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What did Jesus actually teach?

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posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 05:15 AM
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The purpose of this thread is to understand the message of Jesus Christ. I invite posters to decribe in detail what is "it" exactly Jesus came to earth and taught mankind. What was his purpose on earth?

I invite all angles on this event.




posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 05:49 AM
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1- A message of peace and non-violence.

2- exact methodology of how to transcend animalistic behavior, and enter true "hu-man" existence.

visit www.gnosticteachings.org for more.

also... www.gnosticradio.org for hundreds of lectures on MP3 describing the core root teachings of the symbolism of Christ, Horus, Buddha, Krishna.... before it was tarnished and malformed by human opinion over thousands of years.


-

[edit on 31-1-2009 by prevenge]



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 07:02 AM
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I am 1/2 Malkite 1/2Maronite Catholic but I don't go to Church or read the bible. I think it is more important to follow the lessons rather than the religion.

This is what stood out most for me as a child....

"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone"
Meaning that no one is perfect so we should not persecute other people for their mistakes but rather look at our own and better ourselves.

and

"The way you judge others, that is the way you will be judged. How much you give to others is how much will be given to you."
I interpret it as being similar to karma. What goes around comes around. So it is important to be good to others and help people where you can rather than judging them.



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 07:11 AM
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Maybe the best way to begin this investigation is to take a look at what Jesus said about HIMSELF. Then we can more clearly understand the rest of His teachings. So, here we are, the famous "I am" statements:



John 6:51:"I am the living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever;"

John 8:23: And He said to them, "You are from beneath; I AM from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world.

John 8:12: Then Jesus spoke to them again, saying, "I AM the light of the world. He who follows Me shall not walk in darkness, but have the light of life."

John 10:9: "I AM the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture."

John 10:11: "I AM the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep.

John 10:36: "do you say of Him whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, 'You are blaspheming,' because I said, 'I am the Son of God'?

John 11:25: Jesus said to her, "I AM the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live.

John 14:6: Jesus said to him, "I AM the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

John 15:1: "I AM the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser.

Acts 9:5: And he said, "Who are You, Lord?" And the Lord said, "I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. It is hard for you to kick against the goads."


Let's take a closer look at John chapter 8:



Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.” So the Pharisees said to him, “You are bearing witness about yourself; your testimony is not true.” Jesus answered, “Even if I do bear witness about myself, my testimony is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going, but you do not know where I come from or where I am going. You judge according to the flesh; I judge no one. Yet even if I do judge, my judgment is true, for it is not I alone who judge, but I and the Father who sent me. In your Law it is written that the testimony of two men is true. I am the one who bears witness about myself, and the Father who sent me bears witness about me.” They said to him therefore, “Where is your Father?” Jesus answered, “You know neither me nor my Father. If you knew me, you would know my Father also.” These words he spoke in the treasury, as he taught in the temple; but no one arrested him, because his hour had not yet come.

So he said to them again, “I am going away, and you will seek me, and you will die in your sin. Where I am going, you cannot come.”So the Jews said, “Will he kill himself, since he says, ‘Where I am going, you cannot come’?” He said to them, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. I told you that you would die in your sins, for unless you believe that I am he you will die in your sins.”So they said to him, “Who are you?” Jesus said to them, “Just what I have been telling you from the beginning. I have much to say about you and much to judge, but he who sent me is true, and I declare to the world what I have heard from him.” They did not understand that he had been speaking to them about the Father. So Jesus said to them, “When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am he, and that I do nothing on my own authority, but speak just as the Father taught me. And he who sent me is with me. He has not left me alone, for I always do the things that are pleasing to him.” As he was saying these things, many believed in him.

Most of the Jews surrounding Jesus simply WOULD NOT accept that He was who and what He said He was. It was all too much for them! They were so stuck in the forms and traditions of their ancient, man-made religion that they were blind to the fact that the God of their fathers could and would be so incredibly "real" as to manifest Himself right in front of their very eyes! (cont)



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 07:25 AM
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He taught to be honest, to serve man, to fear no man, to respect all men, to challenge everything you see as unfit also admiting when one is wrong.

He taught that there is no reason for reforming and attempting to collapse social situations in ones mind to make them serve them or any other.

He taught that one should never fear what another thinks, but should fear God and trust God, and Draw strength from God the one God, The God of truth and service.



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 07:40 AM
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*cough* selective beliefs much?

peace and love but still stone folk to death like God said too (remember he hasnt come to abolish or change the laws of the prophets but has come to fulfill them)

peace and love but hate your family and give away EVERYTHING you own is the only way to follow me

and all those wonderful i ams, where are the ones where he says he isnt god? the ones where he says anyone can become more holy then him in thier life time and perform greater miracles?

no mention of the parts where God and the holy ghosts tell him things and lead him places he doesnt know (kinda meaning he is seperate from them as he said, and as he says he is a messenger of god, the son of god but he isnt god, how about the bits where he says he ISNT holy and only God is holy?




posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 07:41 AM
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(continued from my previous post)
As we read through this account of one of many confrontations that Jesus had with the religious leaders of the day, we can see that He made them incredibly uncomfortable - just as He continues to do today! Sadly, so many supposed leaders in contemporary churches are just as bewildered by the REAL Jesus as those Jews were 2000 or so years ago.

It is VITAL to realize that TRUE Christianity is NOT a religion - it is a RELATIONSHIP!



He said to them, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. I told you that you would die in your sins, for unless you believe that I am he you will die in your sins.”So they said to him, “Who are you?”

And there we have the one and only truly important question that, if necessary, we should spend our ENTIRE LIVES seeking to answer CORRECTLY! Who is Jesus?



Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.” So they picked up stones to throw at him, but Jesus hid himself and went out of the temple.

To the Jews, this was perhaps the most shocking thing they could ever hear. Without a shadow of a doubt as to His meaning, Jesus was telling them that HE WAS GOD...



Then Moses said to God, “If I come to the people of Israel and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ and they ask me, ‘What is his name?’ what shall I say to them?” God said to Moses, “I am who I am.” And he said, “Say this to the people of Israel, ‘I am has sent me to you.’” God also said to Moses, “Say this to the people of Israel, ‘The Lord, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.’ This is my name forever, and thus I am to be remembered throughout all generations.

If there's one thing that the Jews knew, it was their holy book. This quote from the third chapter of Exodus must have flashed through their astonished minds like a lightning bolt. Absolute blasphemy! After all, this Jesus standing in their midst was just a renegade son of a lowly carpenter! He hadn't even attended school! How DARE He claim not just to be a prophet of God - but to be EQUAL with God!

It was all a religion to them. They weren't interested in a relationship - certainly not one based on a personal acceptance of their own complete inadequacy and inability to meet God's standards through their own efforts....



I told you that you would die in your sins, for unless you believe that I am he you will die in your sins....

So, before we can move on to the other teachings of Jesus and discern the real meaning and application to be found in them, we individually MUST answer the initial, vital question....

WHO is He?

Liar?
Lunatic?
Lord?

Read more (external link, not associated with me in any way) ----> Lord, Liar, or Lunatic?

EDIT FOR SPELLING: Changed a "there" to "their"

[edit on 1/31/2009 by illimey]



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 07:54 AM
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reply to post by heliosprime
 




What was His purpose on earth?


He told Pilate.



John 18

37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

38 Pilate saith unto him, What is truth? And when he had said this, he went out again unto the Jews, and saith unto them, I find in him no fault at all.



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 08:05 AM
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It is really pretty clear .

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin [is] death; but the gift of God [is] eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Rom 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Jhn 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

Jhn 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Jhn 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 08:15 AM
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reply to post by heliosprime
 


The most important things i think Jesus taught in my opinion were (in my unqualified opinion)
Love and give glory to God
Love your neighbour as thyself but you must first love yourself to love others
Don't judge, cause you'll be judged as harshly as you judge others.



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 08:16 AM
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reply to post by heliosprime
 


Jesus taught a lot of things, a few things I can think of off the top of my head are...

Jesus is God.

Jesus was one with his Father, being one he also has the title of God.

Him being God is the most controversial thing he ever taught, but I know it's true.

Jesus taught he was the only way to God. He taught we should love the sinner, but not the sin. Love, respect, period. He did away with the law of sacrifice, he was the last sacrifice, which is why we don't and shouldn't kill animals as an offering to God anymore. Most importantly with his sacrifice he taught selflessness, compassion, empathy for all mankind in every corner of the universe, he taught without repentance and the atonement he made for us we cannot become clean from sin as everyone sins. He did away with the more mundane laws like how many steps we can take on the Sabbath, he taught it was okay to heal the sick on the Sabbath, it was okay to do Gods work on the Sabbath. He gave us a perfect example.



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 08:24 AM
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reply to post by noobfun
 



*cough* selective beliefs much?

*snort* not at all!

I am one of those crazy Christians who actually believes that the entire bible is the inspired, literal word of God. The "I Am" statements that Jesus spoke are a SELECTION of my beliefs.





peace and love but hate your family and give away EVERYTHING you own is the only way to follow me

Compared to the love we should have for God, the love we have for everything and everyone else should be meaningless. The fun part is, though, once we TRULY have that attitude of love towards our God, He then goes "OK! Now, husbands - love your wives as Christ loved the church! Die for your families! Love your neighbor as yourself! The time and money you are genuinely all giving to me - I give back to you to use as my Spirit leads you for your blessing and the blessing of other people! I don't need it - the whole Universe is mine after all!"





and all those wonderful i ams, where are the ones where he says he isnt god? the ones where he says anyone can become more holy then him in thier life time and perform greater miracles?

Jesus never said that He wasn't God. He often stressed His humanity, but never said He wasn't God. He never said that anyone could become more holy than Himself either - I don't understand your comments...

As for "greater miracles", greater in number! Also, it is theologically possible for a Christian even today to "perform" incredible miracles, but the important (vital) thing to realize is that every true Christian is merely a willing channel for God to use in His perfect will and divine power!



no mention of the parts where God and the holy ghosts tell him things and lead him places he doesnt know (kinda meaning he is seperate from them as he said, and as he says he is a messenger of god, the son of god but he isnt god, how about the bits where he says he ISNT holy and only God is holy?

I am not able right now to watch the video you posted, so perhaps that will clarify your thinking here. My immediate response is:

Jesus willingly came from heaven to earth in order to do what generation after generation of humanity had proved no one else could:

Live a life of perfection in thought, word and deed - a life wholly and eternally acceptable to Almighty God. He submitted to His Father's will in EVERYTHING, and as such is our ONLY example of how to live our life. He followed the leading of the Spirit and prayed constantly to His Father in order to show us how a human should live. Nothing Jesus said or did gives us ANY indication that He wasn't holy. Remember - He claimed to BE God! So when He says that only God is holy..........



Jesus. Fully man. Fully God. The One perfect messenger from heaven to earth. After all, when a father wants a messenger he can completely rely on, who better to choose than his son? Some of the parables Jesus spoke highlight this thought very neatly.

Ultimately, as I say in another post, Christianity is about a RELATIONSHIP. It is a relationship that can only start when our stubborn, prideful heart accepts that imperfection (us) can never make itself perfect (God). The only way to bridge that gap is to accept the holy, perfect sacrifice that God Himself made. He became human and willingly EXPERIENCED DEATH in order to break it's power.

THAT is love.

The Creator becomes the creation, and breaks Himself against their driven spears....

This is what Jesus taught.

HE IS the lesson.

[edit on 1/31/2009 by illimey]

[edit on 1/31/2009 by illimey]



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 08:59 AM
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reply to post by noobfun
 



*cough* selective beliefs much?


There is nothing wrong with selective beliefs. As long as they're good ones that don't cause harm to yourself or to others.

Even Athiests have selective beliefs. Anyone with morals and ethics believes in them. Morals are usually learnt either directly or indirectly from someone saying or doing something and they learnt from someone else etc... it started somewhere.

Religion was law for it's time the same way we now have federal and state laws, religion was the foundation on which these were built. If there is nothing saying you shouldn't do something and if no consequence resulted from ones actions we would live in a world far worse than the one we live in.



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 09:55 AM
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Originally posted by illimey

*snort* not at all!

I am one of those crazy Christians who actually believes that the entire bible is the inspired, literal word of God. The "I Am" statements that Jesus spoke are a SELECTION of my beliefs.

ahh so you believe anyone lighting a fire, collecting wood or doing any work on the sabbath (thats friday btw) should be stoned to death? that children who are insolant and disobey thier parents should be stoned to death gays should be put to the sword along with adulterers ?

wow you really ARE a crazy christian but at least you following ALL the words of god and jesus not just the bits you want to like everyone else and reinterpretting the bits you dont like and dont want to do to mean somthing different

my hats off to you your a rare breed in this day and age


Compared to the love we should have for God, the love we have for everything and everyone else should be meaningless. The fun part is, though, once we TRULY have that attitude of love towards our God, He then goes "OK! Now, husbands - love your wives as Christ loved the church!


he did? wow which church? the jewish synagogue? (there wasnt any christianity yet remember jesus was a jew)

shame he said it to late for these guys

Luke 5:10-11

Luke 9:59-62



Die for your families!


or just ignore them if they are not in his personality cult

Mat 12:47-48
Mark 3:31-35

insult them for not knowing where you are when you run off

Luke 2:48-49


Love your neighbor as yourself!


he was slow on that one it was around for hundreds of years prior to jesus and is in the old testament too i think

but yepp that one he said


The time and money you are genuinely all giving to me - I give back to you to use as my Spirit leads you for your blessing and the blessing of other people! I don't need it - the whole Universe is mine after all!"


umm he says give everything up to follow me, and only by getting rid of possessions and family then in heaven you will recieve this back a hundred fold as a reward, dont give it up your dont love him enough to follow him and your getting nothing

Mat 27:19-30


Jesus never said that He wasn't God. He often stressed His humanity, but never said He wasn't God. He never said that anyone could become more holy than Himself either - I don't understand your comments...



Matthew 27:46, Mark 15:34 talks to god in the third person ..e.g. not himself

John 14:28 his fathers greater then him (his father bieng god who he isnt else he would be as great as)

John 20:17 going up to see dad and god (so he himself isnt god)

Matthew 19:17, Mark 10:18 dont call me good, only god is good (therfore he isnt god else he would be good too)

1 Timothy 2:5 Jesus is a mediator between god and men (so not god himself)




I am not able right now to watch the video you posted, so perhaps that will clarify your thinking here.


the video wasnt a part of that response, it highlights how what jesus actually says is pretty much ignored on m,any many fronts and reinterpreted to fit what the followers want it to mean

infact the whole appologetics movment is based on this changing things into other things changing meanings so it doesnt seem as brutal silly or strange as reading it directly is

please dont give me the swiss army knife 3 in 1 god, it was borrowed from the greeks who borrowed it from the babylonians and has absolutley no foundation in the old testament

it only came about when they were trying to figure where to fit jesus in, it took them another 3 centuries to figure out if he was all man(but still the son of god), all god in man shape or the mix and match we have today, sorry if your having to vote on jesus's level of manifest divinty it kind of says no one really has a clue and they are making it up

[edit on 31/1/09 by noobfun]



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 10:18 AM
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Originally posted by Obliterated

There is nothing wrong with selective beliefs. As long as they're good ones that don't cause harm to yourself or to others. Even Athiests have selective beliefs.
agreed everyone uses selective beliefs, its part of the way our brain works

but when someone follows the word of god and jesus (but then ignore most of them to fit thier selected model) and then run around spreading it about as the true message of jesus (or infact anything) then they deserve a big frown and a finger point

especially with the you hate god your gonna burn in hell mentality o many of ATS's loving christians display to athiests and each other


Anyone with morals and ethics believes in them. Morals are usually learnt either directly or indirectly from someone saying or doing something and they learnt from someone else etc... it started somewhere.
yepp



Religion was law for it's time the same way we now have federal and state laws,
but as God gave the laws in Deut and jesus supported them failure to do them makes you akin to the pharisee for holding mans law higher then gods

and goes back to the passing of selective belief and reframming anything you dont like to be somthing else

when jesus supports stoning people to death is he really all about love and forgivness? which is the point im trying to make


religion was the foundation on which these were built.


you mean the state and federal laws were based on religeon? i may be misreading this and i hope i am

they are based on british law which are based on common law used in england before jesus was born of judaism got that far into europe, the legal system is based on what would be considered a pagan society based on equality for both men and women


If there is nothing saying you shouldn't do something and if no consequence resulted from ones actions we would live in a world far worse than the one we live in.
i hope your kidding?

we have an inbuilt morale code from nature from our social living ancestors, its found in the wild in almost all socialy interacting species

without it written down thier would still be an understanding of simple right and wrong so the number of possible crimes would be fewer but the people would get along just as well

its population numbers and poverty that increase crime

and how could there ever be no consequences? socail animals all get punished for breaking thier inbuilt social morale code if caught the same as us

[edit on 31/1/09 by noobfun]



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 10:49 AM
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reply to post by noobfun
 


Yo noob!!!

Trinity huh?

Here’s OT’s take…

Water? Steam? Ice? One thing…?

Egg? Yoke? Shell? Referred to one thing?

But here’s my fav…

I’m a SON…I’m a EMPLOYEE, and I’m a FATHER…3 expressions, 3 different ways to relate to me…3 difference way to relate to others….yet I’m still ONE ole’ dude…

OT

PS: If the supreme is omni-present, He can be everywhere (the Father) while Jesus, (Son) is on this little planet, the earth…and remember the comforter (the Spirit) was up in ‘heaven’ and was sen to the earth when the son left…or atleast a bit after that…

PSS: God’s never late bro…just relating to mankind as they developed…it was all in the plan… To summarize Kolberg…every decision/perspective/rationale and ultimately BEHAVIOR…is a result of the their PRIMARY stages of development…

Here’s an overview…

Stage 1 – Decisions/perspectives….based on REWARD and PUNISHMENT…this is the most basic (immature)…another way to say it…the ‘stick’ (ruler) or the ‘carrot’ (sweats)…or from a religious perspective…..‘heaven’ and ‘hell.’

Stage 2 – Decisions/perspectives…based on EXTERNAL Influences…another way to say it… “RULES.”

And

Stage 3 – Decisions/perspectives…based on INTERNAL Influences…another way to say… “PRINCIPLES.”

Here’s an example to bring it to life…

“A woman was near death from a special kind of cancer. There was one drug that the doctors thought might save her. It was a form of radium that a druggist in the same town had recently discovered. The drug was expensive to make, but the druggist was charging ten times what the drug cost him to produce. He paid $200 for the radium and charged $2,000 for a small dose of the drug. The sick woman's husband, Heinz, went to everyone he knew to borrow the money, but he could only get together about $1,000 which is half of what it cost. He told the druggist that his wife was dying and asked him to sell it cheaper or let him pay later. But the druggist said: "No, I discovered the drug and I'm going to make money from it." So Heinz got desperate and broke into the man's store to steal the drug for his wife.”

The question to ask…to determine…their (current) stage of development is…

Q - “Should Heinz have broken into the laboratory to steal the drug for his wife? Why or why not?”

A – Stage 1 – “I don’t steal…because I’m afraid of being ‘caught!’

A – Stage 2 – “I don’t steal…because it’s ‘wrong!’

A – Stage 3 – “I don’t steal…because I respect others and their property!” But LIFE is more important…and I’ll pay the price, but a life will be saved!”

Kolberg’s theory is right on, in my book…

His approach, in my mind, is a reflection of the TRUTH documented in the Holy Bible…

Stage 1 – Reward and Punishment – Torah - “...If you eat from this tree, you will surely die…” Genesis 2:16

Stage 2 – Rules - All those old testament commandments…

Stage 3 – Principles – The new testament writers review when the Lord Jesus was asked, “…which is the greatest commandment?” He responded… “…it’s the principle of love…Love the Lord God with all your heart, soul and mind, and your neighbor AS YOURSELF.” Matthew 22:36

“ALL the Old Test. rests on this!” Matthew 22:37


By the way Noob, Kolberg explains, that the transitions from one stage to another…is predominantly achieved through asking…”why?” and that’s what ATS stands for!!!





[edit on 31-1-2009 by OldThinker]



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 10:52 AM
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reply to post by noobfun
 

Head knowledge of the words in the bible without heart knowledge of the Word OF the bible (which only comes through faith) is dangerous. You have no insight into the words you read, and are not understanding the message, the contexts, or the applications.

No doubt you have had this conversation on many threads here at ATS already, so I'm not going to engage in yet another one with you.

This is probably going to make you angry (if you're not already), but that's a good thing...

I'll pray for you instead.




posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 10:57 AM
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reply to post by illimey
 


Hey OT here, what's up?

Noobfun's a good one, honest...and rare with compliments, you got one I think...

Good posts there!!!

OldThinker~



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 11:07 AM
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Originally posted by illimey

Head knowledge of the words in the bible without heart knowledge of the Word OF the bible (which only comes through faith) is dangerous. You have no insight into the words you read, and are not understanding the message, the contexts, or the applications.


and here comes the appologetics ..and i thought you said you followed all the bible
shame on you

standard theistic response number 2

well im reading it how its written and how jesus said it, so is jesus wrong and your right? or do you just know what jesus means better then he said it and meant it himelf (its a shame you cant wacth that video it describes exactly this)? him being all divine and all knowing id think he had a grasp of what he meant and wa able to put it into words ...or he isnt a very smart omniscient god

and well if he isnt omniscient and i a little dumb then bieng a part of god that make god a little dumb too


No doubt you have had this conversation on many threads here at ATS already, so I'm not going to engage in yet another one with you.
ive had lot of discusion about lots of things on ats this and many many other bits of the bible and religeous philosephies

if you dont wanna get into it then fair enough, would be nice for people to acknowledge the discrepencie honetly and explore them at least in thier own mind rather then just gloss over them with the usual you reading it wrong ad i know better then jesus malarky


This is probably going to make you angry (if you're not already), but that's a good thing...
actually im quit amused by this reply and generally in a good mood


I'll pray for you instead.




Matthew 6:6-15

dont be a heathen about it! if your gonna pray for me do it the jesus way. which means not praying for me at all



posted on Jan, 31 2009 @ 11:10 AM
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Originally posted by OldThinker
Trinity huh?

Here’s OT’s take…

Water? Steam? Ice? One thing…?

Egg? Yoke? Shell? Referred to one thing?

But here’s my fav…

I’m a SON…I’m a EMPLOYEE, and I’m a FATHER…3 expressions, 3 different ways to relate to me…3 difference way to relate to others….yet I’m still ONE ole’ dude…


hehehe yeah i get the whole 3 in 1 wiss army knife god deal its where it comes from tht amuses me

no founding in the OT, in the NT the two link are at best tenuous and later additions yes im refeering to 1john 5:7 not found in earlier copies of john

and Mat 28:19 same deal someone added it later, jesus never eluded to a trinity and neither did anyone in the ot

its somthing that no one eluded to but developed after the fact and was settled upon ...again by vote several hundred years after and took another 100 years to be stamped into an unquestionable tennet of christianity punishable by death and even that didnt stop it bieng questioned

its like the divinty of jesus and just how much man/god he was when people are taking votes on it 3-400 years after the fact, youve got to wonder at people who say this is true and what jesus himself said

in this respect Islam is closer to the origin of chritianity (judaim) then christaintiy i as both jews and muslims say the trinity is nonsense made up by crazy men

and in a bizare twist of the three in one jesus is indirecty his own dad, now thats a pecial case of insest, to go with the rape of mary(she didnt consent it was done before she knew it)

so jesus indirectly raped his own mom and became his own dad ... no wonder the trinity was questioned so much for the first few hundred years after it was adopted

it origins (like many things in the OT appear to have come from egypt and babylon(via conquering the assyrian) and the trinity idea spread to many other cults/religeon christianity just went one step further then having 3 god that were linked and equal to 3 gods that were 1 but still 3

home is where the heart is buddy even if it still covered in 2 foot of snow, just means you can annoy the wife and kids by snowballing em everytime they leave the front door


[edit on 31/1/09 by noobfun]




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