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Smoking Banned in Homes-California Adopts 'Hitler's Policy'

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posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 10:40 PM
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reply to post by RFBurns
 


the non-smoking and smoking appartments/condos does sound likea good idea, they should do that, but even that its getting into umm whats that word segregation which is not a good thing




posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 10:43 PM
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Originally posted by Harassment101

Non smokers have had to deal with it, putting up with it. It's not like everything else. If someone is smoking outside on ground level you can walk away. I usually do.


Im actually glad to hear that from a non smoker who knows which way to take a step or two. Most dont and just argue to argue.



Originally posted by Harassment101
If someone is smoking in their home, you can not walk away when it starts to affect your home. You can open windows, and as mentioned balcony doors, back doors, but in the heart of winter, this is not a fun solution.


You will find that even if you were surrounded by non smokers in that enclosed apartment complex, your air will be even far more stale and dirty. Which means your apartment or condo has inadequate air ventalation. That alone is not healty. Dwellings require air circulation, especially enclosed heavily insulated apartment buildings or condos.



Originally posted by Harassment101
Smokers should deal with their addictions, or build encolsed areas for their addicitons. I would not want a meth lab, or crack smoker anymore than I want any other type of smoker, because eventually they all affect your health.

Sorry to sound harsh, but it does affect your health. If it was just an annoyance it would be one thing, but it's more than that.


Smokers do deal with their habit. We go out of our way to accomodate your wishes. And that still isnt good enough. Unfortunatley when it comes to individual homes that are not apartments or condos, thats where you or any other non smoker has absolutely no right to be complaining about the air quality when there is airspace seperating my smokers home and your smoke free home.

If the wind happens to blow in the wrong direction, oh well, thats nature's fault, not the smokers fault.



Cheers!!!!



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 10:45 PM
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Originally posted by RFBurnsThat sounds like an issue with the apartment building or workplace building air ventilation system, not an issue with smokers.


No it's a smoker, and they don't smoke 24/7, but it's built up. And it does all that I mentioned and then some.




As I pointed out in another thread...when was the last time your apartment vents were cleaned? Are you aware that CDC proved that indoor air is far worse than the outdoor air?


The vents in my home were cleaned recently enough, but it comes through the walls. They don't stop smoke, same reason when your neighbours home is on fire, you can die from the smoke, even if the fire does not touch your place.




Seperating smokers from non smokers in an apartment building or condo, I have no problem with. I dont think any other smoker would have a problem with that either. But to you non-smokers, even that wont be good enough after a period of time..just as it isnt good enough now for us smokers to go outside or be in our designated smoking areas.


For me personally, I am all for this option. The only problem with this is because smoking does cause health problems, there are still children to be concerned about. I think this is where the non smokers would still be up in your business.

If marijuana becomes legal this will be the same sort of issue. You will get high off of someone else habit and then what will you do? You don't smoke drugs, the neighbour does, your clothing will smell of it, and then you go to work or the community, it's in your hair, and etc.

So you might be a cigarette smoker, but not a marijuana smoker, but have to put up with being high because of what someone else is doing, or using. Non smokers currently put up with health issues, due to smoke.

I wish it was the vents, I agree that having clean vents is an all around good idea, but it's the smoker.

The problem with having smoke free buildings is that you would have problems asking people to move out of a place they have lived for 10 years, with non smoking buildings you have to wait till one person moves out, then declear it non smoking in the lease, then another and so forth. Newer buildings can be decleared smoke free right away.

I don't want to stop people from smoking, but children should not have to put up with second hand smoke, and adults who do not smoke should not have to put up with the addiction either.



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 10:45 PM
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Originally posted by FritosBBQTwist

Yes but once again they pay rent. They do not this property at all. I am sure they have certain rights that are listed, but since it is not THEIR place they do not set the rules.


You don't own your house either. You PAY rent to a mortgage company. You PAY rent to the Government in property taxes.

Dont abuse your home with Cigarette smoke because when either the Government or the bank forecloses it they will not get enough of there value back.

This is about freedom and people like yourself is handing it over. If you dont like America's freedom please go somewhere like China and leave rhis FREE country to U.S.



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 10:46 PM
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Originally posted by FerTheBetter
reply to post by RFBurns
 


the non-smoking and smoking appartments/condos does sound likea good idea, they should do that, but even that its getting into umm whats that word segregation which is not a good thing


A form of that already exsists in some resturants and bars. And I know of a few apartment complexes where I live that do have smoking apartments and non smoking apartments.

There are also hotels that have smoking rooms and non smoking rooms.

So the "segregation" issue is there..just not seen as such.



Cheers!!!!

[edit on 29-1-2009 by RFBurns]



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 10:47 PM
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Originally posted by FerTheBetter
reply to post by RFBurns
 


the non-smoking and smoking appartments/condos does sound likea good idea, they should do that, but even that its getting into umm whats that word segregation which is not a good thing


Segregation is not a good thing, but it might be the only way to keep both sides safe. I don't like telling people what they can do in their home. A persons home is their castle, but if your castle causes others to be sick, then that other persons home is not much of a castle.



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 10:51 PM
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So you might be a cigarette smoker, but not a marijuana smoker, but have to put up with being high because of what someone else is doing, or using. Non smokers currently put up with health issues, due to smoke.


you would not get high if you were living next to a person who smokes weed, thats an outrageous thing to say.maybe if you were in the same room but thats still a stretch.



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 10:57 PM
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Originally posted by RFBurnsIm actually glad to hear that from a non smoker who knows which way to take a step or two. Most dont and just argue to argue.


See if I can walk away, I usually do. If people are smoking outside, I just have lunch away from them. I understand the addiction.




You will find that even if you were surrounded by non smokers in that enclosed apartment complex, your air will be even far more stale and dirty. Which means your apartment or condo has inadequate air ventalation. That alone is not healty. Dwellings require air circulation, especially enclosed heavily insulated apartment buildings or condos.


I agree good ventaliation is important, but smoking is it's own issue. It get's into the furniture, you can't get rid of the smell easily, and the health issues just get ridiculous over time. At least in a non smoking building, you can say, well it's not the smoke so let's look at other issues. I guarantee you, with this it's the cigarette smoke.





Smokers do deal with their habit. We go out of our way to accomodate your wishes. And that still isnt good enough. Unfortunatley when it comes to individual homes that are not apartments or condos, thats where you or any other non smoker has absolutely no right to be complaining about the air quality when there is airspace seperating my smokers home and your smoke free home.

If the wind happens to blow in the wrong direction, oh well, thats nature's fault, not the smokers fault.


With the smoking, I get that emotionally it feels like one right after another is being taken away to accomidate the non smokers. I think it gets to the stage for the non smokers where they get fed up, especially if they have a child or job where it was affecting them.

With smokers I get that it feels like the world is closing in, and you are being told what you can and can not do, where and when. Smoking is an addiction and being told when you can and can not light up is frustrating.

I am all for finding solutions, but I do believe in the right of the individual to be healthy first, before accomidating addictions.

See with non joined homes, it's less of an issue, but like I said before, if children are in the home, people are still going to get on your case. If you are by yourself and choosing to smoke, I would not care, but it does bring down property value if the walls get so conjusted with smoke the home can not be sold, but I personally would not care about this point. The human aspect and the health issues are what I care about.



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 11:00 PM
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Originally posted by FerTheBetter




So you might be a cigarette smoker, but not a marijuana smoker, but have to put up with being high because of what someone else is doing, or using. Non smokers currently put up with health issues, due to smoke.


you would not get high if you were living next to a person who smokes weed, thats an outrageous thing to say.maybe if you were in the same room but thats still a stretch.




I know you can get high if you live in a home and someone in the basement is smoking and you are on the third level. That's a fact.

I also know that marijuana smoke just like cigarette smoke will drift into other apartments and in high enough concentrations can potentially make someone high. That's not a that much of a strech.

I don't think it's outragous to say. It's smoke, you are getting it second hand, but it's still coming into your place.



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 11:15 PM
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Don't police officers have something BETTER to do than to stop law abiding citizens from exercising their own rights in their OWN homes?

You know... like stopping CRIME, or RAPE, or GANGS, or ROBBERIES... you know... things that ACTUALLY MATTER!!

These tree hugging hippies supporting this law have simply crossed the line and if they don't start GROWING UP, they're gonna be crossing even deadlier and riskier lines by trying to enforce their gestapo BS.



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 11:29 PM
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Originally posted by Harassment101


Smoke can drift through walls to the extent that if you don't smoke, people come to your home and they think you are a smoker. It's that bad. Think of fire when there is smoke inhallation, it goes through walls.


Now you are just making stuff up.


Sorry but smoke from a structure fire DOES not go through walls. I have been to a house fire where the ENTIRE house was destroyed and this teenage girls bedroom door was left closed because she was gone for the night. You couldn't even smell the smoke and I tell ya what buddy I stopped counting on my 30th structure fire back in 2006 and if it seeped into that room you would have smelled it. Its a terrible plastic acrid smell you never forget.

Try again, thank you.


Originally posted by Harassment101
The vents in my home were cleaned recently enough, but it comes through the walls. They don't stop smoke, same reason when your neighbours home is on fire, you can die from the smoke, even if the fire does not touch your place.


Ok stop it with he smoke going through the walls crap. It can only gain access through open doors vents and cracks. You are not going to die from the smoke if your neighbors home is on fire, unless you open your windows. It cannot seep past drywall or even one thin coat of paint. In fact drywall can even stop a fire for quite sometime until the surface area gets so hot it combusts the wood touching it. You have no clue what you are talking about.

You must be hell to live next door to. If I was your neighbor I would throw eggs at you every day until you moved.

[edit on 29-1-2009 by LoneGunMan]



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 11:49 PM
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I'm honestly confused about the whole 'smoke drifting through walls' thing. Both of my parents smoked, and I kept my bedroom door closed (not because the smell bothered me, but because I was a teenager and liked my privacy). The furniture in my room never smelt of smoke, my clothes didn't carry the smell. Given that reasoning, I don't understand how a person can complain of smoke when there isn't even a smoker in their home. I just don't understand it.



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 11:49 PM
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I absolutely hate smoking, the smell of it, the taste of it, etc...

But to tell someone they can't SMOKE IN THEIR OWN HOUSE?!

This is America. What someone does in their own house is their own business, and as much as I hate smoking, this disgusts me.

The government has NO RIGHT to say what people can and cannot do in their own house (aside from crimes like murder, rape, abuse, etc...).

This is just another shining example of an overbearing on-the-verge-of-tyranny government. This crap has to stop.

[edit on 29-1-2009 by JipStix]



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 11:58 PM
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reply to post by DimensionalDetective
 


Open patio areas in shared condos and apartments do not constitute as private property. Smoking poses a very serious negative externality upon the health of other non consenting individuals. If you wish to smoke in the comfort of your own home, get a better paying job and purchase your own house. This article is deliberately misleading in that the definition of private property is so liberally extended to include something that the term has never traditionally included. This is just what to expect from the growing number of the ATS member base, whose political rhetoric is ruining all objective credibility once found on these boards. Please do us all a favor and brush up on your English language comprehension.

[edit on 30-1-2009 by cognoscente]



posted on Jan, 29 2009 @ 11:59 PM
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hmmmmm interesting. not much of a constitution left over there in cali eh?
this is verry entertaining, because lately it seems like that is how our goverment goes about anything and everything, slow and steady. Rather is being a release of information or restricting us to where we can smoke, all the way to the down right disgusting ways they are restricting our own right to protect ourselves. Guns gave us freedom we didnt get freedom from protesting and hoping someone would listen. When you need something done and you want it done right you have to take physical action. If i am understanding everything correctely anything that isnt done physically always has reprecutions and different meanings to different people as well as different loop holes for our goverment to creat different restrictions. i hope you guys like communism



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 12:00 AM
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just like what happened in mexico i believe will happen here our goverment will strip us of all our land and homes and we will not be able to pass things down the goverment will lease it to us.



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 12:00 AM
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i do not like the invasion of privacy aspect of this. However, the indications are very strong that passive smoking will cause asthma in children. So, somewhat reluctantly I find I am in favour of the ban.
Sam60



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 12:03 AM
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Originally posted by LoneGunMan

she was gone for the night. You couldn't even smell the smoke and I tell ya what buddy I stopped counting on my 30th structure fire back in 2006 and if it seeped into that room you would have smelled it. Its a terrible plastic acrid smell you never forget.

Try again, thank you.



No I can tell you from personal experience when the neighbour has something burning, and visa versa, it comes through the walls. Even before the smoke alarm goes off.



Ok stop it with he smoke going through the walls crap.


This is not crap, this is a fact, I don't know what world you live in, but this is a real life fact. Cigarette smoke does go through the walls.




It can only gain access through open doors vents and cracks. You are not going to die from the smoke if your neighbors home is on fire, unless you open your windows. It cannot seep past drywall or even one thin coat of paint. In fact drywall can even stop a fire for quite sometime until the surface area gets so hot it combusts the wood touching it. You have no clue what you are talking about.


I know exactly what I am talking about with cigarette smoke, so don't tell me that I don't. With stuff burning, I can tell you that even before the smoke alarm goes off, it can be smelt in the other apartment. This goes both ways.

If you say smoke from fires does not cause people to suffocate, then so be it.



You must be hell to live next door to. If I was your neighbor I would throw eggs at you every day until you moved.

[edit on 29-1-2009 by LoneGunMan]


I can't imagine the pleasures that your neighbours must have, living beside you, you egg throwning person you. I don't envy them a jot.

Anyways here is what I was looking for in regards to the marijuana smoke.
www.answerbag.com...

It's a quick net search, but I am sure there are better stats. I will double check on smoke inhalation for fires.


[edit on 30-1-2009 by Harassment101]



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 12:05 AM
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The FACT is those areas mentioned in the Bill are not your HOME. You pose a serious negative externality on all individuals sharing those areas. Your behavior is totally subject to the well being of your neighbors. Get a real job and buy a real house if you want to enjoy your o-so special private property rights. Not everyone gets to enjoy those things. You have to first make a meaningful contribution to the economy and society by actually being able to purchase a private home. This is ridiculous. Everyone expects to have these rights without achieving them through merit. If you want to smoke in your house buy a bigger house. Get a real job. That's it. Everyone complains about wanting equal rights. Well go ahead and earn them.



[edit on 30-1-2009 by cognoscente]



posted on Jan, 30 2009 @ 12:06 AM
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Originally posted by LysCat
I'm honestly confused about the whole 'smoke drifting through walls' thing. Both of my parents smoked, and I kept my bedroom door closed (not because the smell bothered me, but because I was a teenager and liked my privacy). The furniture in my room never smelt of smoke, my clothes didn't carry the smell. Given that reasoning, I don't understand how a person can complain of smoke when there isn't even a smoker in their home. I just don't understand it.


I honestly don't know if some homes, apartments are designed differently, but I can tell you, leaving doors and windows shut does not stop this. I can smell what the neighbours are cooking, if stuff get's burnt I know it, and visa vera. The smoke comes thought just the same way.

I have been in homes and it's the same thing, with doors closed, and windows. Either you are not sensitve to it, or your home was just really well built. I don't know. I am sure if you do some research, you will find this is a common complaint.



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