Crew welds 200 plates to Building for 3 months "almost unknown"

Originally posted by Griff

I'm not the one saying that a loss of structural support to 1 story would cause a complete global collapse. That would be you and NIST.

You did at one time though.

At one time you proposed thermite on floors below the impact levels that would take out the bracing floor beams in the core, resulting in long unbraced lengths, resulting in buckling.

What has convinced you otherwise?

Have you refuted Bazant's work and have remained silent about it?

Originally posted by Seymour Butz
Why do people think that making their fantasies about 9/11 MORE complicated also makes them more probable.

Because the simple explanation we are told just doesn't cut it IMO.

Why doesn't the simple explanation make sense to the TM?

I'm all for the simple explanation if they can reproduce their hypothesis. Until then, it is just speculation like the rest of us.

Originally posted by Griff

Because the simple explanation we are told just doesn't cut it IMO.

What part would that be?

Let's limit it to the towers.

I'd be interested in exactly WHAT doesn't cut it.

ETA: oops, after seeing the above, maybe it's better to move this to the recent Bazant thread?

[edit on 6-2-2009 by Seymour Butz]

reply to post by Seymour Butz

Since my post was "off topic", I'll try again.

At one time, you also thought that the only fireproofing was either spray-on or drywall. When I have shown you incorrect.

I wasn't aware that my speculations were held in such high regard by you.

Thanks.

Originally posted by Griff

I wasn't aware that my speculations were held in such high regard by you.

Thanks.

I don't.

But since speculation is all the TM has, what else is there to debate?

Care to move this to the recent Bazant thread?

reply to post by Klemperer


Buildings do NOT collapse onto their own footprint from structural flaws. Do some homework sheeple

Originally posted by Griff
Originally posted by jfj123
Yes, I'm saying that if one person signed to have explosives installed in the 3 WTC's, the people installing said explosives would know they were installing explosives thus requiring that we add them to the supposed conspiracy.

What if those workers were fanatical Muslims? Would they still be (in your eyes) "added to the conspiracy"? Or would they be "part of the terror plot"?

You assume that this was accomplished by Americans with no other ties to any other countries. I can state that I don't believe any American would do this either. Too bad the world isn't made up of Americans.

Something else to think about. If a group of arab men, pretending to be workmen, came into the building and were rigging the buildings prior to the attacks, why wouldn't anyone remember?
Before you jump on my case, please continue reading.

OK we all know that arab Americans have had it harder since 9/11 due to profiling, etc...
Most people were and some are, very sensitive when they see an arabic man doing anything as they immediately think possible terrorist.
That being said, wouldn't someone have thought, "oh my god, I saw a bunch of arab men working in the towers" before they blew up.
Wouldn't someone have put 2 and 2 together?
Wouldn't arab men have stood out like a sore thumb?
I mean we have had entire plane flights grounded because a few passengers didn't like the way some arab guy walked to the bathroom.

[edit on 6-2-2009 by jfj123]

Originally posted by _BoneZ_

Originally posted by Seymour Butz
And oh yeah, would these be the hush-a-boom explosives again?

There were no "hush-a-boom" explosives. There were loud, powerful explosives that were heard clearly 2 miles away in Hoboken. Check out a video called 9/11 Eyewitness. The author of the video may be a loon, but the video itself is an excellent piece of evidence.

Oh I don't know, what would a kazilion tons sound like snapping off and falling again and again.

At any rate yes the government if the really wanted to could have planted exsplosives at any time. No question.

You still haven't presented any solid proof yet.

Its also hard to believe that anything could get by John P. O'Neill.

If you are interested

....search John P. O'Neill Twin towers goggle.

Originally posted by jfj123
OK we all know that arab Americans have had it harder since 9/11 due to profiling, etc...
Most people were and some are, very sensitive when they see an arabic man doing anything as they immediately think possible terrorist.
That being said, wouldn't someone have thought, "oh my god, I saw a bunch of arab men working in the towers" before they blew up.
Wouldn't someone have put 2 and 2 together?
Wouldn't arab men have stood out like a sore thumb?
I mean we have had entire plane flights grounded because a few passengers didn't like the way some arab guy walked to the bathroom.

Do you mean like Sahkar "Rocky" Hammad? That doesn't sound like an american name to me? And don't tell me Israelis don't look middle eastern either. So, why didn't anyone remember "Rocky"?

I'm pretty much done in this thread.

Like I said. From personal experience, I have come to the conclusion that it wouldn't be as hard as we are led to believe. That's my opinion and I'm probably not going to change since this was in the past and any new security measures taken can't be taken into consideration post-2001.

reply to post by detachedindividual


Good to see the comments on how Israeli is such a detriment to safety of Americans. It may seem overly simplistic at this point but our steps toward a safer America begin with removing our alignment with Israel and leaving them to contend with their own bad behavior.

The reality is that Israel CAN, HAS, and WILL AGAIN material aid terrorists with information or other assets that assist them IF the ENDGAME results in the U.S. supporting ISRAEL to a common struggle.

EXPECT A TERRORIST ATTACK ON THE U.S. to be linked to IRAN in 2009 ?

WHY?

Because we refused to go to war with Iran in 2008. Israel needed us to take on Iran. Soon they will have crude nuclear weapons system with launch vehicles ready and Israel is terrified of that day. The fight may well be too big for them now.

WHAT CAN ISRAEL DO?

ANSWER:

Israel has Mossad agents covertly lend support to terror groups such than they can KILL AMERICANS and DESTROY AMERICAN ASSETS in a manner than can be LINKED TO IRAN.

Then the U.S. can and must war with IRAN. IRAN's nuclear program then become a profound and real threat to America and America must do Israel's dirty work.

So if a terrorist attack occurs in 2009 and is linked to IRAN. Be sure that ISRAEL played some role is insuring that it occured whether by their own hands or the support of others or handy Intel supporting the IRANIAN connection.

ISRAEL HAS NO CHOICE BUT TO SUPPORT TERRORIST ACTION AGAINST THE U.S. IN ORDER TO TRICK THE U.S. INTO BLANKET SUPPORT IN ORDER TO SURVIVE.

This is what I talk about a lot in the Sheepchronicles.com website.

Originally posted by Griff

Originally posted by jfj123
OK we all know that arab Americans have had it harder since 9/11 due to profiling, etc...
Most people were and some are, very sensitive when they see an arabic man doing anything as they immediately think possible terrorist.
That being said, wouldn't someone have thought, "oh my god, I saw a bunch of arab men working in the towers" before they blew up.
Wouldn't someone have put 2 and 2 together?
Wouldn't arab men have stood out like a sore thumb?
I mean we have had entire plane flights grounded because a few passengers didn't like the way some arab guy walked to the bathroom.

Do you mean like Sahkar "Rocky" Hammad? That doesn't sound like an american name to me? And don't tell me Israelis don't look middle eastern either. So, why didn't anyone remember "Rocky"?

You mentioned 1 person.
There's a huge difference between one person and an entire team of arab men.

Originally posted by jfj123
You mentioned 1 person.
There's a huge difference between one person and an entire team of arab men.

Are you implying that "Rocky" was the only one? Why not call Denko Mechanical and find out? Oops, that's right, you can't as they high-tailed it out of the country shortly after 9/11.

In a Memphis court on 3/28, Rocky's father, a NY City engineer, Mr. Peter Hansen (immigrated 15 years ago from Jordan), presented the court with a letter from Denko Mechanical, Ltd, signed by a Mr. Sergei Denko, stating that Rocky and Rocky's cousin had been doing work for his company in the basement and garage of the WTC on Sept 5 and 6. Rocky was released on $250,000 bail. The nature of the work was not specified.

The Port Authority of New York claimed no knowledge of hiring a Denko Mechanical and said Denko must have been hired by a tenant.

whatreallyhappened.com...

Seems there was more than one person involved in this. At least "Rocky"'s cousin was in the WTC on 9/5 & 6 also. That makes a team.

Edit: Is $250,000 a normal bail for having a fake driver's license? I doubt it personally. When I was in college, a bunch of my friends got into trouble because they bought fake id's from a guy who was under surveillance. Anyway, I guarantee they did no jail time (not even brought into a jailhouse) nor did they even have to pay a fine. The feds made them all send in the fakes and they called it even.

Just something to think about.

[edit on 2/7/2009 by Griff]

reply to post by Griff


Which once again leads me to my point.
It's highly doubtful that NOBODY would remember a group of arab men working as contractors prior to 9/11.

Think about it.

Think about how sensitive everyone was after 9/11 about ANY arab. People overreacting in major ways just because someone LOOKED arab.
And nobody thought back and made a connection?

Doesn't seem likely.

Here's a test for you. Put 4 arab men on a plane and have them get up and move around the cabin while the plane is in flight and see what people think and remember about them.

Originally posted by jfj123
reply to post by Griff

 

Which once again leads me to my point.
It's highly doubtful that NOBODY would remember a group of arab men working as contractors prior to 9/11.

Think about it.

No. You think about it. The only reason we know of Rocky and his cousin isn't because they had a wtc pass and people saw them there and reported them after the fact. It was because Rocky got caught with a fake Tennessee driver's license and then it was discovered that he had a wtc pass.

Think about how sensitive everyone was after 9/11 about ANY arab. People overreacting in major ways just because someone LOOKED arab.
And nobody thought back and made a connection?

My point is: Did they about Rocky and his cousin? That would be a big resounding NO.

Here's a test for you. Put 4 arab men on a plane and have them get up and move around the cabin while the plane is in flight and see what people think and remember about them.

Yes, post-9/11 would be a great indicator.

Edit to lighten the mood: That totally reminds me of "Harold and Kumar Escape Guantanimo".

[edit on 2/7/2009 by Griff]

[edit on 2/7/2009 by Griff]

Originally posted by Griff
Originally posted by jfj123
reply to post by Griff

 

Which once again leads me to my point.
It's highly doubtful that NOBODY would remember a group of arab men working as contractors prior to 9/11.

Think about it.

No. You think about it. The only reason we know of Rocky and his cousin isn't because they had a wtc pass and people saw them there and reported them after the fact. It was because Rocky got caught with a fake Tennessee driver's license and then it was discovered that he had a wtc pass.

Again big difference between one person and an entire crew of people. Unless of course you think 1 person rigged all 3 buildings all by himself? or maybe with the help of a cousin?





[edit on 7-2-2009 by jfj123]

Originally posted by jfj123
Again big difference between one person and an entire crew of people. Unless of course you think 1 person rigged all 3 buildings all by himself? or maybe with the help of a cousin?

Maybe that wasn't their job? Maybe their job was to make sure the elevators became in-operable? Or the sprinklers?

Point is: It's an example of middle eastern looking men having access to the towers and no one remembers them. You can argue with it all you want, but there it is.

Originally posted by Griff

Originally posted by jfj123
Again big difference between one person and an entire crew of people. Unless of course you think 1 person rigged all 3 buildings all by himself? or maybe with the help of a cousin?

Maybe that wasn't their job? Maybe their job was to make sure the elevators became in-operable? Or the sprinklers?

Point is: It's an example of middle eastern looking men having access to the towers and no one remembers them. You can argue with it all you want, but there it is.

But wait, here's what you posted earlier

We know they were well backed with money. So, what's to say that the muslim extremists didn't set up a fake company on a total floor of the towers and hire a muslim extremist construction team to plant explosives?

So 1 page back, you were thinking a "TEAM" of "MUSLIM EXTREMISTS" were responsible.

Now you're saying that non-muslims must have rigged the buildings.

So which is it? Are you wrong in this post or the other one? OOPS Your bad???

And once again, big difference between 1 person and an entire team of muslim extremists.



[edit on 7-2-2009 by jfj123]

reply to post by jfj123


I don't understand why you are combining the two unrelated scenarios?

Other than to troll bait. As such, good day and good bye.