Another lie in christianity exposed?

reply to post by pureevil81


This could send me into a endless rant but I will hold my views on religion as they will affect no one but myself. The only thing I will point out is that IMHO scripture has been tweaked over time and it seems rather ridiculous to think otherwise. I find many contradicting things in scripture and religion and personally think as we are living it now, we are living something started from mysticism and lies. Jesus spoke in parables and code.

Any philosopher and politician can do this and it only makes people translate with a myriad of different definitions ultimately leaving the truth missing as everyone takes their own opinion creating myth and legend from something that was purposefully disguised in complicated code so the truth would remain hidden. This is only my opinion and good post.



[edit on 3-2-2009 by N3krostatic]

Instead of posting endless scriptures here is a link that may help ....
www.bible-prophecy.com...

reply to post by N3krostatic


Thank you!!

we agree on alot of things, actually I agree with all of what you posted...

Thanks again.

reply to post by Simplynoone


OK, that works..

I have that very page book marked, when I started questioning, at first I thought it was just my lack of understanding, now I realize it wasnt just me, it is alot of people.

But thank you for everything you have added, it seemed to have evened out both sides of the discussion.

I will look into it more, you have my word on that. But I have my doubts that it will do anything to change my mind.

Hey no problem ..
It took me a long time doing my own studying without the aid of the Internet (was way back when there was no internet) .....

Lately when Justamomma and I were discussing this very subject (she disagrees because she has the Jewish beliefs) ....I had to relook at it all .
And I noticed this time there was even scriptures that said it was hidden for eons (the plan for Jesus etc) ....

If your really interested here is a search engine for the bible both OT and NT and even every single bible version etc ...do a search on hidden you will see what I mean by the plan to send Jesus was certainly preplanned from the very beginning and every single feast day and even circumcision and many of their rituals foreshadowed what Christ would do when he would do it etc etc ...(Course that also takes days weeks and months to study lol if your interested I have many links on the Harvests and the Feasts (which are very interesting and do tell a story big time about everything)just let me know I will share with ya ....
Here is that search bible online ..
www.blueletterbible.org...

On the right hand side you can change the version you want ..



Here is one you may like ..it explains a few more things you may wonder about ..
www.khouse.org...

I dont completely agree I dont think with everything they say ..but it is close to what I believe to be the truth ...I am a rapture believer (which some are not) and I also consider myself a pretrib rapture believer(There is a prewrath view which is they believe they will be raptured in the middle of the trib ..then there is posttrib which they believe they wont be raptured till the second coming of christ ) ...

As you know beliefs vary about all of it .
I just read what I can ..study it myself in the word ..then online reading others opinions etc then I make my own conclusion ...but I am open for there not to be a rapture at all ..(I would like there to be one) but I am not 100 percent for sure there is one pretrib ...so I dont stay completely closed minded about it .....I do leave room that I could be mistaken ...
The Bride and the Jewish Wedding traditions I gave a link to above is one of the reasons why I do believe the Bride leaves prior to the horrible time that is coming ...so take a look ..you will see what I mean ..

If your interested ...



[edit on 3-2-2009 by Simplynoone]

reply to post by Simplynoone


Thanks, I appreciate that.

What is odd though, is I believed in jesus much the same way you do.

When I started studying prophecy is when I stopped believing the same way you do. I have a notebook somewhere ( cant find it now ) that is full of notes on prophecy. so when I started studying prophecy is when my mind changed big time.

From my understanding I do not believe it was jesus spoken of in the prophecies, if he existed at all!! I am not jewish either, I am of no religion and feel the most comfortable with that.

I do know the different theories of the rapture, pre-trib, mid-trib, and post-trib... I have read many books on that subject, and again, when I started getting deeper into it is when my mind changed big time.

So honestly I am always reading something, whether it be online or a book, or a paper.

So you see, I prefer to look at all angles of pretty much everything, I even look at the angle of atheism... I listen to ALL angles. which is what I base my beliefs on.

Here is some links in this post of gnostic writings...www.abovetopsecret.com...&addstar=1&on=5501929#pid5501929

You may find that interesting also.

It seem the more I look the more my beliefs change, I get further and further away from the mainstream.

I really wish I had the time to properly walk you through how my beliefs have changed to get to were I am today. Like I said, it seems to me the bible was written by men, and men have been fulfilling prophecy.. hence the state the world is in.

All my opinion of course.

Yes I have read almost all of the Gnostic stuff ..and even Athiests views on everything ...I am a reader and love to research ....I have over 1000 links to many places with Ancient texts etc .......
It actually convinced me even more of the bible being true ...lol .....
And Jesus ...he came into my heart and really does live within me and changed my whole life from the inside out ...and really did lead me into understanding the bible even better ...... ..which is why I fully believe that he existed ...nothing will change that ...

Just thought I would share something of relevance in regards to Isaiah 53... have been wanting to share, but haven't been able to get the words right until today when I was replying on another board. Curious to see who "hears" what I am saying

In the Tanakh the names were depicting what was found BEHIND the names. So, if we are going to put a name to the Messiah and the Suffering Servant, it undoubtedly will have to be the one the Tanakh uses... Michael which means "Who (is) like G.d?"

Daniel 10: 21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince.

Isaiah confirms this as truth. In verse 11: He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

Because the spirit of G.d has been with the servant as stated in chapter 42 of Isaiah, he will have come to understand the things listed in Isaiah 53; the purpose for it. And G.d's spirit will have opened the seals of the books to show him the truth... and thus, he will have the spirit of Michael ~ Who (*IS*) like G.d???!!! Suddenly, the servant will understand who he is and will KNOW G.d.. and be amazed at His brilliance!

As the collective Messiah awakes, they will understand why they *were* indeed cut off as spoken of in Daniel 9:
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince (note the capital "P".. it is the Messiah as the whole, not just the individual servant anymore) shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

BUT... as the servant sees the travail of "his" soul, "he" will take pleasure because "he" will understand the times "he" has found himself in and "he" will give knowledge thereby justifying the many!

Daniel 12 also speaks of "Michael, the great prince" and "his" calling:

1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.


It is actually even more interesting the more one sees! So, see, G.d was not lying when He made the following declarations (meaning that no other men should have any need to twist things to fit Jesus into the picture because HE declared it and you will see, hopefully sooner than later)....

Isaiah 42:
8 I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.
9 Behold, the former things are come to pass, and new things do I declare: before they spring forth I tell you of them.
18 Hear, ye deaf; and look, ye blind, that ye may see.
19 Who is blind, but my servant? or deaf, as my messenger that I sent? who is blind as he that is perfect, and blind as the LORD's servant? (Jesus was not blind.. the Word attributed to him though spoke opening the eyes of the blind *wink* basically, it is common Judaism understanding, rightfully so, that the Messiah will not understand that he is the Messiah right away.. thus, the suffering servant who has been given over to affliction of the soul is awakened and will "justify the many through knowledge")

20 Seeing many things, but thou observest not; opening the ears, but he heareth not.
21 The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable. (how could one NOT?.. it is the path to knowledge for salvation!!)
22 But this is a people robbed and spoiled; they are all of them snared in holes, and they are hid in prison houses: they are for a prey, and none delivereth; for a spoil, and none saith, Restore.
23 Who among you will give ear to this? who will hearken and hear for the time to come?

Isaiah 43:
10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
12 I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, that I am God. (Remember the name Michael is the allegory for these witnesses and when they "see".. well, they understandably will say "Who is like unto G.d?"!!)

Isaiah 44:
6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
7 And who, as I, shall call, and shall declare it, and set it in order for me, since I appointed the ancient people? and the things that are coming, and shall come, let them shew unto them.
8 Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.

continued...

Isaiah 44:
6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
7 And who, as I, shall call, and shall declare it, and set it in order for me, since I appointed the ancient people? and the things that are coming, and shall come, let them shew unto them.
8 Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.


Isaiah 45:
11 Thus saith the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands command ye me.
12 I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.

Why so many trust man over the ONE WHO CREATED the world and everything in it and above it is beyond me!! Look, we have barely scratched the surface of what is out "there" in the universe and yet so many seriously find it logical to believe their fellow ignorant human beings what the things said in the Tanakh is concerning?

Ask G.d... the Creator!! The Almighty! He declared it all, the problem is, so few are asking HIM for His understanding to be given! They hold on to their idols like a kid holds on to their security blanket and the idol will do no more to secure you than the security blanket does the little child. Time to grow up and ask the Father what HE meant by these things.

[edit on 3-2-2009 by justamomma]

Originally posted by newday
Both science and religion are based on a lie so how can they do anything other than lie to us?

You know I would agree with the attitude some here have expressed of "don't worry enjoy life" if what we're experiencing as consciousness was indeed life, but it's not.

Of course I do agree there is nothing to worry about, but the reality is we are a form of artificial life, not real life at all.

In truth we are nothing more than dead material with animation, our state of existence IMO should be more accurately described linguistically as a stage of death not life or not real life but rather artificial.

That is what all conscious life is, it's temporary animation and awareness, in a nut shell artificial life.

But both religion and science make the mistake of assuming that simply because we are aware and think therefore we must be alive.

It's the old adage I think therefore I am, the greatest and must successful lie ever released into human psychobiology..

Thanks, keep em coming.

Christ!

[edit on 3-2-2009 by Christ!]

reply to post by Clearskies

In the time you have left on Earth, it's doesn't take much effort to take one afternoon out to open your heart to G-d and ask Him EVERYTHING.> Expecting an answer!

Thanks, but no thanks. I'm not trying to be rude, and I don't judge you for your faith, but I'm way past the point of even having a slightest notion or even a curiousity of there being a christian god. To me, a christian god simply doesn't exist.

Originally posted by justamomma
I will state this over and over! Jesus is not the Messiah!
[edit on 3-2-2009 by justamomma]

That's right.
The tanakh was forced to support it by those with a confused, confusing agenda.
So now what?

Two questions:
What is salvation, and how is it achieved?
Jesus had an agenda of his own, as it relates to salvation, and how to achieve it.
From what I gather, your version of salvation is opposite that of Jesus' [interpreted minus the confusion added through NT scribes.]
As you define salvation, you define your "savior".
This is essentially what the NT scribes did.
One's motive filters his/her interpretation of symbols.

Christ!



[edit on 3-2-2009 by Christ!]

Originally posted by pureevil81

Originally posted by newday

You see truth and revelation is not about watching things going wrong in the world, its about witnessing them going exactly as expected..

You could be right about that, I dont know.

But at the same time are we suppose to sit by and watch the world go to hell.... old men freezing to death because they couldnt pay their power bill, people living in tents on the side of the road because they lost their job?

Are we suppose to sit back and watch these things happen and not speak up about it and just wait for jesus to come back?

If this is all pre-destined to happen, Why then does it have to happen? Why do people have to suffer?

Thank you newday...

As indicated, the world operates as it is set up to function.
It is set up as a distraction...from the truth.
It is set up to get a reaction from you.
As you react, it keeps turning.
If everyone was taught not to react, it would stop turning and end.
Efforts to fix it up hold it up and keep it turning.
Because,
These are reactions.
This is why Jesus says [through Thomas],
"Be passerby".
Given what it is, the very best, most loving thing anyone can "do" is to quit.
What this means is to let go of it all.
That includes the whole concept of personhood or individuality.
As one does this, he becomes a light to others to follow.
The most important thing to do in hell is to get the hell out, so-to-speak.
This is the same as saying, the most important thing to do when far away from home, and things areent going well...the right thing to do is go home.
See, the world if functioning like clockwork.
It functions perfectly.
It functions perfectly insanely.
It operates exactly as scripted.
Everything about it is prescripted.
It "fixed" already.

Is it possible to make choices that decrease suffering?
If you think a choice will lead you away from suffering, go ahead and make that choice.
Keep in mind, choices made without guidance may not necessarily lead away from suffering.
Choices made with true Guidance always do.
Until one is certain he is guided, and is following, presume non-guidance.

True Guidance is always focused on exodus.
Most importantly, always to to be focused on exodus.
Exodus is always away from pain and suffering.
So,
Exodus is best chance to reduce pain and suffering till it is no more an issue.
It is not an issue when you have escaped.
Intend all your choices to lead to exodus.
The intent is effective for choosing with purpose.

Christ!



[edit on 3-2-2009 by Christ!]

Christ justamomma just has scriptures written about her people in the latter days (Which is still yet to come) .....confused with the scriptures that pertain to Jesus...Some scriptures are talking about Jesus and some are talking about two tribes of the chosen children of Israel .....(Jacob and Judah ) ...

If one really wanted to dig you would see that they (the scriptures about them) have yet to be fulfilled ..
Check out what it says about Jacob and Judah and the latter days etc ..
www.blueletterbible.org...
the whole tribulation is about JACOBS TROUBLES to get him to come back to the Lord God ...scripture even says in the latter days they will finally GET IT ...but only after all the troubles they have to endure in the land of Israel with the people of Israel (the Jewish peoples as a whole) .. ....same with Judah ......
Jacob and Judah have not been saved yet (this is yet to come) ..
They denied Jesus was the Christ ...they did not accept the Messiah (he came to his own and his own KNEW HIM NOT) ....(they will during the trib according to scriptures though) ...............He does not let them down ..he will bring them in ..it will just take a mountain to move them ..(figure of speech) .....it will take acts of God (like the terrible war that is coming to the Nation of Israel that happens right after a league of peace is confirmed between them and the Middle Eastern countries) ......

Originally posted by Simplynoone
Christ justamomma just has scriptures written about her people in the latter days (Which is still yet to come) .....confused with the scriptures that pertain to Jesus...Some scriptures are talking about Jesus and some are talking about two tribes of the chosen children of Israel .....(Jacob and Judah ) ...

If one really wanted to dig you would see that they (the scriptures about them) have yet to be fulfilled ..
Check out what it says about Jacob and Judah and the latter days etc ..
www.blueletterbible.org...
the whole tribulation is about JACOBS TROUBLES to get him to come back to the Lord God ...scripture even says in the latter days they will finally GET IT ...but only after all the troubles they have to endure in the land of Israel with the people of Israel (the Jewish peoples as a whole) .. ....same with Judah ......
Jacob and Judah have not been saved yet (this is yet to come) ..
They denied Jesus was the Christ ...they did not accept the Messiah (he came to his own and his own KNEW HIM NOT) ....(they will during the trib according to scriptures though) ...............He does not let them down ..he will bring them in ..it will just take a mountain to move them ..(figure of speech) .....it will take acts of God (like the terrible war that is coming to the Nation of Israel that happens right after a league of peace is confirmed between them and the Middle Eastern countries) ......

Many words sister.
But the two questions remain:
What is salvation?
How is it achieved?

Beware that there are basically two kinds of salvation.
Your interpretive skills are filtered by your motives.
If you are motivated by the salvation of personhood in any way shape or form...you will never be able to interpret any symbols the way Jesus interpreted symbols. And as a result, you will not be able to achieve the kind of salvation he achieved.

So, beware.

As a rule of thumb, your whole school of thought is backed by a motive toward the salvation of what I call the *many*. The many are the persons of personhood, the entities of entityhood, the masters of masterhood. Whatever they are, they are different, unique...special in their own way. Each has an identity of his/her own. The world is built on this kind of salvation. It is also built on confusion.

So beware.

Christ!

[edit on 3-2-2009 by Christ!]

reply to post by Christ!

See, the world if functioning like clockwork.
It functions perfectly.
It functions perfectly insanely.
It operates exactly as scripted.
Everything about it is prescripted.
It "fixed" already.

Exactly! It's all a Game, and those who follow the Game rules will abide by the right clock.

Different clock, different time zone! If one is glued to this earth and its consequences, one will feel the pain of the world. Too many questions and not the right answers. No book can give us that.

It is called: "Let Go and Let God!"

As long as we recognize that the power truly does not lie in us using the clock of the world, we won't get it. But we have power if we perceive things that are not of this world! Either people are part of the problem or are part of the solution.

Christ ..as usual I can never understand a word your saying ...I dont know why that is but you make no sense whatsoever to me .....every single post ..I just dont see where you are at ....and have yet to determine even just exactly what you believe ..or dont believe ..

I believe you are one of those who overspiritualize everything ..(I personally see that actual LITERAL EVENTS did happen in the bible and more LITERAL EVENTS are yet to come ...some things are also DUAL in meaning ..(Two fold meanings) ..
And then some things are completely spiritual speaking ...this is why it takes the HOLY Spirit to be able to understand and discern which is which and when it is literal or spiritual ..or both ....
People who overspiritualize everything cant seem to see anything as literal (and miss alot ) those who are too literal cant see anything spiritually ...so there needs to be a balance ..The Holy Spirit is balanced ...so is God .(it is us humans who are bipolar and confusing lol ) .....

Sorry ..I mean no disrespect but I dont get you ...and dont understand you .

Originally posted by justamomma
Suddenly, the servant will understand who he is and will KNOW G.d.. and be amazed at His brilliance!

What makes this world is...brilliant!
So?
That is just a ploy...a trick...a trap...a temptation.
What makes this world is a toy-mind.
The toy-mind is brilliant because its maker is brilliant.
Each of us, collectively, are the maker of the world-maker.
So we are co-makers.
The toy-mind supplies the brilliance.
We supply it with power.
We give it the power of our faith.
It would have no power were it not given power "from above".
It knows not who gives it power, nor does it care.
It cares only to exist as long as it can through trickery.
It is very tricky because it is...brilliant!
It functions to confuse.
And confusing, the net effect is to crucify its Lord.
As it operates in its Lord's mind, it destroys it like a parasite worm.
Do not fall for its temptations, snares, and manipulations of emotions.
Rest from the confusion for a little while.
Have mercy on your true soul.
You don't deserve what it has in store for you.
You are the Lord.
It is your servant.

Christ!



[edit on 3-2-2009 by Christ!]

Originally posted by MatrixProphet
Exactly! It's all a Game, and those who follow the Game rules will abide by the right clock.

Different clock, different time zone! If one is glued to this earth and its consequences, one will feel the pain of the world. Too many questions and not the right answers. No book can give us that.

It is called: "Let Go and Let God!"

Thanks. Keep sleuthing!

Christ!

[edit on 3-2-2009 by Christ!]

Originally posted by Simplynoone
Christ ..as usual I can never understand a word your saying ...I dont know why that is but you make no sense whatsoever to me .....every single post ..I just dont see where you are at ....and have yet to determine even just exactly what you believe ..or dont believe ..

I believe you are one of those who overspiritualize everything ..(I personally see that actual LITERAL EVENTS did happen in the bible and more LITERAL EVENTS are yet to come ...some things are also DUAL in meaning ..(Two fold meanings) ..
And then some things are completely spiritual speaking ...this is why it takes the HOLY Spirit to be able to understand and discern which is which and when it is literal or spiritual ..or both ....
People who overspiritualize everything cant seem to see anything as literal (and miss alot ) those who are too literal cant see anything spiritually ...so there needs to be a balance ..The Holy Spirit is balanced ...so is God .(it is us humans who are bipolar and confusing lol ) .....

Sorry ..I mean no disrespect but I dont get you ...and dont understand you .

If you won't address the content or subject matter of my posts...nor ask questions related, how would you understand?

The questions are:
What is salvation?
How is it achieved?

Beware.

There are two kinds of salvation.
You cannot "hear" my "voice" because you are wholly focused on the salvation that is opposed to the kind Jesus taught. It is *against* what the the true Spirit of Holiness offers you now.

Personhood, entityhood, identityhood...any kind of "hood" that is not the same or equal as all other "hoods"...that is not the salvation the Spirit of Wholeness offers you. That is offered by the spirit of unwholeness.

Christ!