reply to post by Cythraul
Huh... fascinating line of thinking. I have never been given over to the whole reincarnation idea until recently (mostly, because I was raised as it
was "taboo" to believe such "nonsense."
I subscribe to the Wisdom of the Tanakh and amazingly, what most see as a physical resurrection (in which they translate that over to the NT as such)
resognates in my "ears" of being the birth of the soul after the spirit has gone through reincarnations.
Where I differ in thinking is that it is not the soul that is reincarnated.. the spirits have been gaining the experiences of lifetimes. The End is
meant to be a time of travail to birth the souls... some will be born in Wisdom/Understaning... and other will born of pride and contempt. A soul is
the finished product (whether that finished product is good or evil is determined by the person's spirit and their incubation period).. thus, the
So, this is the womb... earth.
When a woman is giving birth, the contractions are what causes the baby to be born... thus, we are in the birthing process even now...
Isaiah 53: 11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many...
2And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. (the wheat
vs. the chaffe)
3And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
32And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.
33And they that understand among the people shall instruct many...
And in the following it declares that yes, there is most definitely more to be born of this "generation" (meaning there have been generations before
us.. but don't think generation in the single lifetime veiw.. think lifetimeS concept).
Isaiah 54 (this is after the Suffering servant chapter.. the birthing process of those whose face is toward G.d):
1Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children
of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith the LORD.
2Enlarge the place of thy tent, and let them stretch forth the curtains of thine habitations: spare not, lengthen thy cords, and strengthen thy
3For thou shalt break forth on the right hand and on the left; and thy seed shall inherit the Gentiles, and make the desolate cities to be inhabited.
4Fear not; for thou shalt not be ashamed: neither be thou confounded; for thou shalt not be put to shame: for thou shalt forget the shame of thy
youth, and shalt not remember the reproach of thy widowhood any more.
5For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be
6For the LORD hath called thee as a woman forsaken and grieved in spirit, and a wife of youth, when thou wast refused, saith thy God.
7For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee.
8In a little wrath I hid my face from thee for a moment; but with everlasting kindness will I have mercy on thee, saith the LORD thy Redeemer.
11O thou afflicted, tossed with tempest, and not comforted, behold, I will lay thy stones with fair colours, and lay thy foundations with sapphires.
12And I will make thy windows of agates, and thy gates of carbuncles, and all thy borders of pleasant stones.
13And all thy children shall be taught of the LORD; and great shall be the peace of thy children.
14In righteousness shalt thou be established: thou shalt be far from oppression; for thou shalt not fear: and from terror; for it shall not come near
15Behold, they shall surely gather together, but not by me: whosoever shall gather together against thee shall fall for thy sake.
16Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the
waster to destroy.
17No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; and every tongue that shall rise against thee in judgment thou shalt condemn. This is the
heritage of the servants of the LORD, and their righteousness is of me, saith the LORD.
See, most see the G.d of the Tanakh to be an awful and hateful G.d and that really has more to do with the contempt they have been building within
their own spirit all this time and thus, they will be birthing a soul that is set against the Creator... who *is* good and just asked that we trust
the process. Personally, I see great Love and Wisdom.
The whole of the Tanakh is speaking of this. Isaiah says over and over that the LORD did not speak this in secret and that it has all been declared
from the beginning to the end... that all the things spoken of from the foundation are being created now.
Most just choose to judge it rather
than facing it.. because in facing the Word, you will come to see exactly what is happening... and when you can see what is happening and how it will
play out, you see there is nothing to fear at all.
(and nothing to question.. which is why He said seek His knowledge and He will give
3I have declared the former things from the beginning; and they went forth out of my mouth, and I shewed them; I did them suddenly, and they came to
4Because I knew that thou art obstinate, and thy neck is an iron sinew, and thy brow brass;
5I have even from the beginning declared it to thee; before it came to pass I shewed it thee: lest thou shouldest say, Mine idol hath done them, and
my graven image, and my molten image, hath commanded them.
6Thou hast heard, see all this; and will not ye declare it? I have shewed thee new things from this time, even hidden things, and thou didst not know
7They are created now, and not from the beginning; even before the day when thou heardest them not; lest thou shouldest say, Behold, I knew them.
9Woe unto him that striveth with his Maker! Let the potsherd strive with the potsherds of the earth. Shall the clay say to him that fashioneth it,
What makest thou? or thy work, He hath no hands?
10Woe unto him that saith unto his father, What begettest thou? or to the woman, What hast thou brought forth?
11Thus saith the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands
command ye me.
12I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.
13I have raised him up in righteousness, and I will direct all his ways: he shall build my city, and he shall let go my captives, not for price nor
reward, saith the LORD of hosts.
18For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain,
he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else.
19I have not spoken in secret, in a dark place of the earth: I said not unto the seed of Jacob, Seek ye me in vain: I the LORD speak righteousness, I
declare things that are right.
20Assemble yourselves and come; draw near together, ye that are escaped of the nations: they have no knowledge that set up the wood of their graven
image, and pray unto a god that cannot save.
21Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have
not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.
22Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
23I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue
Anyway, since you were so curious, just thought I would share what is obviously going on. There is a great many things to confirm that yes, we have
been reincarnated spirits and that this is the birthing process for the soul.
I think the first thing that struck me that this is what is spoken of in the Tanakh (the incubation period of the spirits and the birth of the souls)
was when I came across a passage in one of the testimonies that talked about Joshua being brought forth as a spirit and the ones who brought him forth
were told to change his blood stained white garments to those of fresh clean linens... and the allegory was so completely clear concerning what it was
Though I had wondered, that was the light bulb for me and that is when I came to see the whole of the Tanakh as an allegory... though I read it now as
the True Word that it is. Hope you don't mind if I shared my view on it with you. the Tanakh is quite beautiful and very telling if, again, people
would quit being fearful, angry, or dogmatic about it.
[edit on 3-2-2009 by justamomma]