The British have something to say to us Americans!

reply to post by Mintwithahole.


So how are you going to defend your wife and family just now?

You are in Liverpool, and you should not have a firearm in your home just now. So what you gonna do, he doesn't have a gun cuz we are in the UK. What you going to do polo?
How are you going to defend everyone?

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
Hey the government in Australia did the exact same thing with semi autos

What has the public reaction been like in Oz?

Is it such a big deal?

Originally posted by Thistled
reply to post by Mintwithahole.

 

So how are you going to defend your wife and family just now?

You are in Liverpool, and you should not have a firearm in your home just now. So what you gonna do, he doesn't have a gun cuz we are in the UK. What you going to do polo?
How are you going to defend everyone?

I don't know if you have a wife and family so I can't speak for you, but as far as I'm concerned I'm not going to sit idly by and see my own threatened. I'll do anything, absolutely anything to protect and ensure their safety, so when you whittle it down to an excuse to own firearms I find that quite insulting. Bellieve me, I have the ability to protect my own. If a SHTF situation comes up I think I can get my family through it. I sincerly doubt, because of your seemingly weak disposition, that you could do the same. Correct me if I'm wrong.

reply to post by threelions



Not all of us. But it is kind of weird the crush some of us do have with the man. It's like the bad boyfriend that treats his woman bad but he really loves her...REALLY..so he will change and everything will be ok. The unquestioned adoration is a little weird to say the least.

i wont say the man can't do a pretty good job. He hasn't had the chance yet. But I just don't believe all the smoke and mirrors either. I wish all if us here in the good ol' U S of A could see that the emperor has holes in his underwear. No man is perfect. Not even BHO.

reply to post by Thistled


I'm wondering what people like myself that live in a pretty remote area that have no police protection are supposed to do as to protecting ourselves and families. Simple fact of the matter is the criminals here do have guns. and if jacked up on God knows what the flavor of the day drug rather don't think about dying or just don't care. I agree it's plain offensive to trivialize my desire to protect my home and family. I was born and raised in this land with the Constitution that is supposed to be our protector of the rights that we haev enjoyed as a people since we began this country. and because of some opinion that is totally uneducated you view us as a bunch of cowboys or gangsters or just plain paranoid nuts for the many reasons we wish to fight to keep our right to our firearms. You must watch a lot of American TV and mainstream media as to what it's like here. Yeah, that's a good source of information.

The fact of the matter is what this right represents to us. Lets take a look at it. Our right to gun ownership is one that not only is supposed to protect us from bad people that wish to do us harm. but from bad people in power that wish to do us harm. If I was part of a political machine I would much more fear a large group that was well armed than one that was not. We are supposed to be allowed to keep our government in check. By force if need be. It's said that no way could armed civilians group together and take on the armed forces. It happens. It's how we started this little country of ours. We took on the best military in the day and it worked. We took out freedoms form those we seen as oppressors. If need be, We will have to again. Better to die a free man than live as a slave. Many of the American people might be willing to let our rights slip away. Not all of us.

The UK had their guns taken and gun crime still happens. Many of the people there from what I read are getting fed up with it. They were promised something that they did not get. and now they are not in near the possession to help themselves that they would have been before they turned in their firearms. Even with less gun crime is there less violent crime as a whole? People are going to kill other people. and some will do it with a gun. No matter how hard you make it to obtain one. Still happens there. Still happens everywhere. I'm hearing on this board that some there do not feel as safe as they would if they were allowed to have a firearm. I'm sure there are many more.

We Americans need to watch what is happening elsewhere in the world. It's getting easier and easier for these unarmed people to be not only threatened by the bad people in their corner of the world but the government that is supposed to protect them.

As for this barbaric American I am paying attention. I will not stand for my recreational shooting to be taken, I will not stand for my ability to protect my family be taken. I will not stand for my government to just take my rights with the stroke of a pen. Maybe I am barbaric. I think these murders don't need to waste tax dollars by the boat load in prisons. Let them swing a rope or the ammo is a lot cheaper than 30 year of keeping up some animal that would love to have some sympathetic politician let them out so they can do some more unspeakable things to decent people just trying to live their lives. We don't need more prisons in this world. We need to disposed of the animals. Might piss off the ACLU but I guess we could put halfway houses up all over their neighborhoods and see how fast they reach for a gun when it's their family that is being attacked.

Face it, some people are just bad people. I don't see where free housing for them does anything for society. Maybe something like that would deter the violent crime. I doubt it though.

I hope the people in the UK keep fighting. and I hope someday they win their right to protect themselves. I hope thy win the ability to go out and shoot because they simply like to. Or because they want to hunt. It's a great hobby. I own over 20 guns (both rifles, shotguns, and handguns) and I have yet to go on a rampage. I'm not a danger to anyone. I keep them locked up away from those that might want to use them in a bad manner. Except for one. That one is on my person in case someone tries to do something stupid and comer in acting like some barbarian and sack my little kingdom. I wish those over there could do the same. Law abiding people are not going to go nuts and start killing people just because they have a gun. It don't work like that.

Thistled..I hope one of those guns that only criminals have over there never is pointed at you. While I think you are wrong and did find some of your comments pretty offensive I do hope that you never have to be in the position to feel the people do when they have no way to defend themselves or their family from someone that wishes to do you or yours harm. I would hate to think anyone had to feel that way..

[edit on 2/3/2009 by DrumJunkie]

reply to post by Mintwithahole.


So I was right? You can defend your family without a firearm.

See how easy it is?

Originally posted by DrumJunkie
reply to post by Thistled

 

You must watch a lot of American TV and mainstream media as to what it's like here. Yeah, that's a good source of information.

You couldn't be further from the truth. It's precisely because of all the American gun crap, that I threw out my TV 6 years ago!!!! Kid you not.
That's right clever clogs, I don't watch TV.

TV is full of reality crap, and US TV crap. European TV is full of it, because it's a cheaper option than making your own.

How little you know me.

If the guys who are likely to break into your home (because you are so paranoid that it will happen) are so high on drugs, then you have nowt to worry about, more than likely if they have a gun they will miss. Throw a plant at them (a cactus).

You don't need a gun to protect your family. Ask any brit.

Originally posted by Thistled
reply to post by Mintwithahole.

 

So I was right? You can defend your family without a firearm.

See how easy it is?

What!? The point I'm making is that it would be easier to protect family and friends if we were allowed to own guns. The criminals would think twice if they thought you were able to shoot back.For god's sake, in this country we aren't even allowed to fight back in a simple fist fight!
I think you're looking at the world through rose tinted glasses and seem unaware of just how easy it is nowadays to become a victim of crime.

reply to post by Mintwithahole.


So you think every house breaker carries a gun?

Originally posted by Thistled
reply to post by Mintwithahole.

 

So you think every house breaker carries a gun?

Its a sad fact but more and more burglars are carrying guns. And whats more, they aren't afraid to use them. Honestly, I can understand your reluctance to follow are American friends and arm ourselves but personally I would like to be treated as a grown up and given the right to bear arms.

Originally posted by Thistled


If the guys who are likely to break into your home (because you are so paranoid that it will happen) are so high on drugs, then you have nowt to worry about, more than likely if they have a gun they will miss. Throw a plant at them (a cactus).

You don't need a gun to protect your family. Ask any brit.

I was going to stay out of this, because you're obviously quoting from your own mind rather than from any objective source, but your above statements couldn't be further from logic.

Throw a plant? Seriously?

Here's a plan: Continue not valuing your life enough to protect it with lethal force, continue having dreams about bad guys "rotting in jail," and continue tantalizing the senses with the idea of defending oneself with anything LESS than the most fatal possible weapon.. But unless you're trolling for a good time, give up the idea that you're going to convince any logical, sane human being that they'll be safer when they DON'T have the ability to defend themselves against a bad guy with lethal force.

reply to post by pernox


Have you ever had a cactus in your face?

Obviously not.

Like I have said so many times before, remove the firearm and you increase the probabiity of survival.

Man where are the mathemeticians / statisticians on ATS when you need them?



[edit because my keyboard is f%&£ed, on 11/2/2009 by Thistled]

[edit on 11/2/2009 by Thistled]

Yeah, your inability to defend yourselves in your own homes without being prosecuted is absurd.

Here is what we do with "Home Invaders" in the US.

www.wave3.com...

Homeowner pops one of the thugs and another takes the murder charge for doing the crime in the first place... LOL

Bye Thug

Some of you I think are insane when you say "nothing in my house is worth taking the life of a criminal"

What you should say is "Criminals, nothing in my house is worth your life!"

Then they will get the idea

[edit on 11-2-2009 by infolurker]

Originally posted by Thistled
reply to post by pernox

 

Have you ever had a cactus in your face?

Obviously not.

Like I have said so many times before, remove the firearm and you increase the probabiity of survival.

Man where are the mathemeticians / statisticians on ATS when you need them?

[edit because my keyboard is f%&£ed, on 11/2/2009 by Thistled]

Right - when guns are taken out of the equation you increase the possibility of survival for all parties concerned. Unfortunately, you have to count the home invader(s) in this situation. Handling someone who has entered your home unbidden with anything short of lethal force is asking for trouble. The simple facts are that anyone in my house for any reason whom I did not invite is automatically suspect of wanting to perform harm to myself or my family. Therefore, they need to be stopped before they have the chance to do such harm. THEY are the ones who broke the law, and THEY are the ones who assumed the possible consequence of being scooped up by a ladle at the end of the whole mess.

As for the cactus, I'm not going to get suckered into a debate on that. I finished the "What improvised weapons can we find around here???" BS at about the same time I started Algebra II.

[edit on 11-2-2009 by pernox]

Normally I just try to have my say and leave other's to conduct the endless jousting without appearing to even recognise the validity of opposing arguements that seem's so prevalent on ATS these days, however....I fail to see how people cannot see the corelation between fewer gun related deaths in the UK per head than the US and the difference in gun laws.
It is so obvious to me!

The right to defend yourself or to protect your home and family is a different arguement.
The vast majority of burglars in the UK don't have guns so I don't need a gun to defend myself, pretty straight forward.
However, if I ever caught anyone in my house then I would smash their kneecaps to bits, stamp all over their head then nail them to the fence as warning to other's.

In the past I have been quite prepared to defend myself in any given situation and am quite willing and capable of continuing to do so; easier access to firearms will only result in their increased useage and more deaths.

reply to post by Freeborn


Thanks Freeborn, at last someone who understands common sense and simplicity, remove the gun from the equation and your imcrease the probability of survival. I think that's the 20th time I've typed that. lol.

How dare anyone call me a troll, it's what you always cry at the first sign of losing the argument.

Pathetic.

Originally posted by Thistled
You don't need a gun to protect your family. Ask any brit.

Err well you see. I am British. I believe we should have guns in order to protect ourselves. And many others do as well. So what you have just said there is about as flawed as you can get.

Originally posted by Thistled
reply to post by Freeborn

 

Thanks Freeborn, at last someone who understands common sense and simplicity, remove the gun from the equation and your imcrease the probability of survival. I think that's the 20th time I've typed that. lol.

How dare anyone call me a troll, it's what you always cry at the first sign of losing the argument.

Pathetic.

If you remove the gun from the equation you increase the probability of survival! What utter dross! Just because you keep typing the same old nonsense doesn't make it right. . . If a 18 stone burglar breaks into your home, unarmed, how are you going to protect yourself? For a start they've almost certainly been educated in the School Of Hard Knocks and will be only to keen for some have a go hero like you to give it a shot. You would almost certainly end up on life support or have a knife sticking out of some orifice! Either way you're going to end up on a mortuary trolley. And once you're done with what's he going to do to your family?However, if the same scenario unfolded and as he approached you pulled out a pistol then he has no option but to withdraw or be gunned down. Guns are a great leveller. And even if the burglar is himself armed he still has the nagging doubt in the back of his mind that you will get the drop on him. The gunshots will alert neighbours and he will eventually be caught. Guns give the average man a fighting chance.

Originally posted by Thistled
reply to post by Freeborn

 

Thanks Freeborn, at last someone who understands common sense and simplicity, remove the gun from the equation and your imcrease the probability of survival. I think that's the 20th time I've typed that. lol.

How dare anyone call me a troll, it's what you always cry at the first sign of losing the argument.

Pathetic.

You can type it until your fingers fall off, that doesn't make it a valid argument.

Again; in cases of home invasion, the VERY IDEA of having guns is so that there can be MORE death. Not less. You seem to be missing the fundamental point; someone who is foolhardy enough to invade someone else's property does so at the peril of their own livelihood, and I for one will be damn sure that he leaves feet first. Again, the very idea, the CORE of the matter, is to stop the threat permanently. Not until the Bobbies show up, or until you can duct tape the fool's wrists together and valiantly haul him off to the Police Station.. The whole point is to increase the amount of fatalities.

-edit- As for the troll commentary, it is not something that I "always" post - in fact, this is the first time in fifteen years of being in front of a keyboard that I've used the term derisively.

[edit on 12-2-2009 by pernox]

This is exactly the point. The purpose of defending yourself is not to extend the burglars life. Even without a gun if they are coming into my house I will do my best to land them in A&E. We want guns to defend ourselves and extend our lives not do that for those who are attacking us or our property.