Is it time to ditch the bible?

This sophomorish issue seems to come up every two or three years, with the same result each time.

Some want to read the Bible and some don't.

Some find nothing but bad news in the Bible, and others find different levels of good news.

Some are gravely offended by some passages or books, and others are not.

Some believe and some don't.

It's all fine by me. I could care less if you are Christian, Jew, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Taoist, Wiccan, or Earth Worshiper. But whatever you are, be a good one and live up to the tenets of your particular religion, or lack of one. In 1970, in a place called Viet Nam, I shared a foxhole with a man who professed to be an athesist. He was shot. His last words were, "Oh my God!". He wasn't an athesist. He was a hypocrite.

reply to post by Thistled

I do agree with you on this one. The Bible should be ditched. I've seen my fair share of the BS that stems from the weak minded sheeple zombies born of this book. All the sects are controlled by the Roman Catholic Church, no matter how you wanna cut it. They control our actions on a daily bases. They don't pay tax. They stop our advancements in the world of science. They force themselves on us by knocking on our doors at 6am on the weekend and ask "Do you believe in God?". I normally tell them I'm a Devil worshiper. Hehe..
Simply put, the book is bull#. Jesus was not the son of God. Jesus was of the Sun God. He obtained the title from the temple which he studied at. He was not nailed to any cross at all. He went to southern France to further his studies.
Like I said. The book is bull#. I say this because the weak minded missed the point of the book entirely. The 10 commandments means one thing. Respect. Sheeple don't have that. Not even for themselves. Sure as #, not the waist of human flesh thumping the bible every Sunday to the sheeple while playing with little boys. Yeah, OK, preach a little more abstinence there pal. The rest of the book was meant to teach people to have faith. Faith in themselves. So they can go forth, be fruitful and multiply. But NO!!! Sheeple would rather be told what to do. God will save you! For twenty bucks. Yeah...Right....
I got news for all you bible thumping freaks out there. We're here to explore this realm and bring back a full report of our time in the material plain. You don't start fill that void you call a spirit, there will be no Heaven nor Hell. You will just cease to exist. There's no place for nothingness in the spectrum. So go ahead, keep living under a rock or in a cave. What ever you per fur.
The church has more than earned my ire with the endless wars and the continuous claims of religious persecution. All of it in the name of profit as the bodies are being stacked higher than that of the pearly gates. I for one have had enough of all your laws telling me how I can live my life and what knowledge I can or can't obtain. I hope this level of resentment towards the church continues to grow as the world starts to grow a brain.
Down with the Vatican.

Yes, the god of the OT is cruel! This is what I wrote in a much earlier post then as "Anonymous"):

Reply to various posts about the Israeeli-Palestinian conflict starting ages ago:
Yes, it did! It started when the people came from Egypt to the "Promised Land" and committed a veritable holocaust on various peoples who were already living there!

When they finally came to the Promised Land, people were living there in various towns. Yahweh ordered the Hebrews to slaughter them all and not spare even an old man, a woman or a child – so that they would have, “…houses full of all good things, which thou filledst not, and wells digged, which thou diggedst not, vineyards and olive trees, which thou plantedst not”.
(Deut. 6,11)

And there is much much more:
A choice of the many cruelties in the Old Testament: Gen.: 34,25-29; Ex.: 12,12; 12,29-30; 15,3; 32,26-28; Lev.: 26,7-8; 26,21-22; 26,26-29; Num.: 15,32-36; 16,29-35; 16,46-49; 21,3-6; 21,24-25; 21,33-35; 31,7-10; 31,14-18; 31,31-32; 31,35; Deut: 2,32-34;. 3,1-6; 7,2-3; 9,35 13,9-10; 13,14-16; 20,10-17; 21,11-14; Joshua: 6,20-25; 8,2; 8,21-25; 8,29; 10,10-11; 10,17-40; 11,6-22 ; Judges: 1,4-11; 1,17; 1,25; 3,29-31; 4,14-16; 7,15-25; 8,17; 9,4-5; 9,43-45; 9,49-52; 11,30-40; 15,15-16; 18,27; 19,22-29; 20,2; 20,31-37; 20,41-48; 1 Samuel: 5,8-9; 6,19; 11,6-11; 15,3-9; 15,33; 18,7; 30,17; 2 Samuel: 5,8; 5,25; 8,1-5; 10,18; 12,31; 18,6-7; 24,10-16; 1 Kings: 20,28-30; 2 Kings: 1,9-14; 2,23-25; 5,25-27; 6,18; 10,13-25; 14,5-7; 15,16; 19,35; 1 Chron.: 20,2-3; Psalms: 137,9; Iesaiah: 13,15-18; 45,5-7; 49,25-26; Jeremiah 16,3-5; Lament.: 4,9-11; Ezekiel: 6,12-13; 9,3-6; Hosea: 13,15; 14,1.

So it is time to question if the cruel and blood-thirsty Yahweh is really the loving and just "Father" who Jesus talked about. Or another ...

Compare this: www.bibliotecapleyades.net...

Once again the bible like all holy books was not written for the believer but the unbeliever.

Holy things are received by revelation, specifically word of knowledge, word of wisdom, and discerning of spirits.

Since spiritual means are employed in the process of making a holy work, spiritual means must be utilized to gain understand from it.

Unbelievers telling unbelievers what to think about holy works like bible or Koran.

The blind really do lead the blind.

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Today's installment from: WIG'N
"What Is God Network" WIG'N out on the things of God.

WIG'N 22: Pretending
Link: /d9b7cw

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The real issue with god, the bible, religion, is that people on the whole are looking for something to believe in and hope for. Save themselves??? from what??? My opinion is that it snake oil being sold for thousand of years by men who are looking for profit.

The Sunday morning evangelist, Ku Klux Klan, Al Qaeda, Hitler, Crusades, Genocide in Africa,..........................Oh yeah, free will!!! Well it seems that "god" is supposed to be some sort of 'father"!!! Some parent!!!

I do not believe in a supreme being because it is illogical to me. If there was a "god", he should be fired!!! Look at all the death and ddddestruction cause in the name of the lord!!!

reply to post by newday



And the world is 6000 years old
We were spit out by Jesus's daddy-kins
Fossils were buried by the jews in 1850 to throw us off track
And Jesus was a white guy

So I take it that you believe it was right to "holocaust" the previous inhabitants of the "promised land" and slaughter them up to even the last child?

And to commit all the very many other cruelties written "black on white" in the OT?

Well, as they say: Belief makes blind… and it will need someone who sees better to lead him…

Unholy things revealed, words of knowledge about evil deeds, words of lack of wisdom and dis-discernment of good spirits. Spiritual means involved in all these many bloody pages of the OT must be dark.

Here the blind really do lead the blind…

Compare this to the light and love on the pages of the NT. Jesus’ "Father" just cannot be Yahweh!
He will be a prime creator higher than Yahweh who also created the latter, and then the latter took power over humans.

Jesus was white? Maybe not completely, since he was from the Middle East. But what does that really matter! He taught us himself that it makes no difference at all if white, black, yellow or mixed! And that discrimination is a big sin…

reply to post by memyself

Jesus was white? Maybe not completely, since he was from the Middle East. But what does that really matter! He taught us himself that it makes no difference at all if white, black, yellow or mixed! And that discrimination is a big sin…

It actually matters a whole lot. How many statues or paintings or pictures representing Christ or any of the saints do you see decked out as a Black person? This unjustified practice FEEDS racism. Not every communication is verbal or written. And the best we can do is aver “maybe [Jesus was] not completely” [white] but he must have been MOSTLY white? I mean after all, GOD is white isn't he? Why wouldn’t his SON be white? Sure, maybe with a good suntan from all that sunshine in Palestine?

I am glad to see the color GREEN was not mentioned as so many white people like to thrown in GREEN or PURPLE or PINK as more proof when declaring their own lack of color based prejudice. Which is a dead giveaway code word! It's like people who say I love blacks but I hate affirmative action.

I don’t know exactly what Jesus taught about anything, really. There are over 11,000 IRS 501(c)(3) certificates issued to non-profit churches, synagogues, mosques, and others. I’d say there is a Tower of Babel when it comes to what the Bible says about anything. Accepting they are all honest people who want to see it their way.

Nowadays it seems most Christians want it to look as if their ancestors were just good ole boys. February 12 celebrates Abraham Lincoln’s 200th birthday. Slavery was LEGAL in America until it was ended with the 13th Amendment to our Founding Document which FULLY embraced slavery until then. Not a proud start, if anyone asks me.

Then the Southern Whites rampaged and terrorized every black person south of the Mason Dixon Line. Records reveal more than 4,200 blacks were lynched, including a few women and at least one who was pregnant. 15,000 blacks were beaten so severely they never regained their health. 50,000 black homesteads were burned out. All of this with the APPROVAL of the Federal Government and in fact, the infamous case of Plessey v. Ferguson made Jim Crow legal. NOT overruled until Brown v. Topeka in 1954! Young white Christians want to play like none of that ever happened. To ignore the past. But the after effects are with us still. In one word it is POVERTY and it is borne by far in disproportional to numbers by black people.

This is what makes white protestations of innocence ring hollow!


[edit on 2/7/2009 by donwhite]

Dear you! What makes you believe that God is white? He will have both no color and all colors…
Jesus did teach us that we are all equal - black, white, or if you really want: purple… - and that what you do to others, you do unto Him and that it will also be done unto you. Racial discrimination is, therefore, a sin and done unto him. In a way, to the white He is black and to the Black he is white!

So very clearly: Who discriminates people is by mere definition not a Christian! Those who did all that to the Southern Blacks - or any Blacks - by definition definitely ARE/WERE NOT CHRISTIANS!

It actually matters a whole lot. How many statues or paintings or pictures representing Christ or any of the saints do you see decked out as Black people? This FEEDS racism. Not every communication is verbal or written. And the best we can do is aver “maybe not completely” but he must have been MOSTLY white? I mean after all, GOD is white, why wouldn’t his SON be white? Maybe with a good suntan from all that sunshine in Palestine?

"The Ethiops say that their gods are flat-nosed and black,
While the Thracians say that theirs have blue eyes and red hair.
Yet if cattle or horses or lions had hands and could draw,

And could sculpture like men, then the horses would draw their gods
Like horses, and cattle like cattle; and each they would shape
Bodies of gods in the likeness, each kind, of their own." -Xenophanes

Could the answer simply be that God is created in the image of the creator? White people create the image of God and Jesus as white, as they are their own creations/imaginings.* And due to the white west's colonisation / imperialisation /subjugation, or whatever you wish to view it as, of the rest of the world, we so impose our views and beliefs about Jesus and God upon them. It is a given, to the white person, that God is white, and as such we expect it to be a given around the world.

As much as I agree with much of your post the line:
"This is what makes white protestations of innocence ring hollow!"
-simply smacks of yet more ignorance and sweeping generalisations. All white people's protestations of innocence against the injustices perpetrated by the few OR the majority are hollow? So all white people are implicated in the crimes of either our past or our peers?

*This is not to say that God and/or Jesus did not exist, but more that we create an image or ideal of them from our own image/ideal

[edit on 7-2-2009 by ElKapitan]

[edit on 7-2-2009 by ElKapitan]

Ditch the Bible? No way. I'm not giving up my favorite quote:

"Better is the wickedness of a man than a woman who does good; it is woman who brings shame and disgrace." -- Sirach 42.14

...so many flame wars.


Honestly, I think "God" is the container of all life in the universe.

I mean, Just look outside your window...

Who wants to be caught in the middle of a flame war on ATS when there is life out there to be lived?

We shouldn't ditch it in the literal sense. It is an ancient text that is quite important to history. It should be further studied so we can understand more about the people from this time and perhaps one day, figure out the real purpose behind it being written.

But ditch it in the sense of not using it as a guideline to live our lives by - absolutely.

We live in the 21st century. This is the modern age where science & technology flourishes and aids our understanding of the cosmos and its mysteries. I find it difficult to grasp the fact that so many people still believe these texts. When you read the Bible, you can see it was clearly geared towards a primitive civilization with very little understanding of the world, and moral concepts that mirror those of an ethically undeveloped society. It is irrational to use such an outdated belief system for the era we live in.

So perhaps it is time to ditch the Bible and embrace science as a more efficient way of understanding our world and the universe. Ironically enough, not nearly enough people understand basic concepts of science & technology.

"We live in a society exquisitely dependent on science and technology, in which hardly anyone knows anything about science and technology. ~Carl Sagan"



[edit on 7-2-2009 by GeeGee]

[edit on 7-2-2009 by GeeGee]

Originally posted by jpm06002
without the bible there is no hope

also it would be nice if you quoted the passages where it says such things since those quotes are essentially your whole argument.

There are so many offensive and evil passages in the Bible, it can take years of study just to go through them all.

In the New Testament we have Luke 14:26 which says you must hate your mother, father, brothers and sisters. It does not say 'love less' It is very clear on this point. The Greek word Miseo means 'hate loathe and detest'. Love Less would have been 'Agapa Ligotera'.

God’s Commandments
Anyone who goes uncircumcised is to be exiled from his people (Genesis 17:14).
If a man has sex with a menstruating women, both are to be exiled (Leviticus 20:18).
A man who marries a mother and daughter must burn in a fire (Leviticus 20:14).
If two men have sexual relations, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:13).
If a mother and son have sexual relations, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:11).
If a man and daughter-in-law have sex, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:12).
If a man has sex with an animal, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:15).
If a woman has sex with an animal, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:16).
Anyone who attacks his mother or father must be put to death (Exodus 21:15).
Anyone who curses his mother or father must be put to death (Leviticus 20:9).
Anyone who commits murder shall be put to death (Leviticus 24:17).
Anyone who commits adultery shall be put to death (Deuteronomy 22:22).
Anyone who commits perjury shall be put to death (Deuteronomy 19:18-19).
Anyone who commits kidnapping must be put to death (Exodus 21:16).
Anyone who disobeys a judge or priest must be put to death (Deuteronomy 17:12).
Anyone who disgraces the Sabbath must be put to death (Exodus 31:14).
Anyone who works on the Sabbath must be put to death (Exodus 35:2).
Anyone who does not worship God must be put to death (2 Chronicles 15:13).
Any strangers approaching a sanctuary must be put to death (Numbers 17:7).
Any prophet who tries to turn you against God must be put to death (Deuteronomy 13:5).
Any prophet who makes a wrong prediction must be put to death (Deuteronomy 18:20-22).
Family members who tempt you with other gods must be put to death (Deuteronomy 13:1-5).
If an ox gores someone, the ox and its owner must be stoned to death (Exodus 21:29).
Anyone who claims to talk with spirits must be stoned to death (Leviticus 20:27).
A stubborn and rebellious son must be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 21:18-21).
Any woman who has had premarital sex must be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 22:21).
Anyone who worships another god must be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 17:2-7).
Anyone who curses or blasphemes must be stoned to death (Leviticus 24:14-16).
Break the neck of your donkey's firstborn or kill a lamb instead (Exodus 34:20).
If a city worships other gods, kill everyone in it and burn it (Deuteronomy 13:12-16).

For more detail on the evil Bible God See - wheresjesus.multiply.com...

There are many other indicators in the Bible that show that God to be Evil and which are completely missed or deliberately overlooked by those who don't want to see.

For instance the Bible shows us that its God is DEMONIC.

1 John 4:2 Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God and every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God.

Matthew 8:29 And behold they cried out saying, ‘What have we to do with thee Jesus thou Son of God? Art thou come hither to torment us before the time?

In Matthew the Demons accept Jesus to be the Son of God. In 1 John we are told that such spirits are OF GOD. Therefore God has to be a Demon.

reply to post by Malankhkare


Well the verse in John is just telling you that if you do not believe Jesus is from God then you are not a follower of God.

The Mathew verse is from people who didn't want to change their ways and thus to them Jesus was tormenting them. You just did exactly what the people inyour opening statement does.

reply to post by Malankhkare


People need to stop going back to the old testement to show the "Evil God" after the sacrifice of Jesus forgiveness of sin was possible. In the old testement that forgiveness wasn't there.


[edit on 7-2-2009 by Ant4AU]

[edit on 7-2-2009 by Ant4AU]

The Bible God often gets very nasty and this must be one of the worst things she does when not killing or ordering executions:

Samuel-1 5:9 And it was [so], that, after they had carried it about, the hand of the LORD was against the city with a very great destruction: and he smote the men of the city, both small and great, and they had emerods in their secret parts.

reply to post by donwhite


To say that the image of Jesus fuels racism, makes no sense. Does the image of Obama's hope picture fuel racism? No, only people who look for racism and have a warped sense of reality find it in that picture. If anything evolution fuels racism. Hitler used evolution to justify the killing of the jews, The presidents used it to show that the Indians were inferior and the slave owners used it to show that they were more evolved than there slaves.

And there are quite a few black saints: Saint Augustine, Saint Monica, Saint Benedict, Saint Moses, Antonio Vieira, Pope St. Victor- was of a black background, Pope St. Gelasius, Pope St. Miltiades or Pope St. Melchiades- a black pope and one of the first, Including many martyers. If the image of Jesus fueled racism then why then did all these people find faith within him? Its very simple because color is nothing, black or white we are all people and have the same goals in life. We have a warped sense of reality, black and whites are different when in reality we are not, genes, who cares we all have the same 'being', we are not animals.

If anything Evolutionary thinking has fueled racism sense the beginninga nd still today. Gangs try to be superior and act like animals, which is fine, if we were animals but were not. Slavery its the same thing today, because there people are veiwed as property and the master was viewed as the superior one, the divine or higher authority.

If anything blame what has been cramed into your head about racism, its a tool to divide the masses and lead to the elites ultimate plan.

[edit on Feb 7th 2009 by TheMythLives]

If you think that Hannibal Lecter was horrifying, how about these Bible verses:

Leviticus 26:29 And ye shall eat the flesh of your sons, and the flesh of your daughters shall ye eat.

Ezekiel 5:10 Therefore the fathers shall eat the sons in the midst of thee, and the sons shall eat their fathers; and I will execute judgments in thee, and the whole remnant of thee will I scatter into all the winds.

Jeremiah 19:9 And I will cause them to eat the flesh of their sons and the flesh of their daughters, and they shall eat every one the flesh of his friend in the siege and straitness, wherewith their
enemies, and they that seek their lives, shall straiten them.

Kings-2 6:28 And the king said unto her, What aileth thee? And she answered, This woman said unto me, Give thy son, that we may eat him to day, and we will eat my son to morrow.
Kings-2 6:29 So we boiled my son, and did eat him: and I said unto her on the next day, Give thy son, that we may eat him: and she hath hid her son.

Is this what you want your children to learn in their faith school?

reply to post by Malankhkare


Chapter 5
1 And the Philistines took the ark of ELOHIYM, and brought it from Ebenezer unto Ashdod.

2 When the Philistines took the ark of ELOHIYM, they brought it into the house of Dagon, and set it by Dagon.

3 And when they of Ashdod arose early on the morrow, behold, Dagon was fallen upon his face to the earth before the ark of YHVH. And they took Dagon, and set him in his place again.

4 And when they arose early on the morrow morning, behold, Dagon was fallen upon his face to the ground before the ark of YHVH; and the head of Dagon and both the palms of his hands were cut off upon the threshold; only the stump of Dagon was left to him.

5 Therefore neither the priests of Dagon, nor any that come into Dagon's house, tread on the threshold of Dagon in Ashdod unto this day.

6 But the hand of YHVH was heavy upon them of Ashdod, and he destroyed them, and smote them with emerods, even Ashdod and the coasts thereof.

7 And when the men of Ashdod saw that it was so, they said, The ark of the ELOHIYM of Israel shall not abide with us: for his hand is sore upon us, and upon Dagon our god.

8 They sent therefore and gathered all the lords of the Philistines unto them, and said, What shall we do with the ark of the ELOHIYM of Israel? And they answered, Let the ark of the ELOHIYM of Israel be carried about unto Gath. And they carried the ark of the ELOHIYM of Israel about thither.

9 And it was so, that, after they had carried it about, the hand of YHVH was against the city with a very great destruction: and he smote the men of the city, both small and great, and they had emerods in their secret parts.

10 Therefore they sent the ark of ELOHIYM to Ekron. And it came to pass, as the ark of ELOHIYM came to Ekron, that the Ekronites cried out, saying, They have brought about the ark of the ELOHIYM of Israel to us, to slay us and our people.

11 So they sent and gathered together all the lords of the Philistines, and said, Send away the ark of the ELOHIYM of Israel, and let it go again to his own place, that it slay us not, and our people: for there was a deadly destruction throughout all the city; the hand of ELOHIYM was very heavy there.

12 And the men that died not were smitten with the emerods: and the cry of the city went up to heaven.

www.sacrednamebible.com...

Well if you read all 12 versus there you see he is talking of the people worshiping false Gods. Stop picking and choosing. It is apparent that you do not like the Christians that do this so why are you going to do it.