Swedish city cancels Holocaust event

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posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 02:54 PM
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posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 02:54 PM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.



Originally posted by masonwatcher
Unfortunately, the lessons of the Holocaust has not been learnt by the people most affected by it and has instead evolved into a propaganda tool specifically and exclusively for Israel when in fact it should be man kinds heritage and warning.


Your logic is appalling. You are saying its mankinds heritage and warning, and yet at the same time you advocate dropping that hertiage and warning in an attempt to make a cheap political point.

Tell me - what did the six million people (russians, catholics, slavs, romanies, poles, prisoners of war, disabled people, gays, jews, political dissidents etc) killed in the holocaust in WW2 between 1939 and 1944 by the Nazi's do in Gaza to the Palestinians recently?


As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 03:00 PM
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reply to post by neformore
 


No, you tell me what is more important, people being killed now or a memorial service for the dead!

Second line.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 03:25 PM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


reply to post by masonwatcher
 


They're equally as important.

One reminds us of the levels of depravity humans are capable of, the other tells us that we humans haven''t learned much from the previous lesson yet.

The best way to learn from our mistakes is to remember them. Casting them aside is arrogant, stupid and by doing so, we will never learn anything.

So, how about you answer my question now?


As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 03:37 PM
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Boohoo, cry me a river.

Who honestly cares? One event about the most overrated genocide cancelled. Where are the events about the murder and torture of 100,000's of Chinese during WW2? How about the thousands of Kurds gassed by Saddam? How about the Iraqis US soldiers murdered?

How about Russians and Chechens who were slaughtered while they were fighting.

So many other atrocious mass murdering events took place in the time we've inhabited this planet. Why does one get all the attention in the world is beyond me.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 03:41 PM
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Originally posted by masonwatcher
reply to post by QueenofWeird
 


Why don't read you what I said unless there is a reading comprehension problem? The victims of the Holocaust has nothing to do with time travel. It the abuse of the memorial by Israel that is the problem.

If the memory of the Holocaust is a discourse for all then the crimes against the Palestinians would not be happening and the last people perpetrating it would be the Israelis.

Of course you can argue that the Palestinians are none persons and have less rights than a memory and Israel can do what ever it wants. Just don't expect the rest of us to jump on your bandwagon.


Really. One honors the Holocaust victims because one feels they deserve that. The fact that the Israeli government (which is not the same as Israeli's or Jews, just like the Nazi's were German but a German was not neccessarily a Nazi) abuses the Holocaust to further horrible actions, has NOTHING to do with those Holocaust victims or one's need to honor them.

My bandwagon is called logic.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 03:46 PM
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reply to post by neformore
 





Tell me - what did the six million people (russians, catholics, slavs, romanies, poles, prisoners of war, disabled people, gays, jews, political dissidents etc) killed in the holocaust in WW2 between 1939 and 1944 by the Nazi's do in Gaza to the Palestinians recently?


You obviously refuse to read my comments. I said ownership of the Holocaust has been claimed by Israel. You would think of all people they would be last to ethnic cleanse the Palestinian people from their land, force them into walled ghettos, and shell it.

The 6 million dead memorialised are all Jews. The other nationalities you included in your question is merely for the effect of incorporating others and undermining the Swedish justifications. In effect you are saying that the Holocaust memorial services held in Israel and centred around Jewish communities abroad is about Russians and Romanies, etc. So your question is disingenuous.

At the end of the day, the Palestinians did not cause the Holocaust but they are paying the price.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 03:50 PM
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reply to post by QueenofWeird
 


Nope, it is not logic but preprogrammed orthodoxy. There are holocausts happening every day so why is one more important than the other unless you believe one life is more important than another.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 03:50 PM
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At the end of the day, the Palestinians did not cause the Holocaust but they are paying the price.


At the end of the day the millions of Jews who died in the Holocaust didn't do anything in Gaza yet their memory is being pushed aside because of it.

They're making a good point masonwatcher. It's not fair.

[edit on Fri, Jan 30th 2009 by Djarums]



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 03:57 PM
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Originally posted by Djarums

At the end of the day the millions of Jews who died in the Holocaust didn't do anything in Gaza yet their memory is being pushed aside because of it.

They're making a good point masonwatcher. It's not fair.

[edit on Fri, Jan 30th 2009 by Djarums]


True but like I said, the beneficiaries are the Israelis yet they overwhelming support the Gaza siege. So disregarding the memory and lessons of the Holocaust is not by the Swedes but the Israelis. The Swedes merely excuse themselves from the annual pantomime.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 03:59 PM
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Originally posted by GorehoundLarry

Who honestly cares? One event about the most overrated genocide cancelled. Where are the events about the murder and torture of 100,000's of Chinese during WW2? How about the thousands of Kurds gassed by Saddam? How about the Iraqis US soldiers murdered?

How about Russians and Chechens who were slaughtered while they were fighting.

So many other atrocious mass murdering events took place in the time we've inhabited this planet. Why does one get all the attention in the world is beyond me.



You make a valid point - the jewish nation shouldn't have the sole rights to genocidal suffering. Genocide is wrong and I think that it is time that all genocide is grouped together and mourned together, including the Gaza process.

Instead of cancelling the event I think it should be used to highlight the atrocities against human rights around the world! Allow people to stand up and say "there must be no more" in this way all those millions and millions who have died in Europe, Africa, the Americas and the East will truly serve as a lesson for future generations.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 04:07 PM
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Originally posted by RogerT

Times are a changing, that's for sure.

This current wave of anti-Israel sentiment that seems to be sweeping around the world is fascinating indeed.

Exciting stuff


Times are a changing?
No they aren't.
Antisemitism has always been a popular way to go.
Nothing has changed.

Current wave?
Don't you mean - Constant wave?

Exciting stuff?
You're kidding right?!

It's the same "Blame the Jews Club" around the world.

It's pathetic.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 04:09 PM
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reply to post by spinkyboo
 


Did you post just to insult us, or were you intending to make a new point? I think the whole world is shocked about what happened in Gaza. It's offensive to think these women and children died and all you can say is it's a "Blame the jews" game.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 04:25 PM
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Originally posted by Mynaeris
reply to post by spinkyboo
 


Did you post just to insult us, or were you intending to make a new point? I think the whole world is shocked about what happened in Gaza. It's offensive to think these women and children died and all you can say is it's a "Blame the jews" game.


I posted specifically in response to the post by RogerT.
That specific post was offensive.
I do not condone any of the unjust fighting that goes on around the world.





[edit on 30-1-2009 by spinkyboo]



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 06:26 PM
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Fact is the Jewish people killed in the Holocaust weren't Israeli at all. Mostly Polish, and has absolutely nothing to do with the Gaza conflict since the Holocaust happened to non-israeli JEWS. So in short, I suppose it's ok to stop a ceremony but why not just say; "We can't have a memorial ceremony for an event about genocide, when the people immortalized by this event are commiting the same genocide."



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 06:28 PM
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I mean, why would you memorialise the horrors of the past when the descendants of the victims are conducting the same up on another people?


For many people, the term Holocaust includes all groups persecuted and murdered by the Nazis and is not exclusive to the genocide of Jews. Even if one links the Jews subject to Hitler's actions and those in Israel today, it still leaves a whole host of people who were brutally persecuted and killed, refused memorial by this action.

I get what you're saying about a group condemning one action in the past, whilst perpetrating a similar action in the present. However, this is a point made at the expense of the memory of people who have no say in what's going on today. It serves only as a perceived punishment against todays Israelis, who are not the ones being commemorated in Holocaust remembrances.

The fact that many people perceive Israel to be committing the same acts today that were inflicted on people with the same religion and heritage in the past, should not IMO negate or take anything away from what has happened in the past.

If anything the Holocaust should be remembered more explicitly than any other year, serving a loud and clear message about the consequences of such campaigns.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 06:47 PM
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reply to post by neformore
[ Its dengrating the deaths of up to 6 million people to make a cheap political point. ]

A lot of those who died were not Jews, many were mentally or severely disabled, many were Romany, any group of people deemed not part of the Nazi's 'Aryan' ideals.

And I have yet to hear an comment regarding Jewish traitors during the Second World War by an high ranking representative of Judaism.

And I've yet to hear of an Roma living in Israel, lol.

The way Zionists portray the holocaust, only they suffered or that their leaders were blameless, and that is not true. I do believe that the most senior Jewish leaders at that time KNEW what was going to happen.

I agree that to hold a holocaust memorial especially with Judiasm as the normal theme would have provoked unsettling feelings of extreme hypocrisy.

Israelis need to take their country back from the extremists and the folks who thinks any 500-400 year old or what have you bible scribbled by crackpots are truth.



[edit on 30-1-2009 by star in a jar]



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 07:14 PM
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There is actually no difference between zionism and judaism,the
Word zionism is a smokescreen on the political arena of judaism,one and the same,do not be fooled!



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 07:46 PM
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6 Million people were not killed in the Holocaust that's a myth. There were something like 2 Million. Yes, it's a big number still but get your numbers correct.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 08:46 PM
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Israel did not exist!!! And I don't care if people believe it was there thousands of years ago. The apparent jewish suffering in the holocaust, and UK and US bankers created it with money and worldwide sympathy. A 'biblical' state created out of jewish sympathy. No state for the gays, just continual persecution even to today. The Jews of Israel have tainted what the holocaust means.







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