Originally posted by Revolution-2012
Listen buddy,

Yay! I'm a buddy! Where's my 'friend' request?

Originally posted by Revolution-2012
Before you go bashing the pharmecutical companies, why don't you bash peoples concious decisions.

Did I mention I work at a pharmaceutical company? Although I'm not in the pharmaceutical manufacturing division (I'm in drug testing kits), it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense for me to bash my company that I enjoy working for.

Originally posted by Revolution-2012
It is not mandatory for anyone to take any pill, even if it involves their life at stake.

If a doctor says, "If you don't take this, you'll die", would you take it? Seriously.

Originally posted by Revolution-2012
I hope you pray to your all knowing all giving eternal life bareing god.

I would, thanks buddy. In the end though, it's HIS will that I ask be done and why would I object to eternal life without illness and pain?

Regarding your addiction er...choice, sorry to hear about that and hope you come to realize the painful side-effects before they take place.

Those who often trust doctors and take medications typically don't expect side effects to occur to them since it's supposed to only happen to a small percentage of people. Like rolling two dice and hoping you don't get snake-eyes.

[edit on 4-2-2009 by saint4God]

Rev is right, if you don't want to take them, just don't take them.
Maybe Jesus is your antidepressant, but for a lot of people it's not realistic and harder to believe than the scientific fact that some people have chemical imbalances. Do you honestly think that people would even take antidepressants if they weren't helping? TONS of people have gone off of them, but lots and lots have stayed.

Honestly, go ahead and ask around. Many people close to me have tried to go off of antidepressants and had raging fits, crying spells, oversleeping, eating disorders, and honestly couldn't stay off of them, so they tried a different medication.

It's really not as easy as you think it is, and I ask everyone here who seems to doubt the realities of psychological disorders to find someone who suffers from one, ask them the history of their disorder, what medications they have been on, what worked, what didn't, if they tried to go off them, what are the symptoms. You will be blown away.

I'm not talking about "sad" people. Religion works for them. "Sad" people who have specific emotions due to events like losing a job or fighting with a partner, should not be on medication because that is perfectly normal behavior.

Abnormal behavior is defined as behavior which defies social norms, occurs in a minority of the population, causes disability or dysfunction, and personal distress.

That is the exact definition of a psychological disorder. If you don't have that, and aren't taking the medication for something else (AKA Wellbutrin to stop smoking, Prozac for migraines) then the medications will hurt you more than they help.

But if you have a legitimate problem that could cause harm to yourself or another and fits the definition of a psychological disorder, then medication is a PERFECTLY VIABLE OPTION for most people.

If you think otherwise then you are absolutely 100% wrong.

My son who is now 21 ....had problems every since he was 18 months old when he had a severe reaction to the DPT shot .......

I just dealt with it as best I could until he started school ..then of course we were sent to the MHMR from the first week of School ..(which I am thankful for that ) ...but for years he went on several (at least 100 different meds) and years and years of counseling etc .....finally he ended up in a mental institution at about 8 .....the meds made everything worse not better ...the mental hospital tried to find stuff that would work (which was why he was in there to regulate the meds etc) ......he spent 6 months in there ..to no avail ...then long story short his father took him out during our separation and took off with him for 4 years ....I did not even get to see him during that time but I know he was not on any meds etc ....well he got really bad (behaviourly ) and got in trouble with the law at about 12 ....so my ex called me and begged me for help ..so I did ....we took my son to my house and tried to help him get stable with us (me and my new hubby) ..at first he wanted to try without meds ...well it did not quite go well ..and my son to help himself started smoking pot at about 14 ......pot did help keep him calm instead of panicky (which is one of his main problems)..and even helped with his depression ..but as we all know it is illegal ....so I went to our personal Dr and asked him if there was any meds that comes even slightly close to doing what pot does for someone like my son ..And he told me about Risperdol ...
Mind you this was 100 different meds later ....

Well guess what..it was almost a life saving medication for my son ..It worked very well for him ....
Eventually though my son turned of age and wanted off meds and on his own ...wanted to make it in the real world and has done fairly well ...but he also went back to pot ...(which is still illegal ) .....well something happened and he is now on probation and has to do drug tests so cannot smoke the pot ....so he may have to go back on the Risperdol .....
Out of all the meds he was on...that one worked the best and had the least side effects (other than weight gain ) .....which he is naturally overweight anyway ...so that was a problem ..which is why they always try another med with it to keep you from gaining etc etc ....it is just a mess the way the medicine slippery slope can go ...

Personally I am a complete antimeds person (I always look for home remedy alternatives) .........and do not want my son on meds either ..but now he may have no other choice than to go back on them ..............
No home remedy worked for my child .....even finishing puberty he is still somewhat unstable .....but is trying his darndest to make it without the help of meds ...

Originally posted by Simplynoone
.....but is trying his darndest to make it without the help of meds ...

God bless him in his fight, I'll say a prayer as well. As mentioned before in life versus death or desparate situations, medicines can certainly be a good thing. For example, Anti-Eurythmia Drugs like Quinidine can certainly save someone's life.

My issue is how as a society we throw pills at any/every situation as a first resort instead of the last one. The greatest abuse I think is towards our children, but I also think doctors need to stand up to patients and say "No, you don't have sedentary lethargitis, no matter what you've read on webdoctor.com. I'm not writing you a script for buspirone hydrochloride just because you saw it on television". Nor are patients clinical trials for doctors when they don't know what's wrong.

[edit on 4-2-2009 by saint4God]

Thanks Saint I appreciate the prayers for sure ..that is all that has helped us both make it this far ....


As far as the Schools ....dont even get me started with them lol ..I have had to deal with them since kindergarden .....and that is with the special ed department ...which is supposed to be supportive of us parents and the kids ..Some were ..most were not ..My son was very fortunate (I give the thanks to God for this) that his school counselor had a close and personal relationship with my son and Me ...she even took us to all of the shrinks etc ......(I did not drive) ..and she always stood up for my son at School and oversaw everything they did or wanted to try etc .....and that really helped me and my son through many of the tough situations at school ...
She wasnt with him in High School and no one cared at all at the High School.They had no tolerance and no mercy and just wanted a well behaved child period ..which was almost impossible when the special ed teachers did not even like my son ....so we always went round and round ...
Until eventually he was kicked out so much we just took him out ..
And I did try to homeschool but by then he was almost an adult )(17 1/2)and old enough to leave home .so he did .....now he is just struggling along to make ends meet ..(as we all are) ........

I have met many many mothers who had kids though who were just bored in school and would act out .....or just being kids ...or ate too much sugar..etc who the Schools demanded they get on ADHD medicine when they certainly did not need it .....this is big business these days and I find it seriously messed up when a teacher and a Nurse from School decides that the kids that cant sit still need meds ....(they are not Shrinks but think they are) ...and they even go so far as threaten the parents with Social Services if they dont take them to Shrinks (Which are very expensive) and MHMR etc is really not help at all ..because they just put everyone on meds ..yak with you once a month and take blood tests (thats it ) ............really not much help there at all ..
Although we did take him to real Physcologist who charged 200.00 and hour and all he did was spend five minutes writing the scrips and sent us out ..(I was horrified how little they cared and how little they really wanted to do anything and what little interest they had in their patient ) .....................

My son did need the meds (just could not find any that worked for him) ...most of the kids that are on it do not need it .

And Antidepressants and alot of the ADHD meds are serious serious drugs that almost made my son go insane ...and certainly made him feel cold and non caring ..(he hated it and I hated it and demanded they take him off of them ) ................

I really wish they could come up with something that really does work without all of the side affects ....or allow pot to be legalized prescription only or something ...because it is a heck of alot better for him than all these chemicals on the market ............
He tried alcohol (thank God he hates the way it makes him feel)
He tried drugs (street drugs) (Thank God he hated the way that made him feel) ...
He is now trying without anything ..(and that is really really hard for someone like him who has a chemical imbalance along with his emotional problems from his father being mentally abusive to him ) .....

I dont know what else he can do ....
Prayer is all I can do ......and God is about the only one who can really help him ....now that he is an adult ...

He is also very stubborn and headstrong (which makes it even harder for anyone to help him ) ...

It can be a good thing because thats what has actually helped him get through his BS life he has had since childhood ....but it can also hurt him ...(because now he gets in trouble with the law) ..and I am afraid that if he goes to jail he will never be able to survive it ...............

Originally posted by Simplynoone

My son did need the meds (just could not find any that worked for him) ...most of the kids that are on it do not need it .

And Antidepressants and alot of the ADHD meds are serious serious drugs that almost made my son go insane ...and certainly made him feel cold and non caring ..(he hated it and I hated it and demanded they take him off of them ) ................

I really wish they could come up with something that really does work without all of the side affects ...

I'm not a doctor or anything, but I would seriously look at Wellbutrin/Bupropion. Very little side effects compared to other antidepressants in terms of energy, oversleeping, libido loss or sexual dysfunction, etc. I know that it works really well for some people and not for others. Trust me, it's so hard to keep going through medication after medication with no hope. If you want you can U2U me for more information.

The right medication is out there, it's just hard to find, and takes a lot of tries to get the right one and the right dosage.

There are so many really interesting points on this thread, so I will just address a couple. I work in this field, but I am currently on sabbatical while I research for my book.

1) Yes parents have the right to decide what medication they wish to put their children on, but having given birth to them they only attain guardianship over them, and legally these kids could take their parents to court if they feel they had acted in bad faith in electing to have them medicated once they attain majority.

2) Of course numerous students excel whilst on medication. Ritalin assists them in focussing on the task on hand. Never go to a dentist who is on Ritalin he will continue to work on that tooth until there is nothing left of it. It's one of those side effects that Ritalin has on the brain, the inability to disengage. College research ( at Ivy League colleges) has shown that a vast number of students are using Ritalin/Concerta/Aderal as a academic performance enhancer - without a presciption.

3) Anecdotal evidence is never scientific evidence because it frequently only assists the teller of the anecdote to prove their perception. When asking subjects for information a good researcher always has to ensure that he/she isn't simply measuring demand characteristics.

4) Psychology 101 despite the fact that it appears to be educational simply skims the surface of the various areas of psychopathology.

5) Lobotomies in the 40s and 50s were also considered to be really beneficial to the recipients and their families. And thousands were done including in the Kennedy family.

"In 1941, when Rosemary was 23, her father was told by her doctors that a cutting edge procedure would help calm her "mood swings that the family found difficult to handle at home". Joseph Kennedy gave permission for the procedure to be performed by Dr. Walter Freeman, the director of the laboratories at St. Elizabeths Hospital in Washington, D.C., together with his partner, James W. Watts, MD, from the University of Virginia. Watts performed his neurosurgical training at the Massachusetts General Hospital, and later he became the Chief of Neurosurgery at the George Washington University Hospital. Highly regarded, Dr. Watts later became the 91st president of the Medical Society of the District of Columbia. The procedure in question was a lobotomy."



[edit on 4-2-2009 by Mynaeris]

I am the parent of a child with Pervasive Developmental Disorder -an Autism Spectrum Disorder. I also have bipolar disorder and am very familiar with atypical antipsychotics. I could NEVER imagine my son's physician or psychiatrist using Risperdal in an off-label manner to "help" my son. A few points have been previously made that our society has more to do with influencing our children's behavior and I agree. Before my son was diagnosed, both my wife and I worked and our kids were either in school or daycare. Their behavior reflected this fact - no one paid any individual attention to them or to their needs during the day and at night, my wife and I were to focused on feeding them and preparing for the next day (or paying the bills, or finding time to relax, or whatever). It's become the norm for many families today. After my son was diagnosed, I left work to stay at home with him. I volunteer in his school and we spend many hours together indoors and out so he can have one on one time with an adult. It's changed his behavior 180 degrees. He's no longer irritable and he's making progress working through his disability to improve his functionality every day. What I find disturbing is the fact that we've devolved into a society where caring for the "next generation" has become so difficult because a dual income family is virtually a requirement to survive (and of course I won't even comment on the social context or impact of single parent families and the difficulties they face). Most of these kids don't need anti-psychotics, they need Moms and Dads with time enough to be parents for them.

Edit to correct the username.

[edit on 4-2-2009 by MemoryShock]