The non-interventionist policy of UFOs / aliens, why?

Anyone that's researched UFOs has confronted someone, somewhere who asks, "If there are UFOs why don't they just land on the White House lawn and announce themselves?" Here's a possibility. What if the reason for the game of cloak-and-dagger is because they're our future selves and any form of involvement would alter our history? Doing a little digging I found one website (www.terrestrialextras.com...) that expanded on this theory and asked some intelligent first questions:


While the theory has some good merits (i.e. explaining non-interventionist behavior). It has holes. Take for instance the Colares UFO attacks ‒ why would these crafts let themselves be seen? Because if this really was our future-selves and we had the power of time-travel I would assume any mistakes could be easily reversed. Then again what if our future selves had a history where these events transpired and therefore to maintain continuity they violated their non-interventionist dictum? Or maybe, we're seeing something that's a combination of future time-travel and ET intervention.

This may pose more questions than it answers, but it's the first time I've been able to swallow the idea that we're possibly witnessing future humans observing their past.

Then again I still have a hard time accepting time-travel if only because I subscribe to Peter Lynds theory, as described in Time and Classical and Quantum Mechanics : Indeterminacy vs. Discontinuity, which more or less states "time is a man-made construct and doesn't physically exist."

So, what's ATS's explanation for the seemingly minimal-interventionist policy of UFOs?

All thoughts welcome!

I have thought the Galactic Federation of Light was coming back. They've had their scouts in our system I've heard, but we need to be ready to change for ourselves. We must prove ourselves that we can handle the enlightenment and responsibility. With the current thoughts in society, that's unlikely.

But I haveheard they're fighting the Grays and Draconians in war

Time travelers from the future would not need to be too concerned about violating non-interventionist policy by being seen occasionally, if they are traveling back to a time when the prevailing belief is that UFOs are aliens. The belief itself is their cover. Such as is now.

If they are our future selves , it must mean that the US did not make it . Because they sure would be intervening at each and every opportunity .

reply to post by randomviolins


That is an interesting theory, depending on what view of 'time travel' you take - their actions would sort of 'fit in the gaps' of recorded history. Always explainable as something else, unnoticed, or never affecting the outcome of 'future history'.

Of course, the same theory could be applied to time-traveling aliens. For example, aliens contact humanity in the 23rd century, notice the state of society and recorded history, then start traveling back in time and visiting to learn more, secure in the knowledge that their investigations will have no effect on the 'present day'...

Originally posted by Xtraeme
Anyone that's researched UFOs has confronted someone, somewhere who asks, "If there are UFOs why don't they just land on the White House lawn and announce themselves?"

Maybe they tried to in July 1952,twice.
(starts at 22:08)
video.google.co.uk...

As for your theory,its certainly an interesting one

reply to post by randomviolins


Interesting thought randomviolins, but the Colares incident is a clear example of active involvement by some external actor that clearly affected lives and would have changed the future. Furthermore, if you subscribe to chaos theory, the flapping of a single butterfly's wing today produces a tiny change in the state of the atmosphere. Over a period of time, what the atmosphere actually does diverges from what it would have done. So, in a month's time, a tornado that would have devastated the Indonesian coast doesn't happen. Or maybe one that wasn't going to happen does.

I would argue the same would be true of any UFO sighting. Especially radar cases like the 1947 RB-47 encounter.

reply to post by Gun Totin Gerbil


How do you know they haven't intervened? Isn't it possible that our present is a product of intervention?

Originally posted by Xtraeme

Interesting thought randomviolins, but the Colares incident is a clear example of active involvement by some external actor that clearly affected lives and would have changed the future. Furthermore, if you subscribe to chaos theory, the flapping of a single butterfly's wing today produces a tiny change in the state of the atmosphere. Over a period of time, what the atmosphere actually does diverges from what it would have done. So, in a month's time, a tornado that would have devastated the Indonesian coast doesn't happen. Or maybe one that wasn't going to happen does....

The common error is to assume that all that has happened so far is the "original", so that anything the time travelers do would be an alteration. But what if alterations happen all the time, but we continue to believe these events are the "originals"? Why do we assume there is such a thing as a non-intervention policy? Maybe our history is shaped by interventions.

reply to post by randomviolins

The reason I assume non-intervention is because there are very few cases of active involvement, something beyond simple observation, between people and UFOs. I can only come up with a handful of cases where UFOs (not 'greys' mind you) have done anything beyond confound observers.

Even people who have been abducted report that their memories are typically fuzzy about what happened to them. While this is obviously the polar opposite of non-intervention there's a clear motivation to mask the fact that a person was abducted. Why? If it was an extraterrestrial civilization why wouldn't they just fly down in their craft, suck up a human, perform whatever experiments they have in mind, drop the human on the ground, and then fly away?

That said, there may be something to your argument that certain events don't affect the core fabric of the future in such a way as to damage the existence of our future selves.

Or maybe like I posited in my original post,

Then again what if our future selves had a history where these events transpired and therefore to maintain continuity they violated their non-interventionist dictum?

As for your question to how malleable our future / past is ...

But what if alterations happen all the time, but we continue to believe these events are the "originals"?

As far as current theory is willing to speculate, we would notice, because there would be incongruities with what we know versus what would be reflected in historical record.

I suppose it could be argued if a time-traveler went back in time and saved JFK that history would change in such a way that I would have never known JFK was assassinated in the first place. That's a hard thing to fathom and as far as I can tell I have never seen any observable changes to historical record, even though it's likely incorrect to assume I could know if it did change. However, if history was malleable it's probable that people would simply disappear from a time-line, that includes me, you, or anyone for that matter. Since I still exist I'd like to think that's indicative that the past isn't being tampered with.

[edit on 28-1-2009 by Xtraeme]

Originally posted by randomviolins
reply to post by Gun Totin Gerbil

 

How do you know they haven't intervened? Isn't it possible that our present is a product of intervention?

Yes , as mentioned above, it a hands off , laid back intervention , if there is any intervention at all . The US would have death stars orbiting the planet and x wing fighter crafts strafing cities with plasma nano bombs and lazer beams by now.

Originally posted by ...

((Oh, sorry))

[edit on 28-1-2009 by CoolBlackHole]

Good thread Xtraeme

Originally posted by Xtraeme
Or maybe, we're seeing something that's a combination of future time-travel and ET intervention.

This is my personal belief, that the UFO phenomena we're witnessing and experiencing is the result of multiple sources and origins.

I don't give much credence to the time-travelers hypothesis however, but I can't obviously dismiss it as a possibility.

To me time-travelers don't make sense for what we're witnessing, especially with the apparent non-interventionist policy, because if they wanted something from the Planet they could have come when there was no man, or when man wouldn't even question what he was seeing, in case their craft would be seen.

If they want something from people now in particular, if they can time travel, then they could always come back and change things so (other) people wouldn't see them.

For example, and assuming for a moment that the Roswell incident was (alien) time travelers, surely they would've known that it would have the impact that it did. If they wanted, they could come back and avoid it.

The same applies to other UFO incidents that had a lot of (public) impact (Phoenix Lights, O'Hare etc).

So, what's ATS's explanation for the seemingly minimal-interventionist policy of UFOs?

My guesses range from non-interventionist policies and agreements that exist between aliens because of what it would do to our civilization, to studying us for afar for whatever reasons.

Their open interaction with us, whether the outcome would be 'good' or 'bad', would change our civilization and path forever.

Perhaps they have first hand knowledge of other instances where they interacted with less advanced beings from other planets and things didn't work out so well.

We can only guess.

reply to post by randomviolins


you say the past is peppered by historical interventions.
the colares event sounds like a biblical even.trance like states. like the fatima visions in portugal.powerful heated lights like the one that potencially lit the biblical bush on fire.levitation like jesus walking on water.in ancient times the entities coming from the light would have been describes as angels.i know its a strech but could unknown entities be manipulating ouf present past and future from the looks of colares it seems possible.

With cloaking tech that would come from future research there would be no sightings.

If time manipulation exists then why would they ever need to be seen? It doesnt make sense that they would be us from the future.. unless we all go mentaly handicapped. Genetic problems can be solved... its like playing with legos once you understanding what your doing. With advanced tech you could "create" the legos you want.

There is no need to abduct people other than to leave them with that memory.

The only thing that i can think of is some conspiricy where the government wants people to turn away from alein help or cooperation.

Free energy means the death of social structure as we know it, nothing to decive and feed off of.

On a related non-interventionist note:

such advanced civilisations may value the search for knowledge from uncontaminated species more than direct, interspecies communication, thereby accounting for apparent covertness regarding their presence.

...

The ET motivation for space travel could be to increase their knowledge through exploration of space rather than to colonise and seek domination [39]. Thus hypotheses have been set forth regarding why such ETs would be aware of our presence but not yet have contacted us overtly. Among these are the zoo, nursery and quarantine or embargo hypotheses [1,38,40-42]. Most of these posit that the ETs involved have frequently scouted us out semi-covertly and have concluded that we are either not yet mature enough for open contact, or not prepared for it, since any abrupt, overt contact could cause societal chaos and governmental downfalls. Also postulated is that ET interference with our society would prematurely bring an end to our civilisation’s continued development if it occurred before our knowledge has progressed to the point that we could understand where the aliens could have originated and how great their head start over us could be [39]. A serious inconsistency in this reasoning, however, is that maintenance of total ET covertness towards Earth and the solar system would still lead to societal chaos whenever the covertness or embargo was eventually lifted, unless the ETs carried out a programme of gradual disclosure—a ‘leaky’ embargo [1,43]. Although the zoo or embargo hypothesis may be unverifiable, the leaky-embargo hypothesis may be verifiable if the UFO evidence is taken into account. Much of this evidence appears to constitute just such a leak in the embargo: a grass-roots educational programme in the form of the phenomenon, which has been in operation since 1947, if not before. Many sightings have been of a nature to attract attention to their craft and let isolated groups of witnesses know that its occupants are aware of us [24,44]. A key category of such cases involves reports wherein persons within a traveling vehicle frantically witness an object pacing them even though their automobile or aircraft makes turns that rule out the sighting of an astronomical or other ordinary object as any explanation. Similarly, in a number of the aircraft cases the unknown object, which was either pacing the aircraft or presenting itself to it, was detected on radar as well as visually [23-25,27].

-- Source: Inflation-Theory Implications for Extraterrestrial Visitation, J. DEARDORFF, B. HAISCH, B. MACCABEE AND H.E. PUTHOFF

[edit on 10-3-2009 by Xtraeme]