he needed the blessing of the pope to get more support from the people.
-That relgion turn out to be very related to borders.
-Where is the ligne between a sect and a religion?
-Wars between relegions.
- The control of institutions entwines with power, wealth,... on religions.
-The Roman pope is against condoms, against homosexuality.
-The need to control on people on small stuf sex, cloathes, behaviour,... .
Nobody needs to be forced into stuff many christian institutions do very unchristian acts.

4)I believed as a toddler small child untill my 12 years cose all my friends believed and in class it was told a lot of stories about a righteous man.

5)yes

6) i only believe in the miracle of life and besides that i don't believe anything cose their needs to be a certain scepticism in societies
if a religion is rightious it should survive a little scepticism ;-)

7) don't understand the word

8)i am not ;
I pretent to be one because my grandmother would be dissapointed if i wasn't ; she is such a nice lady.

9)Well i would like it if he GOD would be me
i can create stuff doesn't that make me little GOD
i can destroy stuff/life does that make me satan?



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 03:55 PM
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reply to post by OldThinker
 


Normally, I'm quite aggressive with theists and other religious types, mainly due to my impatience for their nonsense and infantile behavior. However, OT, you come across as a reasonable person and an exception to my personal rule. Valid questions you have posed, however, I have one for you, for starters: What is the purpose of this line of questioning?



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 04:05 PM
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reply to post by observer28
 


I won't even presume to try to reply on OT's behalf but from my perspective it is clear that most people hold their beliefs, be it in a religion or anything else, very close. To hear different people share their core beliefs and to understand why they feel that way is they way to a more tolerant society. I'd say that is reason enough.

The trouble is, from a non-religious person's perspective, it is easy to be suspiscious of people asking you what you believe in if they are religious as they have a tendency to then try to make you believe in their religion. Or impose it's interpretation on your beliefs.

Give how those beliefs are so personal, this can be quite insulting. Wouldn't you agree?

Another way of looking at it is, why do you ask why OT asks?

[edit: removing any refences to gender assumptions!]

[edit on 6-2-2009 by CloudySkye]



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 05:05 PM
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Originally posted by OldThinker
1) Do you think faith/religion is here to control the masses?

I see faith as an individual perception, and as such can only be used to control one's self. I do think that organized religion does indeed exist to control the masses.

2) Why?

Why do I think this or why do they wish to control the masses? Assuming the latter, basically two reasons. The first being to make money without actually having to physically labor to get it. The second being self protection. Many more leaders, both religious and governmental, would have been killed by the masses if the masses didn't believe they would go to hell for killing them.

3) Your evidence?

My only evidence is my meager understanding of history and human nature.
Nothing that would stand up in court.

4) Did you once believe?

To the extent that I was raised Catholic and as a youngster just believed what I was told, yes. In the sense of ever feeling a "connection" with a supreme being and having faith in said power, no.

5) Did you change?

Yes. I no longer believe what I'm told.

6) Why are you an atheist?

I don't consider myself an atheist.

7) Why are you an agnostic?

I don't consider myself an agnostic, either, although that would be closer to an accurate label.

8) Why you are a christian?

I don't consider myself a christian, either.

9) What ‘SHOULD‘ God look like/act like/be like?

As I pretty much believe in a "thou art God" type philosophy, God looks like you, and me, and everyone else on the planet. The closest I have come, in my life, to looking on the face of God is when looking at a forest, or mountain, or ocean, while being aware of the power and beauty of that which I beheld. That is when I feel closest to any higher power that might be.

I generally don't post in religion-oriented threads, as I feel "faith" is a pretty personal thing and I find it difficult to put my thoughts on the subject into words that would mean anything to others, but since you seemed to be honestly curious I added my opinions, such as they are.

"Faith" and "religion" are also things I don't spend much time thinking about. I haven't ever felt much of a draw towards the spiritual or metaphysical side of life.

Whether this is a failing on my part or not, I guess only time will tell.



posted on Feb, 6 2009 @ 05:05 PM
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Oops..double click!


[edit on 6-2-2009 by subject x]




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